Jags after Bentley as well

[AbeBeta]

Just below Bentley may be overstating a bit, but I'd take them anyway. Just not for big money.

agreed -- I think though that Hartwig is going to get a big contract somewhere.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

It seems like quite a few teams are interested.

not Dallas though

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I'm not sure we're unhappy with him either. Truthfully he's only played two full seasons after having a major injury problem. From what I've seen Johnson has the tools to be a decent center. He needs to polish his technique.

all I gotta say about Al JOhnson is this...

3-year rule for rookies

 

[Bob Sacamano]

I think he needs to polish off more pizza and devote a bit more time to building muscle as well. If he can put on 10 pounds that will balance out technique problems a little.

experience is the only thing that is going to balance out his technique problems, but a whole lot

 

[Rockytop6]

Just cause he did not give up the sack personally, doesn't mean is did a whole lot to help the play out. Johnson is the smallest big dude I have ever seen. The guy weights 300 lbs damn near and plays like hes at a buck 50. I just dont like Johnson, unless he gets mean and nasty and quits getting blown off the line.

His strengths, as I understand it, is he is smart, always makes the right calls, and he is agile and pulls well.

His weaknesses, are (1) he is not strong, and (2) he needs to refine his techniques.

Somebody posted that he should have the frame to carry another 10-15 pounds of muscle. You would think that with him being 6-5, but I read months ago that he didn't have the frame to get much bigger and that he would always be a little light. I don't know what that means.

You would also think that if he hit the weight room that he could get a lot stronger. Glover weighs 280 lbs and is one of the strongest men on the team.

Whatever his deficiencies are, I hope they get them corrected or they sign a dependable, solid center and use Al for back up.

 

[AbeBeta]

all I gotta say about Al JOhnson is this...

3-year rule for rookies

and next year is his third - BP has said that in various ways several times - calling AJ a rookie in '04 - calling him a 2nd year player last season. Pretty clear how Bill sees it

stop counting '03 -- because bill isn't

 

[burmafrd]

Johnson has maxe out as regards strength- BP HIMSELF said that. All he can do is refine his technique, and just how much more can he learn then he already has? Just how much more of a difference can it make?

 

[Alexander]

Johnson has maxe out as regards strength- BP HIMSELF said that. All he can do is refine his technique, and just how much more can he learn then he already has? Just how much more of a difference can it make?

Technique got Mark Stepnoski by for a very long time.

You can be strong as an ox at the center position and it might not mean anything in the long run. If he can play with better leverage and balance, he can be a very good center in this league.

I don't know if it was a product of poor scouting or not, but at this juncture his selection appears odd. When he was a rookie, Coach Parcells raved about him and then he got injured. He fought back from that and had a decent second year. This year, Coach Parcells wanted more bulk up the middle and that was solely because of Bledsoe's weakness. I don't think he is a bad player nearly as much as he is a poor fit for what we are trying to do right now. But that is no reason to drop him and give up, which is what we would be doing if we signed Bentley to play center.

 

[burmafrd]

Lets be realistic- just how much better can he get?

 

[Alexander]

Lets be realistic- just how much better can he get?

I think he has the potential to get much better than the armchair GMs around here give him credit to do, that's for sure.

 

[Manster68]

You know, there are some interesting slants being discussed here on this thread.

I recognize that technically this is Johnson's 4th season, but 3rd after the IR. I actually keep both in mind because even though this is his 3rd year physically, it is his 4th year mentally (the playbook and film study side).

One thing is for sure, Al MUST get stronger! I am convinced that a decent portion of the sacks given up by Tucker and Petitti were due to Bledsoe not being able to step up in the pocket. Regardless who is playing center, THIS MUST STOP! Precious first downs, time of posession, and points were lost partially due to Al Johnson. It was PART of the reason why Dallas could not close teams out. It is a cog in the system that must be taken care of.

I am not excusing Tucker or Petitti (although it is interesting how some are willing to give Al Johnson 3 years to develop and only one for Petitti).

Bottom line is folks, if Dallas doesn't nip this offensive line problem in the bud, then we fans could be staring at another 9-7 season.

 

[AbeBeta]

You know, there are some interesting slants being discussed here on this thread.

I recognize that technically this is Johnson's 4th season, but 3rd after the IR. I actually keep both in mind because even though this is his 3rd year physically, it is his 4th year mentally (the playbook and film study side).

I don't think the mental aspect is a problem for Johnson -- in his first year playing he clearly got it. In fact, I think that in camp in '03 he had already shown that he understood the mental side -- which is why BP made him the starter almost immediately. Contrast this to Gurode -- after 4 years Andre still makes serious mental errors at Center. In fact, in one game last year (the 2nd NY game I believe), Gurode got snaps at C and BP called him out for making 3 mental errors in something like 11 plays.

A point I've brought up several times regarding Johnson's strength is that he had a serious knee surgery -- as part of his recovery, he likely was encouraged to lose a lot of weight to keep pressure off the knee. So, we've got a guy who already stuggles with size getting smaller as part of his rehab. When he was cleared to workout again, he likely had a long way to go just to get back to 290ish. This means that his first full fledged, non injured off-season was before the '05 year. I'd like to see what he can do with a second, non-injured year in the program.

Another point folks bring up about Johnson is that Bill said something to the extent of "he can't get any bigger" - I think folks interpreted this as meaning that he was NEVER going to be able to get bigger. However, if you listen to Bill's PCs you'll find that he generally does not talk in broad terms about player's futures. His comments likely meant that Al wasn't going to get any bigger during the season. That comment may have reflected a) Bill's frustration with Johnson's off-season progress, b) the fact that Bill doesn't want guys trying to bulk up during the season as this uses up too much of their energy for playing, and c) that Al was going to need to focus on his technique because he isn't going to overpower people.

My take is this. We have a center with all mental tools you want. He needs to put on 10-15 pounds if he can. But most importantly, he need to become a better technical player.

As I see it, Al's biggest area of improvement is technique -- and that's an area that you CAN expect a player to get better at.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I don't think the mental aspect is a problem for Johnson -- in his first year playing he clearly got it. In fact, I think that in camp in '03 he had already shown that he understood the mental side -- which is why BP made him the starter almost immediately. Contrast this to Gurode -- after 4 years Andre still makes serious mental errors at Center. In fact, in one game last year (the 2nd NY game I believe), Gurode got snaps at C and BP called him out for making 3 mental errors in something like 11 plays.

A point I've brought up several times regarding Johnson's strength is that he had a serious knee surgery -- as part of his recovery, he likely was encouraged to lose a lot of weight to keep pressure off the knee. So, we've got a guy who already stuggles with size getting smaller as part of his rehab. When he was cleared to workout again, he likely had a long way to go just to get back to 290ish. This means that his first full fledged, non injured off-season was before the '05 year. I'd like to see what he can do with a second, non-injured year in the program.

Another point folks bring up about Johnson is that Bill said something to the extent of "he can't get any bigger" - I think folks interpreted this as meaning that he was NEVER going to be able to get bigger. However, if you listen to Bill's PCs you'll find that he generally does not talk in broad terms about player's futures. His comments likely meant that Al wasn't going to get any bigger during the season. That comment may have reflected a) Bill's frustration with Johnson's off-season progress, b) the fact that Bill doesn't want guys trying to bulk up during the season as this uses up too much of their energy for playing, and c) that Al was going to need to focus on his technique because he isn't going to overpower people.

My take is this. We have a center with all mental tools you want. He needs to put on 10-15 pounds if he can. But most importantly, he need to become a better technical player.

As I see it, Al's biggest area of improvement is technique -- and that's an area that you CAN expect a player to get better at.

Honestly I think we can expect an improved Johnson, Petitti and Tucker next season when it comes to size and technique. Will it be enough? I don't know but I do expect them to be better.

 

[Alexander]

Honestly I think we can expect an improved Johnson, Petitti and Tucker next season when it comes to size and technique. Will it be enough? I don't know but I do expect them to be better.

I agree.

There was a sense of panic about that unit after Adams went down and it took only a few quality opponents for it to show.

It just seemed like all of the players lost their composure late in the year and if you look at their attitudes, they were completely different after the second Giants game. That one left a mark.

We got it back against the Panthers, but that performance against the Rams was utterly sickening.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I agree.

There was a sense of panic about that unit after Adams went down and it took only a few quality opponents for it to show.

It just seemed like all of the players lost their composure late in the year and if you look at their attitudes, they were completely different after the second Giants game. That one left a mark.

We got it back against the Panthers, but that performance against the Rams was utterly sickening.

The offensive line was "snake bit" last year. Rivera's herniated disk... Roger's flaking out on us... Adams blown ACL... The constant stream of injuries to Petitti. Just a tough year for whatever reason.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

I agree.

There was a sense of panic about that unit after Adams went down and it took only a few quality opponents for it to show.

It just seemed like all of the players lost their composure late in the year and if you look at their attitudes, they were completely different after the second Giants game. That one left a mark.

We got it back against the Panthers, but that performance against the Rams was utterly sickening.

The blocking by the tightends and the fullback was spotty at best all season and downright lousy at worst. Improvement at both positions would instanstly make this line better.

 

[AbeBeta]

I agree.

There was a sense of panic about that unit after Adams went down and it took only a few quality opponents for it to show.

It just seemed like all of the players lost their composure late in the year and if you look at their attitudes, they were completely different after the second Giants game. That one left a mark.

We got it back against the Panthers, but that performance against the Rams was utterly sickening.

Those games told us a ton. First, they confirmed that Gurode is just a tease. He'll give you a good game every so often then go back to sucking. Second, Petitti is a fighter but the combination of being a rookie, being worn down, and facing some of the league's best pass rushers week after week was too much for him -- really, it would be too expect any rookie to do well under those conditions. Third, LA can bring it but only when he wants to -- which is not often enough for me. Fourth, Tucker has no business being a starter - there is a reason he lost the RT battle.

 

[AbeBeta]

The blocking by the tightends and the fullback was spotty at best all season and downright lousy at worst. Improvement at both positions would instanstly make this line better.

Don't mention fullback - you'll start another "we should have never let Jamar Martin get away" thread.

 

[burmafrd]

Someone keeps mentioning Johnson and a knee injury- I thought the only one he had was the first one his rookie year- did he have another?

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Don't mention fullback - you'll start another "we should have never let Jamar Martin get away" thread.

LOL!

True.