Jahmyr Gibbs at WR vs Zay Flowers

[xwalker]

I'm not saying that Gibbs would be a better WR than Flowers.
- My question is would he be a better draft value than Flowers due to his WR-ish receiving ability + RB ability.

Jahmyr Gibbs
From Brugler:
Pacing and burst as a route runner make him a tough one-on-one cover.
Lined as a WR (not in the backfield) on 26.4 percent of his passing snaps in 2022.
Plucks away from his body with reliable hands (one drop on 52 targets in 2022).



Receiving Stats Flowers/Gibbs:

Player​	Years​	Rec/Year​	Yards/Year​	Total Rec​	Total Rec Yards​
Zay Flowers​	4​	50.0​	764.0​	200​	3056​
Jahmyr Gibbs​	3​	34.7​	405.7​	104​	1217​

RB Receiving Stats (sorted by yards):

Rank​	Player​	REC​	YDS​	AVG​	TD​
2​	Jahmyr Gibbs​	104​	1217​	11.7​	8​
11​	Eric Gray​	99​	827​	8.4​	5​
1​	Bijan Robinson​	60​	805​	13.4​	8​
3​	Zach Charbonnet​	75​	589​	7.9​	0​
5​	Tyjae Spears​	48​	564​	11.8​	3​
4​	Devon Achane​	65​	554​	8.5​	5​
12​	Chase Brown​	58​	521​	9​	3​
6​	Tank Bigsby​	62​	448​	7.2​	0​
7​	Roschon Johnson​	56​	420​	7.5​	3​
9​	Israel Abanikanda​	38​	354​	9.3​	3​
10​	Zach Evans​	30​	325​	10.8​	2​
8​	Kendre Miller​	29​	229​	7.9​	1​

​	Jahmyr Gibbs​	Zay Flowers​
Height​	5091​	5092​
Weight​	199​	182​
Hand​	09 1/4​	09 1/4​
Arm​	30 1/2​	29 1/4​
Wingspan​	74 1/8​	72 1/4​
40 Yard Dash (ET)​	4.36​	4.42​
10 Yard (ET)​	1.51​	1.49​
Vertical Jump​	33 1/2​	35 1/2​

 

[cnuball21]

No… he caught a million dump offs out of the backfield. Did not lineup in the slot hardly ever.

 

[beware_d-ware]

Everyone always thinks they're gonna throw to that cool new web-back RB. But how many teams actually do?

IMO, it's more of a QB thing than an offensive scheme thing, or an RB talent thing. IE, Tom Brady loved throwing wheel routes to running backs. You give him Kevin Faulk or James White, he's a happy man. But if the best you've got is Leonard Fournette, he's still willing to target the hell out of Leonard Fournette. And an RB knocked in college for his receiving ability winds up with 70 catches.

On the other hand, you give Patrick Mahomes a 1st round receiving back in CEH, and Mahomes is just gonna ignore him and keep hunting for big plays downfield. That's his style.

Heck, Joe Burrow just walked into a Bengals offense with Mixon and threw him 60 receptions last year. It's wasn't all CEH generating those college numbers.

I have no hard data on this, but I would love for PFF or Football Outsiders or someone to commission a study. Do RB catches correlate more closely with the player's talent, or with the QB's history of targeting his backs?

Anyway, dragging it back to the Cowboys. Looking it up, we target our backs at a league average rate, and I've never really seen Dak as favoring his running backs. I just don't think we're the right team to get the most out of Gibbs.

 

[AsthmaField]

I’m not gonna lie… I really want Gibbs in Dallas. I think him and Pollard would cause all kind of problems for defenses. And yeah, I think Gibbs could do whatever you ask him to do catching the ball.

Because of all Gibbs can do and how smooth he is, I’d rather have him than Flowers, yes.

That’s not to say that I don’t like Flowers. I do.

 

[xwalker]

No… he caught a million dump offs out of the backfield. Did not lineup in the slot hardly ever.

Lined as a WR (not in the backfield) on 26.4 percent of his passing snaps in 2022.

 

[America's Cowboy]

I love Zay Flowers at WR, hence why I didn't agree with taking Jahmyr Gibbs for receiving over Zay Flowers. But, after watching some highlights and looking at Gibbs' stats, he definitely could become another Alvin Kamara but much faster.

 

[xwalker]

Everyone always thinks they're gonna throw to that cool new web-back RB. But how many teams actually do?

IMO, it's more of a QB thing than an offensive scheme thing, or an RB talent thing. IE, Tom Brady loved throwing wheel routes to running backs. You give him Kevin Faulk or James White, he's a happy man. But if the best you've got is Leonard Fournette, he's still willing to target the hell out of Leonard Fournette. And an RB knocked in college for his receiving ability winds up with 70 catches.

On the other hand, you give Patrick Mahomes a 1st round receiving back in CEH, and Mahomes is just gonna ignore him and keep hunting for big plays downfield. That's his style.

Heck, Joe Burrow just walked into a Bengals offense with Mixon and threw him 60 receptions last year. It's wasn't all CEH generating those college numbers.

I have no hard data on this, but I would love for PFF or Football Outsiders or someone to commission a study. Do RB catches correlate more closely with the player's talent, or with the QB's history of targeting his backs?

Anyway, dragging it back to the Cowboys. Looking it up, we target our backs at a league average rate, and I've never really seen Dak as favoring his running backs. I just don't think we're the right team to get the most out of Gibbs.

Green Bay 2022:
Catches / Yards
Slot WR: 34 / 417
Top RB: 59 / 395

 

[gimmesix]

I'm not saying that Gibbs would be a better WR than Flowers.
- My question is would he be a better draft value than Flowers due to his WR-ish receiving ability + RB ability.

Jahmyr Gibbs
From Brugler:
Pacing and burst as a route runner make him a tough one-on-one cover.
Lined as a WR (not in the backfield) on 26.4 percent of his passing snaps in 2022.
Plucks away from his body with reliable hands (one drop on 52 targets in 2022).



Receiving Stats Flowers/Gibbs:

Player​	Years​	Rec/Year​	Yards/Year​	Total Rec​	Total Rec Yards​
Zay Flowers​	4​	50.0​	764.0​	200​	3056​
Jahmyr Gibbs​	3​	34.7​	405.7​	104​	1217​

RB Receiving Stats (sorted by yards):

Rank​	Player​	REC​	YDS​	AVG​	TD​
2​	Jahmyr Gibbs​	104​	1217​	11.7​	8​
11​	Eric Gray​	99​	827​	8.4​	5​
1​	Bijan Robinson​	60​	805​	13.4​	8​
3​	Zach Charbonnet​	75​	589​	7.9​	0​
5​	Tyjae Spears​	48​	564​	11.8​	3​
4​	Devon Achane​	65​	554​	8.5​	5​
12​	Chase Brown​	58​	521​	9​	3​
6​	Tank Bigsby​	62​	448​	7.2​	0​
7​	Roschon Johnson​	56​	420​	7.5​	3​
9​	Israel Abanikanda​	38​	354​	9.3​	3​
10​	Zach Evans​	30​	325​	10.8​	2​
8​	Kendre Miller​	29​	229​	7.9​	1​

​	Jahmyr Gibbs​	Zay Flowers​
Height​	5091​	5092​
Weight​	199​	182​
Hand​	09 1/4​	09 1/4​
Arm​	30 1/2​	29 1/4​
Wingspan​	74 1/8​	72 1/4​
40 Yard Dash (ET)​	4.36​	4.42​
10 Yard (ET)​	1.51​	1.49​
Vertical Jump​	33 1/2​	35 1/2​

I would draft Gibbs over Flowers in a minute. It's tough to know if a small receiver like him is going to play big or become Tavon Austin. And we need a running back to pair with Pollard worse. Can even use them both on the field at the same time some because of their receiving ability.

 

[Pass2Run]

I've cooled off on Gibbs, but I could be talked into it, if I knew the person knew he would be so much better than Evans, Abinikanda, McBride, etc.

Personally, my #1 first round target would be Quinten Johnston. I think the league, and media, is sleeping on him lately, especially if he were the #3 and came in here with Cooks, Lamb, and Johnston.. It would be sick.

Then again, we probably need a TE more, or maybe we don't.. maybe we roll with our guys, and grab a TE like Tucker Kraft later on.. I think if you spend a 2 on a TE, you have to hit on him. But I have no doubt they've got some nice TE talent in round 2-3.

 

[Chuck 54]

Flowers in round one, I’m happy.
Gibbs in round 2-3, I’m happy.
Gibbs in round 1 would be a colossal F-up!

 

[Pass2Run]

I love Zay Flowers at WR, hence why I didn't agree with taking Jahmyr Gibbs for receiving over Zay Flowers. But, after watching some highlights and looking at Gibbs' stats, he definitely could become another Alvin Kamara but much faster.

Yeah, his receiving ability is why I think there's a chance, he has a better career than Robinson. I mean, he would be a good fit. Not sure what the Cowboys would do there, but I'd trust them if they went for that.

Is he better than Felix Jones?

I think likely if he can stay healthy in the NFL. We need guys who can get open in the passing game, and he would be a nice security blanket. It's the one part of his game that is stronger than Bijan's.

Look at his run at 4:47... Wow.

Gibbs has some Marshall Faulk in him for sure...And I see the receiving ability, to where you could actually line him out wide, likely in the slot, or motioning out from the backfield, or around, etc.

He's a nice piece to move around on the offense.

But you know the Cowboys . . . can he block?

 

[xwalker]

I've cooled off on Gibbs, but I could be talked into it, if I knew the person knew he would be so much better than Evans, Abinikanda, McBride, etc.

Personally, my #1 first round target would be Quinten Johnston. I think the league, and media, is sleeping on him lately, especially if he were the #3 and came in here with Cooks, Lamb, and Johnston.. It would be sick.

Then again, we probably need a TE more, or maybe we don't.. maybe we roll with our guys, and grab a TE like Tucker Kraft later on.. I think if you spend a 2 on a TE, you have to hit on him. But I have no doubt they've got some nice TE talent in round 2-3.

I really wanted to like Quinten Johnston but he just doesn't catch contested passes.

He has terrific quickness for his size; although, not as fast as expected (4.51).

 

[Havic]

Flowers in round one, I’m happy.
Gibbs in round 2-3, I’m happy.
Gibbs in round 1 would be a colossal F-up!

Yup, but I think Gibbs is a high two.

 

[xwalker]

I would draft Gibbs over Flowers in a minute. It's tough to know if a small receiver like him is going to play big or become Tavon Austin. And we need a running back to pair with Pollard worse. Can even use them both on the field at the same time some because of their receiving ability.

Tavon Austin is a good cautionary tale.

His college highlights were as good as just about any player I've even seen.

Even just watching a single game of him in college was better than most player's highlight reels.

 

[ThatJerryKid]

If you’re planning on signing Pollard to an extension, I hate it. If you’re planning on letting Pollard walk after this year, I love it.

 

[ghst187]

I’m not gonna lie… I really want Gibbs in Dallas. I think him and Pollard would cause all kind of problems for defenses. And yeah, I think Gibbs could do whatever you ask him to do catching the ball.

Because of all Gibbs can do and how smooth he is, I’d rather have him than Flowers, yes.

That’s not to say that I don’t like Flowers. I do.

100% agree with this.
I think Gibbs is going to be dynamite…weapon from multiple angles. Dumb to pass on him about anywhere honestly. I think he’s one of the best players in the entire draft.

 

[Pass2Run]

Anyway, yeah, if you want a totally safe pick, and Bijan is gone, I'd say Gibbs would be it..

 

[Pass2Run]

If you’re planning on signing Pollard to an extension, I hate it. If you’re planning on letting Pollard walk after this year, I love it.

I wouldn't mind paying one back, while another is on his rookie deal. It's always good to have a duo.

I'm probably reaching for a WR this draft. lol. But I can see them going with Gibbs, too.

This would be my guy, personally. I'm looking for he or Flowers.. and if not, Robinson or Gibbs....I'd draft Johnston in the 1st. Duggan in the 5th, 6th...

Johnston is going to be good in the NFL..

 

[xwalker]

I’m not gonna lie… I really want Gibbs in Dallas. I think him and Pollard would cause all kind of problems for defenses. And yeah, I think Gibbs could do whatever you ask him to do catching the ball.

Because of all Gibbs can do and how smooth he is, I’d rather have him than Flowers, yes.

That’s not to say that I don’t like Flowers. I do.

PFT has a list embedded in an article about every team. Article link: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/04/05/2023-nfl-draft-visits-tracker/

Here is the Dallas list:
Dallas Cowboys.
.
.
.
Illinois cornerback Devon Witherspoon

@AsthmaField

 

[cnuball21]

Lined as a WR (not in the backfield) on 26.4 percent of his passing snaps in 2022.

Cool. And he caught 44 balls total. How many were from the slot?

TP was a freaking WR in college and we barely throw him the ball. You think Gibbs is going to come in here and be better value than a legit 1st round WR prospect like Flowers ? He’s a good pass catching complimentary back.

It’s a hard, firm heck no.