Jerry Jones hit the nail on the head

[Blackrain]

Yeah, before this fiasco I was a Campbell fan. Now, I don't know. This was a major clusterfudge and simply unnecessary. If you can't beat teams playing them, get better players, or schemes or whatever. Playing 3 card monte in an NFL game is chicken poop, as well as being foolish and lacking class.

I'm very disappointed in Dan Campbell as I really liked him and his old school way of coaching now it just seems like he's another smacked glass in the mold of belichick

 

[kskboys]

I'm very disappointed in Dan Campbell as I really liked him and his old school way of coaching now it just seems like he's another smacked glass in the mold of belichick

Yeah, I'm still reserving judgment, but this reeks of grade school behavior.

 

[Blackrain]

Yeah, I'm still reserving judgment, but this reeks of grade school behavior.

I'm really trying not to be negative or put my tin foil hat on but in today's world with all the high-tech devices to communicate things on and off the field how can you possibly get that wrong on national television at the end of the game in the most important moment.
I believe there's a headset in the quarterbacks helmet and somebody on defense and the coaches and I would think the refs have some type of a way to communicate to all these people how was everybody involved in the most important moment of the game not told exactly who was going to be eligible.

I swear I think the rough touch games I played in my 40s were officiated better than this crap we watch today.

 

[Starstruck22]

It was only scummy if Dan planned to shame officials into picking up the flag by pointing at them and telling them they were at fault.

We dont know if this is the case or not.

Trying to trick Dallas seems fair...as long as the plan was "Your fault you werent paying attention"

Seems like Dan's plan was too complicated and Dallas simply did what they were suppose to do and guarded the guy designated.

No ifs and or buts, Campbell planned and devised to subvert the rules, no other possibility. It is what it is.

 

[OmerV]

The problem though, is that the rule about declaring eligible receivers is specifically for the purpose of fair play. Campbell was trying to circumvent the whole concept of the rule. In my mind, that's cheating.

I think it's pretty common for teams to try and circumvent the spirit of rules while technically staying on the legal side of them. An example we see frequently and from every team is having WR's set a pick on the DB covering another WR to allow the other WR to get open. Every team has plays that where a WR doesn't necessarily block a DB to take him out of a play, so they are technically within the rule, but they move in very close like they are going to do that, which congests an area where the DB will run into him or another DB and they effectively end up with the same result.

 

[Runwildboys]

I think it's pretty common for teams to try and circumvent the spirit of rules while technically staying on the legal side of them. An example we see frequently and from every team is having WR's set a pick on the DB covering another WR to allow the other WR to get open. Every team has plays that where a WR doesn't necessarily block a DB to take him out of a play, so they are technically within the rule, but they move in very close like they are going to do that, which congests an area where the DB will run into him or another DB and they effectively end up with the same result.

And nobody complains when a flag is thrown for a pick.

 

[OmerV]

And nobody complains when a flag is thrown for a pick.

That's true if it's easy to see an actual pick in clear violation of the rules. Same would apply if it was easy to see that only one player told the ref he was declaring, and it wasn't who they threw to.

I'm talking about picks that do not result in a flag because the offense finds a way to effectively set a pick without technically violating the rule. That was the Lions intent, to not get a flag by finding a way to disguise who was declaring as eligible without technically violating the rule.

 

[Starstruck22]

I think it's pretty common for teams to try and circumvent the spirit of rules while technically staying on the legal side of them. An example we see frequently and from every team is having WR's set a pick on the DB covering another WR to allow the other WR to get open. Every team has plays that where a WR doesn't necessarily block a DB to take him out of a play, so they are technically within the rule, but they move in very close like they are going to do that, which congests an area where the DB will run into him or another DB and they effectively end up with the same result.

I agree 100% that rub plays are designed to prevent defenders from covering receivers. I already mentioned that as a concern. But there are legal rub plays within the line of scrimmage perfectly legal. But honestly that it is not a valid argument for designing plays that have no other purpose than to subvert a rule like the reporting rule. If you could tell me theres was some other purpose for the play than to either confuse the refs or to deprive Dallas of knowing who is the eligible receiver, it would not be a problem.. I also guess there would be incentive to design illegal rub plays if the officials were too stupid to or incompetent to notice them, but it would still not be ethical to design them. Designing plays to subvert rules is unethical, sleazy, and unscrupulous and there is no argument around this.

 

[Starstruck22]

That's true if it's easy to see an actual pick in clear violation of the rules. Same would apply if it was easy to see that only one player told the ref he was declaring, and it wasn't who they threw to.

I'm talking about picks that do not result in a flag because the offense finds a way to effectively set a pick without technically violating the rule. That was the Lions intent, to not get a flag by finding a way to disguise who was declaring as eligible without technically violating the rule.

Bingo

 

[Starstruck22]

I think it's pretty common for teams to try and circumvent the spirit of rules while technically staying on the legal side of them. An example we see frequently and from every team is having WR's set a pick on the DB covering another WR to allow the other WR to get open. Every team has plays that where a WR doesn't necessarily block a DB to take him out of a play, so they are technically within the rule, but they move in very close like they are going to do that, which congests an area where the DB will run into him or another DB and they effectively end up with the same result.

Technically being within the rule is being within the rule. Designing an illegal pick is not. This is not rocket science people. And there are ways like you suggest to clog areas that don’t violate the rule.

 

[Starstruck22]

And nobody complains when a flag is thrown for a pick.

Why would they If it is illegal?

 

[Starstruck22]

I'm very disappointed in Dan Campbell as I really liked him and his old school way of coaching now it just seems like he's another smacked glass in the mold of belichick

I do believe that the play in question reeks of sociopathy and we have not seen the last of it. And Detroit fans are pretending like they got robbed. Yes they got robbed when they hired Campbell.

 

[Starstruck22]

I could care less who reported and who didn't in the multitude of guys the Lions sent to talk to the ref.
All the Cowboys needed to be concerned with was who they were told was eligible and that was number 70 over the PA system
If for some reason the lions were not happy with who the referee announced as eligible over the PA system they had every opportunity to go over to the refs and change it and have it announced properly but they left it to try and be sneaky and it backfired on them.

The Cowboys covered the player that was announced the Lions threw it to a player that was not announced so the Lions are in the wrong for not making sure the player they were going to make eligible was announced to the defense.

Bingo. But it does not mean that Dallas could not have bee robbed of the two seed if it had worked to confuse the refs. It did not thank God. But Campbells sociopathy’s has tarnished Brad Allens reputation which makes me sick. When Allen was actually the hero in my book.

 

[OmerV]

I agree 100% that rub plays are designed to prevent defenders from covering receivers. I already mentioned that as a concern. But there are legal rub plays within the line of scrimmage perfectly legal. But honestly that it is not a valid argument for designing plays that have no other purpose than to subvert a rule like the reporting rule. If you could tell me theres was some other purpose for the play than to either confuse the refs or to deprive Dallas of knowing who is the eligible receiver, it would not be a problem.. I also guess there would be incentive to design illegal rub plays if the officials were too stupid to or incompetent to notice them, but it would still not be ethical to design them. Designing plays to subvert rules is unethical, sleazy, and unscrupulous and there is no argument around this.

I never said there was a purpose other than to find a way to deceive the defense while technically not violating the rule. That was clearly the intent.

 

[OmerV]

Technically being within the rule is being within the rule. Designing an illegal pick is not. This is not rocket science people. And there are ways like you suggest to clog areas that don’t violate the rule.

I never said technically being within the rule isn't being within the rule. The conversation you came into was about the spirit of a rule, and what I was saying is that there are examples of teams finding legal ways to get around the spirit of a rule.

And I wasn't talking about designing an illegal pick, and I didn't saying clogging the area to screen off a DB from coverage violated the rule. In fact, I said it didn't.

 

[Blackrain]

Bingo. But it does not mean that Dallas could not have bee robbed of the two seed if it had worked to confuse the refs. It did not thank God. But Campbells sociopathy’s has tarnished Brad Allens reputation which makes me sick. When Allen was actually the hero in my book.

What would be really nice to clear this whole thing up was if the league investigated it fully found out who was guilty assigned blame and punished the guilty.

That way there would be some type of closure to this whole incident.

We wouldn't have to hear how Detroit got robbed and how the refs gave us special treatment and Alan would have his good name back but the league has to be proactive and get this done.

 

[OmerV]

What would be really nice to clear this whole thing up was if the league investigated it fully found out who was guilty assigned blame and punished the guilty.

That way there would be some type of closure to this whole incident.

We wouldn't have to hear how Detroit got robbed and how the refs gave us special treatment and Alan would have his good name back but the league has to be proactive and get this done.

That would be a bad precedent because it would give standing to any team that wants to complain and expects an investigation about a call on the field. The NFL couldn't justify saying they are making an exception to policy & practice in this instance only and in no other.

Additionally, if it was determined the refs screwed up that would only increase the noise about how the Lions got screwed and people would condemn the NFL for not intervening.

Best thing for the NFL to do is let this fade into the past to whatever degree it will. The less it's talked about, more it gets put in the past.

 

[Starstruck22]

I never said there was a purpose other than to find a way to deceive the defense while technically not violating the rule. That was clearly the intent.

You are 100% wrong. The purpose was to subvert the rule. What is this technical bs???? If the intent was to deprive Dallas the right to know who the eligible receiver is by hook or crook it is an attempt to subvert the rule. Why else all the bs. Detroit has to report and the ref has to inform Dallas. Why else the three lineman shenanigans except to confuse the refs (not dallas) because Dallas covered the reporting lineman and not Decker. If you cannot grasp all of this, then there are none so blind as those that refuse to see.

 

[Starstruck22]

I never said technically being within the rule isn't being within the rule. The conversation you came into was about the spirit of a rule, and what I was saying is that there are examples of teams finding legal ways to get around the spirit of a rule.

And I wasn't talking about designing an illegal pick, and I didn't saying clogging the area to screen off a DB from coverage violated the rule. In fact, I said it didn't.

I have no clue what you are talking about with the “technical“ mumbo jumbo. All baloney and nonsense. Purposefully trying to prevent Dallas from knowing who the eligible is is rule subversion. Technical this technical that is all crap.

 

[zrinkill]

Jerry Jones has probably never held a nail or hammer in his entire pampered life.