CFZ Jonathan Hankins vs A'Shawn Robinson

[kskboys]

Imagine Robinson playing the Red Bryant role in this scheme.

Bryant broke out when Carroll moved him to DE. He was like having a big coat at end. No one could run to that side, especially w/ a top 5 NT in Mebane manning the middle. That was at 4-3 DE, btw. Bryant had been underwhelming at DT.

SEA lost that super bowl edge when they released him long w/ Clinton McDonald and Chris Clemons. The strength of that team was not the legion of boom, it was a very deep and talented DLine.

 

[EenonyMoose]

Bryant broke out when Carroll moved him to DE. He was like having a big coat at end. No one could run to that side, especially w/ a top 5 NT in Mebane manning the middle. That was at 4-3 DE, btw. Bryant had been underwhelming at DT.

SEA lost that super bowl edge when they released him long w/ Clinton McDonald and Chris Clemons. The strength of that team was not the legion of boom, it was a very deep and talented DLine.

Agreed. Quinn talked about trying the same thing with Brent Urban but it never quite worked out. Golston is playing some of that role now, but having a bigger body lining up across from the tackle makes it easier for that 5-tech to get knockback and take away running lanes in lighter boxes (meaning, for example, more Donovan Wilson and less of whichever LB is going to play next to LVE). If he’s healthy, Robinson could be perfect in that role and as a rotational A-gap defender along with Hankins and probably a rookie.

The thing is that he’s only a few months removed from meniscus surgery. I wouldn’t expect him to sign somewhere until after the draft, so it I imagine it all depends on what happens there. Dallas has met with Gervon Dexter from Florida and Jacquelin Roy from LSU, who could probably give you some of that disruptive inside/outside two-gap play as well. Those guys are way more raw though.

The only other available FA I could see playing some of that role is Chris Wormley from the Steelers, but he’s pretty redundant with Golston. I’m envisioning a guy like Robinson opening things up for Micah similar to how Dan Quinn would line up Cliff Avril either next to or behind Red Bryant in 2013. Good luck with that. If you double Hankins, LVE makes the play. If you double Robinson, it goes straight to Parsons.

 

[kskboys]

Agreed. Quinn talked about trying the same thing with Brent Urban but it never quite worked out. Golston is playing some of that role now, but having a bigger body lining up across from the tackle makes it easier for that 5-tech to get knockback and take away running lanes in lighter boxes (meaning, for example, more Donovan Wilson and less of whichever LB is going to play next to LVE). If he’s healthy, Robinson could be perfect in that role and as a rotational A-gap defender along with Hankins and probably a rookie.

The thing is that he’s only a few months removed from meniscus surgery. I wouldn’t expect him to sign somewhere until after the draft, so it I imagine it all depends on what happens there. Dallas has met with Gervon Dexter from Florida and Jacquelin Roy from LSU, who could probably give you some of that disruptive inside/outside two-gap play as well. Those guys are way more raw though.

The only other available FA I could see playing some of that role is Chris Wormley from the Steelers, but he’s pretty redundant with Golston. I’m envisioning a guy like Robinson opening things up for Micah similar to how Dan Quinn would line up Cliff Avril either next to or behind Red Bryant in 2013. Good luck with that. If you double Hankins, LVE makes the play. If you double Robinson, it goes straight to Parsons.

The only way to have a top 5 D w/o a really good NT is to have two top 5 DT's. And that's almost impossible to accomplish.

Playing w/o a NT has been tried many many many times, and has failed consistently. I remember when the Raiders were all excited to play Kelly alongside Seymour at DT. It failed miserably, even though they were both good.

 

[gtb1943]

Robinson is better, but not enough to pay the price.

 

[ChuckA1]

The only way to have a top 5 D w/o a really good NT is to have two top 5 DT's. And that's almost impossible to accomplish.

Playing w/o a NT has been tried many many many times, and has failed consistently. I remember when the Raiders were all excited to play Kelly alongside Seymour at DT. It failed miserably, even though they were both good.

Buddy, I'm about to give up thinking the Cowboys understand the DT position and its importance to a top five defense. It's like they think they can rewrite recent history or something. Ridiculous

 

[kskboys]

Buddy, I'm about to give up thinking the Cowboys understand the DT position and its importance to a top five defense. It's like they think they can rewrite recent history or something. Ridiculous

Well, the thought on this board is that you need a big fatty in the middle and any big fatty will do. Most don't comprehend that you need a guy who is generally short of build for leverage sake and a guy who can push the pocket back and move side to side to make plays. It's not just holding your ground, that's only part of it. Jerry has no clue about this at all, and doesn't even understand that most taller guys get pushed around in the middle.

Jerry also seems to have no comprehension of how much a good NT makes everyone on that D better. It really is a snowball effect. Even after seeing the difference Hankins made last season, I doubt if he even has an inkling as to what he saw. He was prolly watching the CBs the whole time and thought they're the ones who made the run D better!!!!!!

 

[gtb1943]

Well, the thought on this board is that you need a big fatty in the middle and any big fatty will do. Most don't comprehend that you need a guy who is generally short of build for leverage sake and a guy who can push the pocket back and move side to side to make plays. It's not just holding your ground, that's only part of it. Jerry has no clue about this at all, and doesn't even understand that most taller guys get pushed around in the middle.

Jerry also seems to have no comprehension of how much a good NT makes everyone on that D better. It really is a snowball effect. Even after seeing the difference Hankins made last season, I doubt if he even has an inkling as to what he saw. He was prolly watching the CBs the whole time and thought they're the ones who made the run D better!!!!!!

If I remember correctly Jethro was a guard for Arkansas. You would think someone who played on the interior of the O line would appreciate a tough DT.

A squat fireplug who is very strong and can push back a center is the minimum needed; if he has good lateral agility even better.

 

[Kwyn]

People say stuff about the draft to cover for the shortcomings of the front office in FA at fixing clear needs.

To defend Jerry/Stephen's inaction in FA they'll just say this is a strong draft for X implying that the problem will get fixed then. It happens every year.

If we are counting on the draft solving our DT issues, then that's one risky strategy.

What inaction? We’ve had the busiest and best FA period in years.

You know what does happen every year?

Posters find some reason, any reason, to slag the front office.

If the Cowboys had signed every premier free agent, made amazing trades and had received A+++++ marks from every media grader out there, we would have some people here complaining that we didn’t bring in a 3rd punter to challenge Anger.

 

[blueblood70]

Buddy, I'm about to give up thinking the Cowboys understand the DT position and its importance to a top five defense. It's like they think they can rewrite recent history or something. Ridiculous

and yet we were top 7 last year even with all those injuries and ended up graded better then then the eagles in the run game. Our run define was 4.4 YPC theirs was 4.6 we gave up 9 tds they gave up 14, yards about the same.. i realize the need but we do a very good defense the eagles value the DT so much it keeps being talked about, but our D ended up closely ranked with some of those bad games in the middle of the season.

we will be top 5 without a premier dt this year, the d improved already IMO. Book it.

BTW this used to be narrative about Safety, they finally got a safety group that is very good. thank god this place wanted berry, Thomas and Jamal Adams and those would have been mistakes, they did the right thing..

they have not ignored it just not picked the correct ones yet.

 

[shabazz]

I think sometimes people say stuff just to say it. Is there some draft beat that claims it's good? I see a C grade.

It’s sad but I’ve seen several supposedly legitimate draft forecasting sites and seen them state two very diametrically opposed opinions on the DT situation…….I know that nobody is perfect but I didn’t expect it too be so different takes on that.

Just have to evaluate these things for oneself if one has time to follow college ball……but some of us already don’t have enough hours in the day.

 

[gtb1943]

and yet we were top 7 last year even with all those injuries and ended up graded better then then the eagles in the run game. Our run define was 4.4 YPC theirs was 4.6 we gave up 9 tds they gave up 14, yards about the same.. i realize the need but we do a very good defense the eagles value the DT so much it keeps being talked about, but our D ended up closely ranked with some of those bad games in the middle of the season.

we will be top 5 without a premier dt this year, the d improved already IMO. Book it.

BTW this used to be narrative about Safety, they finally got a safety group that is very good. thank god this place wanted berry, Thomas and Jamal Adams and those would have been mistakes, they did the right thing..

they have not ignored it just not picked the correct ones yet.

Book it = The Clown Show will throw a late rd pick at the DT and that is all; and you will call it a genius move.

 

[kskboys]

It’s sad but I’ve seen several supposedly legitimate draft forecasting sites and seen them state two very diametrically opposed opinions on the DT situation…….I know that nobody is perfect but I didn’t expect it too be so different takes on that.

Just have to evaluate these things for oneself if one has time to follow college ball……but some of us already don’t have enough hours in the day.

It'd be interesting to see why some draft site claims this DT group is deep. W/ the off field antics of Jalen, there is no DT in this draft w/o huge question marks.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

We have a serviceable starter at every position now, but in order to take our roster to the next level we need upgrade some of our starters. Those positions include:

Tight end
Center
Nose tackle
3 Tech
4th wide receiver in four wide sets

 

[AKATheRake]

There is one blue chipper, Carter. That is it.

I say it is a weak draft for DTs knowing that the experts say it is. They know a ton more than I do.

That's the 5th rated DT in this draft.

 

[kskboys]

That's the 5th rated DT in this draft.

Mazi is too straightlinish. Has all the signs of a decent rotational player. 4th rounder.

 

[Jarntt]

Mazi is too straightlinish. Has all the signs of a decent rotational player. 4th rounder.

I don't understand what you mean by that comment. For a guy who is 330lbs he has good lateral movement and he has done well with two gap assignments. Personally I'm torn on him a little and wouldn't be happy where some are saying that we should take him in the 2nd round. I think he is a 3rd round guy. If the team loves him I'm not going to kick and scream about taking him in the late 2nd, but I also don't think we will take him that early.

 

[xwalker]

Mazi is too straightlinish. Has all the signs of a decent rotational player. 4th rounder.

I don't understand what you mean by that comment. For a guy who is 330lbs he has good lateral movement and he has done well with two gap assignments. Personally I'm torn on him a little and wouldn't be happy where some are saying that we should take him in the 2nd round. I think he is a 3rd round guy. If the team loves him I'm not going to kick and scream about taking him in the late 2nd, but I also don't think we will take him that early.

I don't get the 'straightlinish" comment, but I do think Mazi might be a bit overrated.

Obviously, you have to watch full games, not highlight videos.

He is not nearly as powerful as I had expected. He often struggled vs double-teams.
- Benton might be straight-up more powerful.

On the plus side he is quicker than I expected.
- I wonder if he would be better dropping a few pounds to become more of a pass rusher type DT.

I rate his as an early 3rd round type.