Jones, Gregory and Collins' positioning on Cowboys board

[DBOY3141]

I would be interested to see where Shaq Thompson and Darious Randall were rated. The GM from the Panthers said if they had not taken Shaq, he knew for a fact that the Cowboys would. They also seemed to have a lot of interest in Randall.

 

[AzorAhai]

I would be interested to see where Shaq Thompson and Darious Randall were rated. The GM from the Panthers said if they had not taken Shaq, he knew for a fact that the Cowboys would. They also seemed to have a lot of interest in Randall.

The Gm of the panthers has no idea who the Cowboys were going to take. They even said on the draft call to Jones the team was on pins and needles for the 5 picks before them hoping he was there. Not to mention the way Jones was being talked about by Broaddus and the crew frequently leading up to the draft. Jones was the target and Shaq was probably a fallback. Probably some GM trying to justify a pick many didn't like to the fanbase.

 

[DBOY3141]

The Gm of the panthers has no idea who the Cowboys were going to take. They even said on the draft call to Jones the team was on pins and needles for the 5 picks before them hoping he was there. Not to mention the way Jones was being talked about by Broaddus and the crew frequently leading up to the draft. Jones was the target and Shaq was probably a fallback. Probably some GM trying to justify a pick many didn't like to the fanbase.

None of us know for sure what goes on between GM's during the draft, so it's all a guess on our part. Just like with Gregory, Shaq could have been rated higher but they still would have went with Jones.

 

[lostar2009]

How do you keep Gregory at #4 and then refuse to take him @ #27? DE is a need. It seems to me that if they decided they wouldn't use a 1st on him but would take him in the 2nd, then they should have moved him down to the group with early 2nd round grades.

Because they knew he would drop.

 

[NinePointOh]

It does kind of taint the whole 3 1st rounders though

I don't think it does, because it was pretty clear that people meant "expected to go in the literal first round" when they made that claim.

If you define "1st rounder" as "top 18," then you have to adjust your expectations accordingly -- with that definition, landing two "1st rounders" and one "very high 2nd rounder" would be just as impressive as the original claim.

 

[JD_KaPow]

How do you keep Gregory at #4 and then refuse to take him @ #27? DE is a need. It seems to me that if they decided they wouldn't use a 1st on him but would take him in the 2nd, then they should have moved him down to the group with early 2nd round grades.

Nope. They had it right. There's one list of how you value them. There's another of when you think they'll be available. If you think someone will be available at your next pick, you have to decide whether to gamble on it or not.

The fact that other teams wouldn't take Gregory early doesn't change how your scouts/front office feel about his talent. You don't have some single master list that tells you who you have to pick.

 

[daveferr33]

I must admit the first time I heard him talk, I was expecting a lot of street language, but he was very articulate.

I apologize if that offends anyone, but it was just surprising to me.

Seems to be a pretty smart guy:

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

How do you keep Gregory at #4 and then refuse to take him @ #27? DE is a need. It seems to me that if they decided they wouldn't use a 1st on him but would take him in the 2nd, then they should have moved him down to the group with early 2nd round grades.

its the risk. are you willing to take a player with potential problems and perhaps a suspension in the first round? you need to hit a solid player with your first round pick. not someone that may/maynot be on the team because of off field issues.

 

[AzorAhai]

None of us know for sure what goes on between GM's during the draft, so it's all a guess on our part. Just like with Gregory, Shaq could have been rated higher but they still would have went with Jones.

I'm pretty sure the FO didn't call up the Panthers and tell them we're going to take Shaq if you don't. I also seriously doubt they discussed who they were going to take at 27 with them. What purpose would it serve to sincerely tell teams who exactly you're targeting? It makes zero sense that the GM of the panthers knew who the Cowboys were going to pick or what the players rankings were on the board. It sounds exactly like a sell job to a fan base that didn’t like the pick.

The only way they would have that knowledge is if Dallas tried to trade up to get him and when the Panthers asked who they were targeting they said Shaq. Nothing else would make sense and since we've hard zero rumbling of that, I doubt thats what happened.

 

[theogt]

It appears Jones was exaggerating when he said Byron Jones was in the top 15 or 16 on their board. I'm surprised because we know that Jerry never exaggerates.

Depends on what he meant. If he meant top guys that they were willing to take at 27, then 15 or 16 sounds about right, as obviously they didn't have Collins, Gregory or presumably even Shane Ray as players they were willing to pick at 27 despite being interested in them. If Jones was at 20 based purely on talent, then taking those 3 guys off "the board" at 27 puts Byron Jones at top 17 at worst.

 

[gimmesix]

Depends on what he meant. If they meant top guys that they were willing to take at 27, then 15 or 16 sounds about right, as obviously they didn't have Collins, Gregory or presumably even Shane Ray as players they were willing to pick at 27 despite being interested in them. If Jones was at 20 based purely on talent, then taking those 3 guys off "the board" at 27 puts Byron Jones at top 17 at worst.

That's a good point. He could have been saying that. But Jerry's never been shy about using hyperbole, so it wouldn't surprise me if he was just talking up the pick a bit (possibly by using the standard you mention).

 

[Oh_Canada]

It appears Jones was exaggerating when he said Byron Jones was in the top 15 or 16 on their board. I'm surprised because we know that Jerry never exaggerates.

Whoa....he exaggerated by four picks, let's not get too dramatic here.

 

[xwalker]

Depends on what he meant. If he meant top guys that they were willing to take at 27, then 15 or 16 sounds about right, as obviously they didn't have Collins, Gregory or presumably even Shane Ray as players they were willing to pick at 27 despite being interested in them. If Jones was at 20 based purely on talent, then taking those 3 guys off "the board" at 27 puts Byron Jones at top 17 at worst.

This.

They had Gregory at #4 in terms of talent, but obviously they had Jones ranked higher in terms of players they would actually pick.

The interesting thing with Jones was in the phone call, Garrett said they were sweating it out hoping he would get to #27 for the previous 5 or 6 picks.

 

[AzorAhai]

This.

They had Gregory at #4 in terms of talent, but obviously they had Jones ranked higher in terms of players they would actually pick.

The interesting thing with Jones was in the phone call, Garrett said they were sweating it out hoping he would get to #27 for the previous 5 or 6 picks.

That's why it's funny how the panthers gm is claiming he knew the Cowboys would take Shaq. It seems pretty obvious to me Jones was the target and someone like K. Johnson, Gurley, Gordon or Dupree falling would have been an unexpected bonus.

 

[AsthmaField]

It really is an impressive haul for one draft. I still can barely believe it happened the way it did.

I'm not quite sure everyone realizes just how physically talented Gregory is. There has been so much BS talk about his off the field issues that it kind of becomes overlooked just how special his tools are. Physically, if you put about 10 pounds or so on the guy, I'm not sure anyone could draw up a better edge rush prospect. His extremely long arms, superb athleticism, his knack for rushing the passer, and his football IQ are about as good as you can get. If Garrett and Marinelli can get his mind right, he is a top 5 pass rusher in the NFL.

The knack for pass rushing and his intelligence are what tip things in his favor, IMO. There are a lot of athletic pass rushers in the league, but it is only the one's who naturally have the lean, burst and understanding of how to beat OL that rise to the top. Either guys have it or they don't. Not many do. Gregory has it in spades though. Smarts is a huge thing too. DL stunts, zone blitzing, etc. are much easier for guys who think on their feet and can learn fast.

It is no wonder that Dallas had him ranked 4th overall.

 

[erod]

I still can't figure out why Gregory is rated so high on his talent.

Not that he isn't a good prospect, but at his weight and limited pass-rush technique, he's a bit of a project. I don't see him getting much playing time this year except for obvious passing downs.

Second round was about right for him.

 

[USMarineVet]

“Jerry Jones did a great job doing that deal,” Byron Jones said. “But at the end of the day we have to prove ourselves.

“Yeah, maybe we were measured as first-round guys but we’ve got to prove ourselves with a Cowboys uniform on.”

I love this guys attitude. He just seems to get it. He seemed super competitive out on the field at minicamp too.

“Everybody feels that way,” Gregory said. “I know La’el carries himself that way, Byron obviously does. I know I do.

“I think we expect a lot of big things from ourselves. But we can’t add any more pressure on ourselves. We have to be the same players we’ve always been but get better.”

I'm very surprised by Gregory in all honesty. Leading up to the draft I figured he was just a big dummy. I've now completely turned around on that line of thinking. He speaks so eloquently and sounds like an intelligent young man. Yes, he made some dumb decisions, but he seems like a smart kid with a decision making problem. I'll definitely be rooting for him for more than him being able to help my football team.

I believe La'El stated in his press conference that Gregory scored a 31 on his Wonderlic. That's an excellent score.

 

[JBell]

I still can't figure out why Gregory is rated so high on his talent.

Not that he isn't a good prospect, but at his weight and limited pass-rush technique, he's a bit of a project. I don't see him getting much playing time this year except for obvious passing downs.

Second round was about right for him.

Please don't tell me you're just regurgitating what you read from Broaddus.

 

[gimmesix]

Whoa....he exaggerated by four picks, let's not get too dramatic here.

You read drama into that? Now that's dramatic.

 

[gimmesix]

This.

They had Gregory at #4 in terms of talent, but obviously they had Jones ranked higher in terms of players they would actually pick.

The interesting thing with Jones was in the phone call, Garrett said they were sweating it out hoping he would get to #27 for the previous 5 or 6 picks.

Well, even if they still had him at 20 at that point, they would have been sweating it out. No big deal either way, though, because they got good value with Jones, great value with Gregory and off-the-charts value with Collins.