Kiper getting owned... LOL

[Hostile]

He may not stink but he's overrated. He's overrated in that most casual fans think he's THE source for draft info. Perhaps that was true a decade ago, but not today.

Everyone who is successful in what they do is "over rated." It's called jealousy that someone else is noticed for taking risks.

 

[theogt]

Everyone who is successful in what they do is "over rated." It's called jealousy that someone else is noticed for taking risks.

No, not at all. His name is almost synonymous with NFL draft. To die hards like us, he's just another source, but I'd bet if you asked casual fans to name a mock draft, Kiper's would be the only one named. THAT is being overrated. It has nothing to do with taking risks. Hell, virtually every sport's media source does that.

 

[Echo9]

to give credit where credit is due. kiper is a big reason why the draft is no longer done in privet and the fans hear about it the next day. he is a big part of turning the event into what it is. there is a difference in a mock like goose does that is what he thinks teams "will" do, and what kiper does and list what he thinks teams should do.he is wrong alot like most others but he has been a huge part of turning the draft into a super event

I agree completely.

The writer of this article seems to be missing the point completely IMO. Kiper and Gosselin have two different jobs.

Gosselin is a reporter. It is his job to dig around and get information from teams and other sources in order to try to predict what the the team would do. We may forget this with all the opinions reporter inject into their stories these days, but a journalists job is supposed to be gathering information and passing it on to the masses. It's about being factually correct (or in the case of the Draft...as factually correct as the inevitable smokescreens and innuendo will allow)

Kiper, on the other hand, is not a reporter. He's not supposed to be a reporter and he has never claimed to be a reporter. He basically invented his job, and in the process, played a major role in increasing the popularity of the NFL draft over the years. He obviously worked his butt off for a long time to create his own (rather substantial) niche in the world. I have to respect that.

In the past, I've been pretty critical of Kiper. Mainly because I didn't initially see what he's done for the sport overall. For Kiper, it's not about being right. It's about 'acting' like he's right in order to generate debate and interest amongst fans. It's about raising the awareness and excitement level of fans about new players coming into the league (i.e. hype). That interest then generates money. Money for him, money for ESPN, money for the NFL. That's one hell of a success story if you ask me.

Tell me that the other major sports wouldn't want something like that? As an example, imagine the NBA was able to hype 15 LeBron James's a year.
They would love to generate that kind of interest in that many young players a year.

About the player who was drafted much later than Kiper projected? All I can say is "Boo-frikken Hoo." Total BS. The guy gets paid 300K+ for a year or two. That's more than he'd make in the real world in a lifetime. I doubt a degree in basket-weaving would have netted him 1/8th as much. Each person is responsible for making their own decisions. This is just another example of placing the blame on others...again. Let's see this guy sue Kiper now. I wouldn't be all that surprised.

Funny thing is. I don't even like Kiper much. But I have to give credit where credit is due. He almost single-handidly fabricated a highly successful career out of what was initially nothing, and developed a whole new market in the process.

 

[Pabst]

I enjoy Kiper during the draft. I think he's a good "TV" guy. That being said, I take his mock drafts and predictions with a grain of salt, as well as his "Best Player Available" tab during the actual draft telecast.

 

[Reigle9]

While Mel Kiper is not the best, he is still one of the best. People have pointed out how Mock's weren't his specialty, but he's still good at them. This is not an opinon, it is fact. Anyone with a keybaord can say "he sucks", I think that is so annoying. Here is a link of the Mock Drafts and Top 100 list, and how they've done. Overall, Gosselin and Kiper are the two of the top three if you combine the top 100 and the Mock Draft. NFL Draft countdown might be better than either one of them. http://www.thehuddlereport.com/top100/index.shtml

 

[jem88]

He may not stink but he's overrated. He's overrated in that most casual fans think he's THE source for draft info. Perhaps that was true a decade ago, but not today.

For me, that's a bigger indictment of the 'casual fans' than it is of Kiper. Fans interested in the draft should take the time to research multiple sources and come to their own conclusions, which is really where the whole fun of the draft is to be found: trying to guess who your team is going to pick. Personally, I find Kiper funny to look at, but I do like his approach to the whole thing.

 

[Hostile]

No, not at all. His name is almost synonymous with NFL draft. To die hards like us, he's just another source, but I'd bet if you asked casual fans to name a mock draft, Kiper's would be the only one named. THAT is being overrated. It has nothing to do with taking risks. Hell, virtually every sport's media source does that.

You just made my point for me with that statement.

 

[theogt]

You just made my point for me with that statement.

No, I didn't. That statement says that he's overrated. Are you drunk this early on a Saturday? The statement is descriptive, not normative.

 

[doomsday81]

Years ago Kiper proved to me he was a bum and do not know what he is talking about. He does and did all that research on the athletes, that stuff means nothing. Stats, can not give you a good reading on a players heart and his mental state, (attitude).

There are so many athletes that comes thru the draft, yes, Kiper will hit right on some, but if you had in the past or even now listen to him he misses more than he hits on the really big names in the draft. Now days he backtracks when he is wrong.

The first time I noticed he was a bunch of empty research and talk, was in the 89 draft, then he missed a lot in the 90, the draft when Bledsoe and Mirer came out, Leaf and Manning, I laugh now everytime he speaks.

I wish I could go head to head with him and his research, all I would need to do is watch film. We could pick 20,30, 40,50, players and go head to head, him with his research and me just from watching film.

I know I would spank.

Kiper had Mirer ranked as the 63 best player in that draft. Listen, people hate Kiper because he dropped out of school, got lucky and got rich for doing something we all wish we could do. He does hit more than people give him credit for like when he said a WR named Jimmy Smith would be a future Pro Bowler. I love how people forget that one. Fans hate Kiper because they wish they had his job. Plain and simple. What does Goose bring to the table? You should hear all the stupid questions he asked at the Combine. "You broke your index finger in high school, is that correct?" "You blocked a put once in your college career. Where did you line up?" I think Goose has more inside info than Kiper because he talks to teams but Kiper never claimed to have inside info. He just gives you his thougts on players. As far as measuring heart, who the hell can do that? Bill Parcells can measure heart? That's news to me. If you could measure heart than LenDale White is a sixth round pick. How about that? Listen, the guy is rich and famous and helped build the draft into what it is today. I tip my hat to him. Anyone can post meaningless messages on a message board but not everyone can start up a business like Kiper did and become the face of the NFL Draft. Big difference there.

 

[Hostile]

No, I didn't. That statement says that he's overrated. Are you drunk this early on a Saturday? The statement is descriptive, not normative.

I've never been drunk a day in my life. Thanks for asking.

Kiper started from nothing, took risks, succeeded, and in your own words has become "synonymous with the Draft." I don't call that overrated, I call that enviable. Hence the jealousy and the label.

 

[Echo9]

I've never been drunk a day in my life. Thanks for asking.

Kiper started from nothing, took risks, succeeded, and in your own words has become "synonymous with the Draft." I don't call that overrated, I call that enviable. Hence the jealousy and the label.

Quite a bit more concise than my post.

 

[theogt]

I've never been drunk a day in my life. Thanks for asking.

Kiper started from nothing, took risks, succeeded, and in your own words has become "synonymous with the Draft." I don't call that overrated, I call that enviable. Hence the jealousy and the label.

It is certainly an accomplishment, and certainly something to be enviable about. That said, there are other draft experts that have just as much success and are just as accurate that do not get the same credit. THAT, my sober friend, is being overrated.

 

[Hostile]

It is certainly an accomplishment, and certainly something to be enviable about. That said, there are other draft experts that have just as much success and are just as accurate that do not get the same credit. THAT, my sober friend, is being overrated.

Have you ever seen the movie "Iron Will?" It's about a dog sled race. Good movie.

There's a scene where Will has to lead his dogs up a steep incline. The other teams use the path he has carved out.

I'm not saying that Kiper carved the paths and others are benefitting from it, but they are more known by the draft followers because of the path he carved.

Kiper made himself an institution. That isn't about being overrated. That's about being successful. As soon as someone is, someone else will think they can do it better and follow suit. Some can do it better, but they rarely achieve the accolades or recognition of the original.That's reality.

In the minds of many, being over rated means being recognized. I don't agree. That's envy talking.

 

[theogt]

Perhaps he paved the way for draft experts. As I understood the article, that's not what the criticism is about. The article was about his current efficiency. In that respect I think it's a pretty safe bet to say he's overrated.

 

[Hostile]

Perhaps he paved the way for draft experts. As I understood the article, that's not what the criticism is about. The article was about his current efficiency. In that respect I think it's a pretty safe bet to say he's overrated.

The article fails to recognize the main difference between Gosselin and Kiper. (I prefer Gosselin by the way.) Gosselin projects draft picks and Kiper doesn't. His service is nothing more than a biography of the prospects and their potential worth to the team that acquires them. On this he does a decent job and is recognized for it. Nothing more. If Gosselin left his sportswriter job to do what Kiper does I think he could do it better. That doesn't mean anything at thsi point since they have different aims with what they do.

 

[theogt]

The article fails to recognize the main difference between Gosselin and Kiper. (I prefer Gosselin by the way.) Gosselin projects draft picks and Kiper doesn't. His service is nothing more than a biography of the prospects and their potential worth to the team that acquires them. On this he does a decent job and is recognized for it. Nothing more. If Gosselin left his sportswriter job to do what Kiper does I think he could do it better. That doesn't mean anything at thsi point since they have different aims with what they do.

It was a bad argument by the article to point that Kiper's big board doesn't match up with teams' picks very often. His board isn't intended to match picks with teams. It's just a BPA ranking.

 

[jterrell]

Kiper irks me in that he switches his rankings so freely AFTER a guy has played 3 or 4 years of football. Are you really telling me after watching a senior WR in 05 in ten games on tape you don't know about his QB priot to the end of 06?

Seriously, you either go the way of Gosselin and try to rank based on scout and team opinions or you just make it personal preference and with personal preference there shouldn't be endless jockeying for position that ends up with guys he thought was a top 10 prospect after the Bowl season as a 3rd round pick in his own mind by draft day.

Scouts don't change their opinion on a guy's talent by much. They know his skill level and provided he is injury free they are gonna stick to their assessments. If Kiper did that I'd have a ton more respect for the guy.

All that said Kiper is in the entertainment business now. He's not a scout or a draft guru. He's a draft talking head and I think we all know it so it shouldn't get to us.

 

[Randy White]

Actually Bryan Curtis (the writer) has this all wrong. Kiper hates to put out mock drafts. He is into information gathering and ranking players. ESPN put the pressure on him to come up with his mocks. He admits he isn't great at them either.

Bingo. That's exactly right.

Kiper does a pretty decent job and is better than this writer portrays him. Rick Gosselin is the best at mock drafts that is true. It really isn't fair to compare the two because they don't specialize in the same thing.

Ric Gosselin does what a good reporter does: passes on information that he collects from sources. Gosselin doesn't know who's the more talented player, what are the negatives or positives of a player, and in most cases, doesn't even know what a player did in college. Most of the things that Gosselin reports is what he's heard from the people that are in the business. That's his job and he's good at it.

Mel Kiper's job is to give his opinion on a player and what the player is " capable " of becoming based on his research.

They are two completely different things.

Let me put it another way, in terms of broadcasting: Gooselin would be the play by play announcer while Kiper would be the color/analyst comentator.

:starspin

 

[Hostile]

It was a bad argument by the article to point that Kiper's big board doesn't match up with teams' picks very often. His board isn't intended to match picks with teams. It's just a BPA ranking.

Exactly what I said, his isn't a mock draft. It's a value board. They don't provide similar information.

 

[theogt]

Exactly what I said, his isn't a mock draft. It's a value board. They don't provide similar information.

Perhaps I should have emphasized "was". I was agreeing with you. Imagine someone saying "Yeah, it WAS a bad argument..."

Damn internet.