Labor Talks Break Down!!!!!

[Reality]

I'll point out that I'm not a fan of mercenary free agent signings. I wish teams focused more on drafting and grooming players than the grass-is-greener approach. Because of FA, teams now feel like if a player drafted in the first 2-3 rounds isn't starting by mid-season, the pick was a bust. It would be interesting to know (there is no way) how many players have been labeled busts would have been great players had there been no rush to get them on the field before they were ready.

 

[The30YardSlant]

On the bright side, the Commanders will be destroyed without a new CBA....

 

[Bizwah]

I resent having Ewing grouped into that bunch. Patrick Ewing may have been teased with bananas (an idiotic and racial slur) due to his facial features, but he was quite intelligent. The funny thing I found was watching how much respect Ralph Sampson was afforded because he played for UVA and had so called "white features" when in fact, he was the "slow" one, and if you ever heard him talk or answer interview questions, you know what I mean.

Ewing is no dummy...

I think you're missing something here.

Ewing was the NBA Union President during their work stoppage. He was the one that got on national TV and said:

"We're fighting for our livelihood here."

Yes, he makes millions of dollars, but still thinks he's fighting for his livelihood.

That's where the "smarter" comment comes from.....I think.......

 

[Bizwah]

I look at it like this .. The Yankees spend 200+ million a year on salary while most of MLB spends less than half that. How many World Series have the Yankees won lately since their spending surged so much?

Yes, but they field a "contender" every year.

I used to love the Royals. They had a good farm system, and contended many years.

Now, they're unwatchable.....They just can't generate the revenue to compete with the Yankees.

And this isn't a bad sports area we're talking about. The Chiefs are very well-loved....as were the Royals.

If the NFL goes the baseball-route, will the Chiefs be able to compete? I think it would be a shame to see a great football town lose the ability to compete.

I don't like the cap. But I shudder at the thought of seeing football turn into MLB.

 

[mschmidt64]

Perhaps you don't understand the concept schmitty

Smaller marker teams don't have the money to spend as much. Some teams would end up with a de facto cap because they didn't have the cash to spend.

Perhaps you don't understand the concept.

Draft well. Then its not a problem.

And I also do not buy that these teams are so strapped that they can't re-sign their own.

As we've all seen, importing million dollar players doesn't buy championships, it backfires. The teams that win year in and year out are the ones that draft well and spend smartly.

Which every team in this league has the financial ability to do.

 

[dargonking999]

Wasnt their no Cap, when the cowboys won, 5 SB? I do remember sombody saying that when the cap came in then we started losing players, and bla bla bla, so if we won 5 SB without cap, whats wrong with not having a cap now?

 

[Reality]

Yes, but they field a "contender" every year.

I used to love the Royals. They had a good farm system, and contended many years.

Now, they're unwatchable.....They just can't generate the revenue to compete with the Yankees.

And this isn't a bad sports area we're talking about. The Chiefs are very well-loved....as were the Royals.

If the NFL goes the baseball-route, will the Chiefs be able to compete? I think it would be a shame to see a great football town lose the ability to compete.

I don't like the cap. But I shudder at the thought of seeing football turn into MLB.

Yeah, baseball is a bad example because I can't stand what baseball has turned into, though I do find enjoyment when teams like the Yankees, Red Sox, etc. fail to make the playoffs.

While I am against revenue sharing, I don't mind the salary cap that much but I wish they would make two big changes to it. First, make signing bonuses apply immediately in full, not pro-rated. I've always hated that loophole because it allows teams to dump a lot of money on a player that will only be around for a little while.

Second, I would make it so that once a player has played 3 consecutive years with a team, their salary cap hit would receive a credit based on the percentage of consecutive years beyond the 3 limit. For example, if a player has played 5 years with the same team, maybe deduct 10% of the salary from being applied against the cap and it would increase the longer they played with that same team.

While the Keyshawns, Bledsoes, etc. are great pickups for a team at the bottom, I would like to see a lot more focus put back into drafting and grooming your own players.

I really can't stand knowing that in 3-4 years if a player isn't great, you have to cut them only to see them go somewhere else and become an all-pro.

 

[Bizwah]

Yeah, baseball is a bad example because I can't stand what baseball has turned into, though I do find enjoyment when teams like the Yankees, Red Sox, etc. fail to make the playoffs.

While I am against revenue sharing, I don't mind the salary cap that much but I wish they would make two big changes to it. First, make signing bonuses apply immediately in full, not pro-rated. I've always hated that loophole because it allows teams to dump a lot of money on a player that will only be around for a little while.

Second, I would make it so that once a player has played 3 consecutive years with a team, their salary cap hit would receive a credit based on the percentage of consecutive years beyond the 3 limit. For example, if a player has played 5 years with the same team, maybe deduct 10% of the salary from being applied against the cap and it would increase the longer they played with that same team.

While the Keyshawns, Bledsoes, etc. are great pickups for a team at the bottom, I would like to see a lot more focus put back into drafting and grooming your own players.

I really can't stand knowing that in 3-4 years if a player isn't great, you have to cut them only to see them go somewhere else and become an all-pro.

I totally agree with this post.

I don't think a team should be penalized for drafting well. I hated to see our amazing 90s teams raided because we couldnt' pay them. It started with guys like Jimmie Jones, Jim Jeffcoat, and Ken Norton Jr.....

Players a team has drafted should only count against a "portion" of the cap. If they want to pay a player, fine. If not, let him go (I'd do away with the Franchise Tag).

 

[felix360]

can some explain how the Commanders are screwed, having a hard time understanding this

 

[sacase]

The problem is they pay their players low base saleries and high bonuses. The bonuses can be spead out over the length of the contract. This allows them to spead out the hit they will take by giving big bonuses.

So here is what is goign to happen. They cannot restructure contracts becuase now that there is no cap the 30% rule applies. They cannot restructure the contracts like they need to since a players salary cannot increas by more than 30% each additional year.

So say a player is due a roster bonus of 6 million this year...well they cannot restructure that since he makes 600,000 base salary the most he could recive next year would be 780,000. Since they are 20 million over the cap, they have to cut a lot of the middle ground guys, they can keep most of their stars. But they end up signing 20-25 rookies. So basically half the team sucks and there is no depth. I would love to trade them a #1 this year for their #1 next year!

That is over simplified but in essence that is how the skins are screwed. They dont' have the ability to restructure like they have done in past years. So finally Cap hell has come around. If the CBA was extended they would get under it very easy.

 

[felix360]

The problem is they pay their players low base saleries and high bonuses. The bonuses can be spead out over the length of the contract. This allows them to spead out the hit they will take by giving big bonuses.

So here is what is goign to happen. They cannot restructure contracts becuase now that there is no cap the 30% rule applies. They cannot restructure the contracts like they need to since a players salary cannot increas by more than 30% each additional year.

So say a player is due a roster bonus of 6 million this year...well they cannot restructure that since he makes 600,000 base salary the most he could recive next year would be 780,000. Since they are 20 million over the cap, they have to cut a lot of the middle ground guys, they can keep most of their stars. But they end up signing 20-25 rookies. So basically half the team sucks and there is no depth. I would love to trade them a #1 this year for their #1 next year!

That is over simplified but in essence that is how the skins are screwed. They dont' have the ability to restructure like they have done in past years. So finally Cap hell has come around. If the CBA was extended they would get under it very easy.

thanks haha very nice

 

[AbeBeta]

Perhaps you don't understand the concept.

Draft well. Then its not a problem.

Perhaps you've never seen other sports -- like baseball where small market teams can't support huge payrolls and never can keep their homegrown players.

Some teams can afford 200 million a year in salary -- others can't -- if you don't think that is going to create disparity then I think you need a math lesson.

 

[DallasInDC]

I need some clarification on the CBA and the uncapped year in 2007. Based on most of the post I have read, people assume that if the CBA does not get done by march 3rd then 2007 is uncapped. Does this mean that this is a one shot deal, or can the CBA still be renegotiated prior to the beginning of the 2007 season (next March)? I really hope it is the latter so that the skins get screwed but will not have the benefit of an uncapped year and the sport does not degenerate into what baseball has become.

 

[Bach]

Wasnt their no Cap, when the cowboys won, 5 SB? I do remember sombody saying that when the cap came in then we started losing players, and bla bla bla, so if we won 5 SB without cap, whats wrong with not having a cap now?

The way salaries are now and FA, it's a whole different ballgame now compared to then. In the 60's, 70's and 80's there was no cap or FA. Teams acquired all their players through the draft or occasional trades or the waiver wire. Salaries were kept in check because you were only signing your own guys.

We did win three SB's in the 90's when FA was just starting and the cap was just getting put in place.

But look at baseball. In the 70's and 80's teams like Cincinnati and Pittsburgh could win championships and there was even a team in Montreal and a viable one at that. Now you have huge market teams and the have nots. Montreal doesn't even exist anymore. The Big Red Machine can't even compete as well as many other small market teams. It's a different world now and the NFL is on it's way to screwing up big time.

 

[Bach]

I need some clarification on the CBA and the uncapped year in 2007. Based on most of the post I have read, people assume that if the CBA does not get done by march 3rd then 2007 is uncapped. Does this mean that this is a one shot deal, or can the CBA still be renegotiated prior to the beginning of the 2007 season (next March)? I really hope it is the latter so that the skins get screwed but will not have the benefit of an uncapped year and the sport does not degenerate into what baseball has become.

I think it's possible to get something done after March 3 but prior to '07, however I don't think it's probable. The players would have zero incentive to strike a deal. Once they go past this deadline, then they will be cap free next year. I think they will see it through and we'll have all heck break loose next year, including Snyder probably spending over $200 million if he chooses. But if that happens, I see a strike/lockout when the deal is up prior to '08. At that point I think we'll see another CBA agreement.

But if we get to March 3, I dont' see a deal happening before '08.

 

[VACowboy]

I'd swear there was something about players becoming free agents in their sixth year instead of their fourth if there was no new CBA. Can anyone clear this up?

Personally, I think free agency screwed the NFL, not the salary cap.

 

[Dayton Cowboy]

How much is the difference in revenue sharing between the NFLpa's asking of 60% and the Owners offering of 56.2%?? How much money would that be?

 

[BigDFan5]

How much is the difference in revenue sharing between the NFLpa's asking of 60% and the Owners offering of 56.2%?? How much money would that be?

over the life of the CBA 1% is = to 1 Billion

so 3.8 BILLION

 

[trueblue1687]

I'd swear there was something about players becoming free agents in their sixth year instead of their fourth if there was no new CBA. Can anyone clear this up?

Personally, I think free agency screwed the NFL, not the salary cap.

True. Alot of folks don't realize this either: Without a CBA, there would still be rules governing the use of salaries and how they are "absorbed". Apparently there are still some sorts of safeguards set by the NFL regarding spending. Notice I said set by the NFL...NOT the NFLPA. Here's the latest scoop that I've read. Some interesting scenarios.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=pasquarelli_len&id=2348970

 

[Bach]

True. Alot of folks don't realize this either: Without a CBA, there would still be rules governing the use of salaries and how they are "absorbed". Apparently there are still some sorts of safeguards set by the NFL regarding spending. Notice I said set by the NFL...NOT the NFLPA. Here's the latest scoop that I've read. Some interesting scenarios.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=pasquarelli_len&id=2348970

The current CBA runs out after the '07 season. But the way it was set up was if a new deal wasn't done prior to March 3 of '06, then new rules would take effect for '06 and '07. Among those rules are the uncapped year in '07, but also included is a provision that makes players have to have 6 years in the league instead of 4 to be a FA during that uncapped year. After '07 the CBA is up and there will most likely be a strike or lockout before '08 until a new deal is in place.