LVE - the downside, coverage

[John813]

Saw a couple plays at least where he was the closest defender to Agholor in coverage.
Guess it was a zone coverage and Wentz took advantage of that matchup.
Not sure how many LBs can keep up with a receiver on an east/west route.

But something to watch the rest of the year as to how many times the QBs look his way.

 

[buybuydandavis]

Yup, saw jaylon pretty much remove Commanders top level te last year, but from the slb position.....Wilson at that spot at present has athletism, but hasn't shown the anticipation

I didn't remember that about Jaylon last year, but I'm not surprised. That's my vision for Jaylon on defense. Play that man coverage role on a TE, and then blitz sometimes. Not zone for Jaylon. More like an in the box SS on passing downs. Let Lee and LVE play the traditional lb zone roles in coverage.

 

[QuincyCarterEra]

Saw a couple plays at least where he was the closest defender to Agholor in coverage.
Guess it was a zone coverage and Wentz took advantage of that matchup.
Not sure how many LBs can keep up with a receiver on an east/west route.

But something to watch the rest of the year as to how many times the QBs look his way.

Correct abd I believe thats where the majority of the YAC came from was the Agholor catch over the middle that ended with Agholor going out of bounds on the right side of the field. At least 22ish yards of his YAC

 

[blueblood70]

first off many got beat last week and like was said if Zone whos responsibility was it? two hes a Rookie and playing better than most predicted..he will improve and there will be games where offenses get there best TE/RB out in passing routes against a LB ad most LBs lose those..its chess game win some lose some

 

[UncleOscar]

In all fairness, two things...

1. He's a linebacker, not a safety or cb. Sure those numbers look bad, but you have to take his position into account.

2. Again... Lb'er how many of those "targets" are from zone coverage and he literally didn't have much say in the pass being caught or not? I know a lot of times they just look at who was closest and say that guy was targeted when really it was probably just a hole in the zone.

In all fairness, three things:
3. He is a rookie from a smaller college and was a one year starter there, who didn't get a lot of practice or play time in the summer due to injuries, and has been starting for only 4 games.

My god, when this kid gets a couple of years of weight lifting and another year of experience, look out!

 

[Blackspider214]

Because our coaches are too lame to tweak our system. Byron specialized in covering TEs last year. He was good at it. Ertz is their main guy. Duh. Take out their main guy.

And if not Byron, someone else. Jaylon has the size, speed and agility. We send him downfield covering WRs, but won't put him on Ertz.

Cowboy coaching. Next man up. Players are interchangeable cogs.

Yes you are right. Garrett and staff usually have one plan and that's it. They can not adjust to what the game is giving you or ad lib. This is on both sides of the ball. The most maddening was last year when the coaches refused to give Chaz Green any help against Atlanta and allowed him to give up 6 sacks himself.

 

[Mr_437]

Scouting LVE predraft, coverage was one of his strengths. If LVE was man up on Ertz most of the game that would be intriguing, but that wasn't the case.

I think this is a lost in the stats moment. I just think LVE is the better athlete and wouldn't let Ertz dog him out like that. Let's just see Round 2, and if Richard plays man on Ertz.

 

[Verdict]

Say what you want, but the entire defense is better with LVE in the lineup than Lee. We are much better defending the pass without Lee in the game. Early in the season teams were INTENTIONALLY trying to matchup players against Lee in the passing game. Let that sink in for a moment.

 

[CouchCoach]

LMAO, as usual, the messenger gets killed.

Vander Esch is long and athletic but if they can get him on Coleman, he could have a lesson and a long day. With those three WR's, the Safety's are not going to be able to play up to give help and Coleman is one of the best receiving backs in the league, and could catch the most balls Sunday, and their TE isn't shabby, just so many balls to go around.

 

[Fletch]

I'll throw myself into the onslaught, but despite all of the positive media coverage, LVE did have a big flaw in his game on Sunday.

Leighton Vander Esch was targeted 11 times and allowed 10 receptions for 92 yards, 47 yards after the catch, and had his first career interception.

Source: PFF

Rookie aren’t perfect. That will get better.

 

[Nova]

The stat is questionable for sure.

PFF assigns coverage grades pretty poorly when it comes to zone. On the flip side, a few of LVE's tackles appear to have been him touching an already down receiver.

He's pretty decent in coverage and in space.

 

[gimmesix]

I'll throw myself into the onslaught, but despite all of the positive media coverage, LVE did have a big flaw in his game on Sunday.

Leighton Vander Esch was targeted 11 times and allowed 10 receptions for 92 yards, 47 yards after the catch, and had his first career interception.

Source: PFF

I agree with blindzebra. There are always open areas in zone coverage because players just can't cover the whole field. Wentz targets the tight end a lot, and that's usually in the soft spot between the inside coverage (the linebacker) and the outside coverage (the corner or safety).

Go back and watch the interception. That was zone coverage where Wentz tried to draw the coverage (LVE) toward the left so that he could throw back to a soft spot to the right. LVE didn't vacate his zone and was in position to make the pick.

There were a lot of throws to the tight end in zone coverage and LVE likely got blamed for giving up those passes even if he was actually handling his zone responsibilities. For stat purposes, PFF has to assign blame.

It's more important, though, to look at how he handles man duties and whether he's moving out of his zone into others' areas of responsibility. (If you see two players bunched when the ball is thrown in zone coverage then it's a good indication that someone isn't in the right zone.)

 

[gimmesix]

Because our coaches are too lame to tweak our system. Byron specialized in covering TEs last year. He was good at it. Ertz is their main guy. Duh. Take out their main guy.

And if not Byron, someone else. Jaylon has the size, speed and agility. We send him downfield covering WRs, but won't put him on Ertz.

Cowboy coaching. Next man up. Players are interchangeable cogs.

I remember Green Bay doing this to us with Witten, having a corner/safety follow him all over the field because he was more of a threat at that time than our No. 2 receiver. I believe that we didn't do well in that game.

 

[glimmerman]

They will tighten up this week.

 

[buybuydandavis]

I remember Green Bay doing this to us with Witten, having a corner/safety follow him all over the field because he was more of a threat at that time than our No. 2 receiver. I believe that we didn't do well in that game.

It's a mystery why everyone didn't do this against Witten. Just put someone on his hip. He wasn't going to run away from anyone.

 

[beware_d-ware]

The stat is questionable for sure.

PFF assigns coverage grades pretty poorly when it comes to zone. On the flip side, a few of LVE's tackles appear to have been him touching an already down receiver.

He's pretty decent in coverage and in space.

The way I've heard it put best is that PFF tends to struggle when players have no clearly defined assignment. For say a CB in man coverage, his task is pretty simple: he's covering the WR across from him, and if he gets beat, he probably deserves some blame for it. But zone gets more fuzzy. Oftentimes two guys might get mixed up passing off a receiver and leave another guy uncovered, who lost that rep? Which defender's mistake was it? It's tough to know unless you're in the coaches' room. If two receivers come into a player's zone, who does he have responsibility for? Does it count as a catch allowed if one of them catches it in his zone, even if he can't cover them? What if the coaches are fine with giving up a dumpoff in the flat as long as the LB can come up and stop him? Should doing what his coaches ask him to count against his coverage grade?

If you look, they tend to rate zone defenders lower than man defenders across the board for this reason. They do the same thing with 3 techs and NTs as well - 3 techs have an easily defined task of shooting a gap, whereas NTs have a more vague job of "stuffing" or "tying up blockers". It's tough to tell wins and losses when a successful rep is a guy getting stonewalled by two blockers at the LOS.

 

[gimmesix]

It's a mystery why everyone didn't do this against Witten. Just put someone on his hip. He wasn't going to run away from anyone.

Because you had to commit a pretty good player to him even at his slowest since he was so technically proficient. Linebackers had trouble handling his route-running while he could use his body and nudges to escape safeties and corners.

 

[eromeopolk]

I'll throw myself into the onslaught, but despite all of the positive media coverage, LVE did have a big flaw in his game on Sunday.

Leighton Vander Esch was targeted 11 times and allowed 10 receptions for 92 yards, 47 yards after the catch, and had his first career interception.

Source: PFF

He is a rookie. His interceptions will increase as he gets experience. Now that we have stopped the Sean Lee merry go round, Vander Esh will play looser and make more plays. We are one Darrin Smith type coverage LB from being dominate at LB when the Cowboys had Howley, Jordan, and Lewis, Bruenig, Henderson, and Hegman, and Norton, Smith, and Edwards/Myles.

I was the only one posting after the draft pick that this was the best and only rational choice the Cowboys have made since Martin.

 

[CATCH17]

LVE is great in coverage.

 

[Redball Express]

Lord knows, but the stat is slightly alarming and something I think we should keep an eye on in coming weeks. He won us the game on the defensive side of the ball.

He is a rookie folks.

DeMarcus Ware he is not.

Not yet.