Maine shooting

[HungryLion]

How about all the crimes committed by the users trying to get their next fix.
Do not the innocent deserve to be protected from that?

sure. But I’m not talking about other crimes. I’m talking about the criminalization of possession/use of drugs.

 

[gtb1943]

sure. But I’m not talking about other crimes. I’m talking about the criminalization of possession/use of drugs.

AND I AM talking about all those DRUG USERS that commit crimes to get their next fix.
IF they are in jail they cannot commit those crimes, CAN THEY?

 

[HungryLion]

AND I AM talking about all those DRUG USERS that commit crimes to get their next fix.
IF they are in jail they cannot commit those crimes, CAN THEY?

Ok

 

[HungryLion]

In this state, addiction has become a profit center for both the supply side and the treatment side. Addicts are treated as victims and given all the free resources they need to wallow in that victimhood status and continue down that dark road. At best, they can trade the illegal addiction for the legal addiction (suboxone/methadone). Many, if not most take advantage of both. If addiction was "cured" tonight, large state bureaucracies would no longer be needed, putting people out of work, huge budgets no longer necessary. There is no incentive to actually solve this crisis from a government perspective. It's become a self-perpetuating cycle. The government is not about downsizing. Far from it.

Beating an opiate addiction is a HUGE task. It takes a true "come to Jesus" moment so to speak, to even begin to try. It is nearly impossible without help. Any amount of "treatment" will not help if the addict goes right back to the same conditions they were stuck in. That is magnified greatly when the same people who are tasked with that treatment are also telling you it's not your fault and handing out clean needles, crack pipes and all the narcan you need.

I have massive empathy for those stuck in opiate addiction. It is a choice to start, but pretty soon it's not simply a choice to quit. It takes a massive effort and a ton of support from everyone around you.

Sometimes a gentle hand is the right path to solving these societal problems. Unfortunately, when it comes to the current addiction problem, it's going to take a hardcore 'boot up the ***" to turn things around. People will suffer. That is where the current system has lead us though.

The changes in society, in my area, over my 60 years, due entirely to opiate addiction are monumental, to say the least. It's only going to get worse following the current direction.

Great point. It is a choice to start (although OxyContin being peddled didn’t help either)

But once the addiction occurs the effects on their brain takes a lot of support and learning to help change. The person has to want to quit and also needs to be taught the skills on how to quit and needs family, friends or other support structures in place to do it.

 

[Vtwin]

Great point. It is a choice to start (although OxyContin being peddled didn’t help either)

But once the addiction occurs the effects on their brain takes a lot of support and learning to help change. The person has to want to quit and also needs to be taught the skills on how to quit and needs family, friends or other support structures in place to do it.

Once the brain becomes dependent on the drug it becomes impossible to function at an anywhere near normal level without it. Much different than cocaine/crack.

The county in Vermont I grew up in and still live in was one of the first hotspots in the country of the oxycontin push in the 90's. Time Magazine did a piece on it in the late 90's. There is one particular Dr's office that is very well known for writing prescriptions, even to this day. It's getting hard to count the people I know who have been lost. Including a couple very close childhood friends. Good people who got caught up in the trap.

There but by the grace go I....

 

[HungryLion]

Once the brain becomes dependent on the drug it becomes impossible to function at an anywhere near normal level without it. Much different than cocaine/crack.

The county in Vermont I grew up in and still live in was one of the first hotspots in the country of the oxycontin push in the 90's. Time Magazine did a piece on it in the late 90's. There is one particular Dr's office that is very well known for writing prescriptions, even to this day. It's getting hard to count the people I know who have been lost. Including a couple very close childhood friends. Good people who got caught up in the trap.

There but by the grace go I....

Such a shame man I’m sorry. Unfortunately the criminals who made OxyContin hid the risks from people until so much damage was done.

 

[gtb1943]

Once the brain becomes dependent on the drug it becomes impossible to function at an anywhere near normal level without it. Much different than cocaine/crack.

The county in Vermont I grew up in and still live in was one of the first hotspots in the country of the oxycontin push in the 90's. Time Magazine did a piece on it in the late 90's. There is one particular Dr's office that is very well known for writing prescriptions, even to this day. It's getting hard to count the people I know who have been lost. Including a couple very close childhood friends. Good people who got caught up in the trap.

There but by the grace go I....

And was anything done to that doctor?
Probably went to another state and kept on doing it.

That is another massive scandal you will not hear about from either the media or politicians:
Drs who go from state to state after having their licenses revoked
and state boards that DO NOTHING about such

More I look at it, the whole system in all ways is broken and beyond repair.

 

[Creeper]

Such a shame man I’m sorry. Unfortunately the criminals who made OxyContin hid the risks from people until so much damage was done.

There are doctors, unfortunately, who will prescribe drugs for patients. I have seen this with a family member. The doctor was eventually caught and arrested, but it went on for a long time. In fact, this family member was getting prescirption drugs from a number of sources. Eventually, it killed her.

 

[Creeper]

AND I AM talking about all those DRUG USERS that commit crimes to get their next fix.
IF they are in jail they cannot commit those crimes, CAN THEY?

This is where I have an issue with those whowant to legalize drugs. Even if they are legal addicts will still steal to get the money to buy them.

But more importantly, the drug problem in America is as much an issue with demand as it is supply. We have chosen to legalize Marijuana to deal with both sides of this equation. Demand for illegal drugs goes away if it can be sold legally. And the supply increases driving illegal suppliers out of business - in theory. However, this does not address the aftermath of widespread drug use.

There is no easy answer to the problem or it would have been solved already. But I cannot imagine a solution that does not involved addressing the demand side. Look what we have done with smoking. We have reduced demand by increases taxes on cigarettes, banning their use in public places, and propagandizing the harmful effects of cigarette smoke. We have to do the same with drugs. This should be easy because most drugs are more dangerous than cigarette smoke.

 

[Vtwin]

And was anything done to that doctor?
Probably went to another state and kept on doing it.

That is another massive scandal you will not hear about from either the media or politicians:
Drs who go from state to state after having their licenses revoked
and state boards that DO NOTHING about such

More I look at it, the whole system in all ways is broken and beyond repair.

He retired years later and the practice was taken over by his partners.

He was a beloved fixture of the community who treated generations. I don't believe he was acting on his own behalf, driven by greed. I believe he honestly thought he was doing right by his patients. Five or so years ago a friend was involved in a car accident. She was prescribed percocet by this office. In order to keep her prescription she was subject to random call-ins so they could count her remaining pills and take a urine test so they could verify that she was taking them and not selling them. At least they tightened things up a bit, I guess. My friend never filled her second prescription.

We buried her brother, and one of my best friends, two years ago from a heroin/fentanyl overdose. His problem started when he was introduced to oxycontin at the same office.

Two people from the same family presented with similar situations who made different choices and ended up with wildly different results.

Can't blame the Dr's entirely, but there are some real greedy scumbags out there.

The pharm sales people behind this deserve their own special place in hell,

 

[gtb1943]

He retired years later and the practice was taken over by his partners.

He was a beloved fixture of the community who treated generations. I don't believe he was acting on his own behalf, driven by greed. I believe he honestly thought he was doing right by his patients. Five or so years ago a friend was involved in a car accident. She was prescribed percocet by this office. In order to keep her prescription she was subject to random call-ins so they could count her remaining pills and take a urine test so they could verify that she was taking them and not selling them. At least they tightened things up a bit, I guess. My friend never filled her second prescription.

We buried her brother, and one of my best friends, two years ago from a heroin/fentanyl overdose. His problem started when he was introduced to oxycontin at the same office.

Two people from the same family presented with similar situations who made different choices and ended up with wildly different results.

Can't blame the Dr's entirely, but there are some real greedy scumbags out there.

The pharm sales people behind this deserve their own special place in hell,

Definitely big pharm has their piece of this.
The DRs to me are the worst offenders; they took an OATH to do no harm

 

[gtb1943]

This is where I have an issue with those whowant to legalize drugs. Even if they are legal addicts will still steal to get the money to buy them.

But more importantly, the drug problem in America is as much an issue with demand as it is supply. We have chosen to legalize Marijuana to deal with both sides of this equation. Demand for illegal drugs goes away if it can be sold legally. And the supply increases driving illegal suppliers out of business - in theory. However, this does not address the aftermath of widespread drug use.

There is no easy answer to the problem or it would have been solved already. But I cannot imagine a solution that does not involved addressing the demand side. Look what we have done with smoking. We have reduced demand by increases taxes on cigarettes, banning their use in public places, and propagandizing the harmful effects of cigarette smoke. We have to do the same with drugs. This should be easy because most drugs are more dangerous than cigarette smoke.

It took DECADES to reduce smoking; even with all the commercials and everything else.
The real problem with drug addicts is that they love the effects so much that nothing else matters.
Not sure what you can do about that.