Matt Jones Video of his QB play back in Arkansas

InmanRoshi

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stasheroo;2117677 said:
And does 5 career starts over three seasons say pouring 'heart and soul' into him to you?

You think Jacksonville put their sack on the chopping block to reach for him in the 1st round just to ignore him and let him waste away? Why should Matt Jones just be handed a starting spot when he's doing nothing to earn it?

During training camp, new Wide Receivers coach, Todd Monken, challenged all of the receivers on the roster to step up their game. He made it clear that nobody was impressive enough to warrant a roster spot lock, and that there would be an open competition for the starting positions. He openly challenged Matt Jones during practices, spending an enormous amount of time coaching the former quarterback one-on-one to try to impress upon him the fact that he was not putting enough effort into certain drills. On one blocking drill in particular, Monken was so disgusted by the lack of effort that he saw from Matt Jones that he made him do it again in its entirety.

As training camp progressed, Monken continued to ride Matt Jones, dressing him down in front of his teammates and fans alike when he ran the wrong route, and the end result was an interception. On a daily basis, Matt Jones and Todd Monken would almost appear to be attached at the hip, with the fiery coach constantly in his ear hole.

Nothing changed.

So, when a lack of effort, and unwillingness or an inability to make the plays on the field resulted in a dropped catch in the back of the end zone against Tennessee, and another drop occurred when he was going over the middle against Atlanta, things went from bad to worse.

In both cases, the passes he had dropped were catchable balls.

The dropped touchdown in particular was the type of catch that he was specifically brought in to make, and one that most good wide receivers will haul in routinely.

On the crossing route against Atlanta, the fear of contact probably resulted in him dropping the pass. He was hit almost immediately after the catch, although it was neither a brutal or powerful hit. It was a clean tackle. Unfortunately, the ball was out before the hit was applied, and the label as a softy was resurrected.

When Matt was finally deactivated for the game in Denver, it was the end of a monumental effort by the coaching staff to try to light a fire under the laid back receiver to try to clarify for him that he is a professional, and that there are certain expectations attached to that label.

When his head coach, Jack Del Rio, was asked about the perception that Matt does not give enough effort, his coach was candid enough to admit that Matt’s body language, and other mannerisms in games had become a concern, and that there was clearly a lack of effort that would require the two of them to meet and discuss options. It was obvious that whatever transpired between the head coach and the player did not result in any improvement during the week leading up to the Denver game, as Jones was limited by a phantom heel injury that suddenly appeared after his coach had called him out, mildly so, in the local press.

The Jaguars were left with no alternative but to use the deactivation as a way of ratcheting up the pressure on Jones to increase his level of intensity.
 

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dbair1967;2117679 said:
maybe they want to throw it out Stash because 1) it was a meaningless final game of a season and Jones played more because Jax benched its better players and 2) Houston was decimated by injuries at the CB position last yr and 3) it was one game...Jones has never had another even remotely close to that

They benched their 'better players', none of whom have put up 1,000 yards in a season since Jimmy Smith left?

Jones had a great game that day when he actully got the chance to play, I don't care who it was against, they were NFL players. Gray actually looked in Jones' direction like a smart quarterback should . He was open, he caught the ball, he made plays.

Maybe the real trouble is that Jacksonville can't tell who its' 'better players' are?

:rolleyes:
 

Stash

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InmanRoshi;2117684 said:
You think Jacksonville put their sack on the chopping block to reach for him in the 1st round just to ignore him and let him waste away? Why should Matt Jones just be handed a starting spot when he's doing nothing to earn it?

Tell me about Todd Monken, this 'great' receivers coach the Jags have, how much experience does he have?

What kind of resume does he have with coaching receivers at the NFL level?

For perspective, how does it compare to our own Ray Sherman's?

I'll wait.
 

Chocolate Lab

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InmanRoshi;2117674 said:
CL, I don't think he's even a bad guy or has a bad attitude. I just don't think he likes playing football. It doesn't matter what line of work you're in, if you don't love what you do it's hard to ever be more than mediocre. It takes extra effort and work to truly be good at anything, and if you don't have a passion for what you do it's almost impossible to put in that commitment. I worked with a guy I thought was the laziest SOB on the face of the earth, but it turned out he was just in the wrong profession. He quit and went to culinary school to become a chef and now the guy owns two restaurants and works 7 days a week.

Matt Jones reminds me of me of Shawn Bradley ... he's an accountant or a laywer or a advertising exec at heart who just happened to hit the genetic lottery. And occasionally he flashes when the coach chews him out and/or kicks him in the butt, but it's manufactured and artificial motivation and it eventually dissipates because it doesn't come from a real place. And of course the Jacksonville coaches might get hard on him ... they've poured their heart and soul into him for the last three years trying to get him to reach his potential, and he still is just as lethargic as he ever was. That makes people resentful. I'm sure it makes his teammates resentful when they're putting in time after practice every day trying to get better, and Jones is the first guy running to the showers.

Yeah, when I said bad attitude I really meant not loving the game enough to work at it.

I don't even disagree with you much on him, IR, except that maybe it would be worth a no-cost try to make sure he never will have that motivation.

For the record, I doubt he changes either. But it has happened before. He had to have liked football at some point in his life, or he wouldn't have been the player he was in college. Let's face it, like my old coach used to say, football is not a comfortable sport. About 90% of the time, it's not fun. Two-a-days in 100 degree heat, all the conditioning you have to do, getting hurt, getting sore... You have to like the game somewhat to go through all that, and he did it for several years without pay.

But just to be clear, I do think he's a long shot and I'm sure he'll never be what he could have been. But could he help our team? Maybe.
 

InmanRoshi

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stasheroo;2117690 said:
Tell me about Todd Monken, this 'great' receivers coach the Jags have, how much experience does he have?
I've never worked with him, but maybe you should ask Dwayne Bowe. He looked pretty NFL ready by the time Monken got through with him at LSU.

It's just so typical that now the blame shift moves over to the coach now.
 

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InmanRoshi;2117698 said:
I've never worked with him, but maybe you should ask Dwayne Bowe. He looked pretty NFL ready by the time Monken got through with him at LSU.

It's just so typical that now the blame shift moves over to the coach now.

Yeah, that's about the 'non-answer' I was expecting.

Thanks for the effort.
 

InmanRoshi

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Chocolate Lab;2117692 said:
Let's face it, like my old coach used to say, football is not a comfortable sport. About 90% of the time, it's not fun. Two-a-days in 100 degree heat, all the conditioning you have to do, getting hurt, getting sore... You have to like the game somewhat to go through all that, and he did it for several years without pay.

I played high school football even though I much prefered baseball, because there were a lot of social rewards for kids who play high school football (especially in Texas). I hated two-a-days and I praticed just hard enough to get by and survive. The pratices might not be fun, but the notoriety among your peers, being the big man on campus, etc. etc. can be incentive enough to put out 75% effort to just get by to reap the social rewards (I don't know Jones' financial background enough to know if he really needed the free scholarship or not, but that could also be a motivating factor). As physically talented as he is, 75% might be enough to get by in college, but it's not in the NFL. I'm sure that even if you don't particularly love a sport completely, it's fun to just dominate over people. But when the playing field gets leveled and the God given gifts aren't enough, you have to get to work.

As far as the non-risk factor ... I don't necessarily agree with that. I've heard Darren Woodson and Troy Aikman say that they could tell the teams of the 90's were eroding away because he would see fewer and fewer players in the film room late at night. Fewer and fewer players staying after practice to work. We have a strong enough lockerroom where we can take on a few problem players here and there ... but if we keep on bringing in these guys eventually we will reach a critical mass where an undisciplined attitude, on and off the field, will start to spread to the overall character of the team. If Moose, Aikman, Woody and those guys couldn't keep it from spreading in the late 90's with 3 Superbowl Rings and the skins they had on the wall, what makes us think that Romo, Bradie James and Marc Colombo can contain it?
 

InmanRoshi

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stasheroo;2117702 said:
Yeah, that's about the 'non-answer' I was expecting.

Thanks for the effort.

First you accused the Jacksonville coaches of not putting effort into Jones because they didn't start him enough games.

I produced an article showing where they put in above and beyond the commitment.

You then shifted blame to the WR coach not knowing what he's doing.

I then show an example of a player who thrived under that coach.


You're going to herniate a disk picking up those goalposts and moving them around so much.

I could also point out that's not the first WR coach Jones has failed under with Jacksonville, nor do I even know what a WR coach has to do with a player dropping a pass because he's afraid of contact.
 

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InmanRoshi;2117709 said:
First you accused the Jacksonville coaches of not putting effort into Jones because they didn't start him enough games.

I produced an article showing where they put in above and beyond the commitment.

You did?

How many starts did Jones get under all of this 'effort'?

Try none.

Tough to 'show something' when you never get the chance.

InmanRoshi said:
You then shifted blame to the WR coach not knowing what he's doing.

I then show an example of a player who thrived under that coach.

The fact is that Monken had no prior coaching experience at the NFL level. You wouldn't admit it, so I will for you. If anyone can show me where Jones has gotten great coaching, I'd love to see it.

The fact is that Del Rio has been shuffling offensive coaches for years.

How would that work for a guy making a complete positon change?

Inman Roshi said:
You're going to herniate a disk picking up those goalposts and moving them around so much.

I could also point out that's not the first WR coach Jones has failed under with Jacksonville, nor do I even know what a WR coach has to do with a player dropping a pass because he's afraid of contact.

Who was the other receivers' coach? What his resume looks like? It was former Bengals QB Ken Anderson, some guy to be teaching receivers huh?

Maybe he was teaching Jones QB instead?

Anyway he was quickly fired along with the offensive coordinator and is now back coaching QB where he belongs.

Heck of a mentor for a guy making the transition to receiver, huh?
 

InmanRoshi

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You did?

How many starts did Jones get under all of this 'effort'?

Try none.

Tough to 'show something' when you never get the chance.

Jones got the chance every day in practice to show what he could do. You earn playing time in games from how you perform in practice.

You think just because you have a boyhood crush on a guy he should be given a free ride without having to earn it?
 

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InmanRoshi;2117720 said:
Jones got the chance every day in practice to show what he could do. You earn playing time in games from how you perform in practice.

Why don't you earn playing time from what you do in games? Seems like that's where it counts.

Nobody knows what he did or didn't show in practice. I read that Del Rio didn't like his 'body language' in practice. Seems a heck of a reason to not play a guy. I'm just glad to hear than Romo's now standing up straight....

:rolleyes:

InmanRoshi said:
You think just because you have a boyhood crush on a guy he should be given a free ride without having to earn it?

I think his play 'earned it' in 2006.

For whatever reason the Jaguars felt differently.

But then again, their track record at receiver sucks.

And not just with Matt Jones.
 

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I really like the potential of Miles, but having said that, I have not idea what he will amount to.

I have no idea what to make of Stanback or Hurd.

Chances are slim that all three of our projects will amount to something.

To me this is not about Matt, but it is about our WR situation.

I see no harm in giving a guy that has huge upside potential a shot.

It is not like Dallas is going to break the bank on this guy if they ever have a shot at him.

I have heard all the bad stuff about him and maybe it all true or maybe there is some gray area too.

I am all in favor of giving him a shot if he becomes available.
 

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gbrittain;2117771 said:
I really like the potential of Miles, but having said that, I have not idea what he will amount to.

I have no idea what to make of Stanback or Hurd.

Chances are slim that all three of our projects will amount to something.

To me this is not about Matt, but it is about our WR situation.

I see no harm in giving a guy that has huge upside potential a shot.

It is not like Dallas is going to break the bank on this guy if they ever have a shot at him.

I have heard all the bad stuff about him and maybe it all true or maybe there is some gray area too.

I am all in favor of giving him a shot if he becomes available.


Welcome aboard!

:shake:
 

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Chocolate Lab;2117668 said:
He does have attitude problems... But he's still a young guy. He can't change? Guys that have have bad reps as teammates, or hang out with drug dealers, or get arrested can change, but someone whose worst crime is being too cool for school can't? Why is that?

Like I've said before, I'd guarantee you that Jerry knows Matt's family personally. If Matt's dad says, "Jerry, Matt just doesn't really like football and I don't think he ever will", then forget it.

But it's possible that with a little experience he will learn or has learned that making hundreds of thousands of dollars is pretty cool, and you can't do that by playing pickup baskeball or starting a band.

this isn't like TO or PacMan Jones, they are tireless workers who have a passion for playing football

Matt Jones doesn't, he was lazy technique-wise as a QB at Arkansas, and it seems the trend is continuing as a WR, "dropping routine balls"

I think Matt should take a year off from football and evaluate what he truly wants to do, being away for a year made PacMan sick, maybe it has the same effect on Matt Jones, either way he should do something so that people aren't wasting their time w/ him
 

dooomsday

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stasheroo;2117690 said:
Tell me about Todd Monken, this 'great' receivers coach the Jags have, how much experience does he have?

What kind of resume does he have with coaching receivers at the NFL level?

For perspective, how does it compare to our own Ray Sherman's?

I'll wait.


I'll take a flier on him but boy it sounds like you blame everyone for Matt Jones lack of success to date on everyone but Matt Jones. This is football. All that matters is production. And he hasnt produced at a high level. Unless you compare him to other busts.

Not sure how ending in the coaches dog house enhances your argument.
 

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stasheroo;2117673 said:
At 25 years old, I think there still room for maturity and growth. I didn't have it all figured out at that age - still don't.

But even if you get the same exact guy who supposedly 'dogs it', that's been good enough to produce more touchdowns in his first three seasons of playing than :

Reggie Wayne
Steve Smith
Plaxico Burress (equal at 13)
Andre Johnson
TJ Houshmanzadeh
Donald Driver
Hines Ward

More than any of these great receivers produced in their respective first three years of playing in the NFL. And the vast majority had the benefit of playing the position in college while Jones did not.

Last time I checked, the team that scores the most touchdowns wins.

all of their arrows pointed up after 3 years

Matt Jones' points down
 

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Watching the videos reminded me what a freak this guy was. I'm wondering if his "lack of interest" is because deep down in this kid's heart, he's a quarterback, and he's used to having his hands on the ball, making plays. At first playing WR was new so he was excited and was making progress.

I don't know that this is his actual issue, just wondering. Maybe a change of scenary and the hype of playing in Dallas will get his competitive juices going again.

Whether we get Jones or not, I'd really like to see Jason Garrett incorporate
some trickery into our offense. With Crayton and Stanback playing QB in college, TO's ungodly athleticism, and Tony Romo's competitive nature, I think we could really surprise people with some trick plays. I know we saw TO line up in the backfield a few times last year but I'd like to see what he could do on a sweep play to the wideside of the field. I'm sure Romo wouldn't mind running some decoy pass patterns as Stanback ran a few plays out of the shotgun.
 

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Bob Sacamano;2117878 said:
all of their arrows pointed up after 3 years

Matt Jones' points down

As long as he's in Jacksonville it does.

But again, his TD numbers are still better.....
 

Bob Sacamano

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stasheroo;2117893 said:
As long as he's in Jacksonville it does.

what makes you think it's going to change when he has to learn a whole, 'nother system

while he's still developing?

Ray Sherman is a great coach, but he's not a miracle-worker

stasheroo said:
But again, his TD numbers are still better.....

so...

he's still bad
 

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My point is the Cowboys have a big need for a #2 WR; his skills show he's got the talent to be that guy but he hasn't produced enough in Jax so there good possibility he'll be let go.

If Jerry gets positive feedback from his Arkansas contacts on this kid & WR coach Sherman likes what he sees of him/wants a shot to restart the guy's career, then bring him in for a look. If Jones wants to play for us at near minimum wage but understands we expect him to play his butt off both in practice & on the field, study game film & do everything necessary to became the player his measurables say he could be, then we should sign him. If he doesn't satisfy Sherman, then cut him w/o a backward glance. It's a small risk compared to what Jerry is taking with Pacman.

Why do I think we should take this risk? Because Jerry has a history of doing so and many work out.

a. Look back to 92 when we heard Charles Haley was available. Haley helped SF win 2 SBs but was such a divisive player in the lockerroom they wanted get rid of him & hoped trading him to the Cowboys would ruin our team. Instead he worked his butt off, was no problem & we won 3 SBs.
b. Novack wasn't doing anything in Arizona so Jimmy/Jerry grabbed him off List B; he became Aikman's go to guy & played in a few pro bowls. Helped win 3 SBs for us.
c. Instead of focusing on the past, let's move to today's Cowboys. Nobody wanted take risk to sign TO except Denver which was offering him peanuts. Jerry stepped up with big check but couched it in 3 1 year deals. He's caught 28 TDs for us and been a big factor in our making the playoffs.
c. Leonard Davis was considered a bust & lazy in Arizona. We all knew what happened when he came to Dallas; need I say pro bowl again.
d. Ken Hamlin wasn't pursued by his own Seattle team & no other team willing give him long range deal so he signed for probably below market value for 1 year. He played in his first pro bowl with us.
e. Heck, we started a QB in 06 who wasn't even drafted when he came out of college back in 03; Jerry paid rather cheap price of $10,000 to sign him. Admittedly he had no off the field or on the field problems but took about taking a risk. Anybody regret the Romo signing?

Yes, Jerry has signed and drafted lot of players further into the past who haven't been as successful as the 4 I've cited. Signing Matt Jones might well fail in Dallas. OTOH a chance in scenary, different coaching staff & different teammates (and QB) might change his attitude. No guarantees & he's gone if he doesn't work his butt off. But we allowed bring in 80 players to TC; so what's the harm if we he's 1 of those 80? If not, does anyone have a better option beyond saying they want to stick with our own guys.
 
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