Mayowa, Russell, Tapper, Irving

[CCBoy]

I tell you guys, this fan appreciates what they observe being articulated in a constructive manner, to discuss more fully their observations.

If Lawrence comes back, after four games, and continues to develop into a legitimate outside force....hey, things are getting quite a bit better.

He may not be a DeMarcus Ware, but hey, he would step up to relevant. That is still on the table.

I think that the team does have something to take note with, in the presence of Mayowa, Irving, and Russell. That is relevant as well.

Mix in the 'rook,' Tapper, and the team does have both youth and development there.

I have to give faith to the Scout Department and the long term developing abilities of Rod Marinelli and his staff. They know what they want and how to get this group to where they are going with this.

Who knows, Dallas might sign a top outside threat in free agency next season, but for now, the team needs three strongly functional defensive ends. I feel Lawrence will be one, and they will get two functional pieces in Mayowa, Irving, or Russell. That is at least functional direction.

The defensive line's interior is quite improved. It has Thornton, and a healthy Crawford now. Throw in the presently injured, 'rook,' and there are three strong pieces to work the interior.

Next season, Jones should be the MLB. Sign an outside pressure in free agency...and add a stud 3 technique in the draft...and a cornerback or two will make this current defense potentially a very tough defense.

 

[AshyLarry06]

And the flipside to that is you just listed 4 guys who likely will never be much more than JAGs. Not sure why people keep listing these guys as if they are superstars in waiting. We'll be lucky if one develops into a stud and one develops into a serviceable player.

I hope all four become studs but it's unlikely and the reality is that the DE spot right now for the Cowboys is in a precarious situation.

Let's put it another way. If the new coaching staff in Philly ran out Russell, Mayowa, Tapper and Irving as their DE rotation to start the season, there is not a shred of doubt in my mind there would be fans here talking about what an embarrassment that is and how Philly would lack any credible DE talent.

Then again, the same Philly defense u speak of was top 5 in sacks last year n ran out who exactly at OLB? Connor barwin n Brandon graham? Not exactly household names and most likely benefitted from the stellar play of the interior guys (which hopefully n very well could also happen here). I'm not saying I'm not bummed out about Gregory and certainly it will b an uphill climb, but to sit here and already throw up the white flag before even a single training camp snap is mind boggling imo. Why don't we see how the entire unit performs before throwing these guys under the bus?

 

[12+88=7]

Hasselback was on ESPN and said no one on set could name our starting DL for Week 1

My guess is.... Russell....TCrawford....Thornton....Mayowa

They had no clue. They didn't even have Russell on the depth chart.

They had Gachkar as the backup MLB. The LBers with McClain gone would probably be Lee(will), Hitchens(mike), and Durant(sam). Gachkar would probably be 3rd or 4th string on the depth chart for MLB.

 

[Kaiser]

But I see what you're trying to say and while I can agree to some point, 6 and 7 sacks isn't anything to write home about and says more about a low bar for production than it does for success.

And it's a shallow well I would rather not be trying and hoping to go back to.

Yeahhh, its a huge difference between 7 sacks and 8. We only had one guy with more than 7 sacks last year, DLaw with 8.

I cited Darren McFadden as a good analogy, he isn't an All Pro but gave us a good season, cost nothing and greatly outperformed his salary. Selvie did that his first year and so did Mincey. If Mayowa does the same, its a win for the team.

You can call it "bottom feeding" but that's the reality of the NFL under the salary cap. If you want to pay the Romos and Dez Bryants, you have to have the bargain guys like DMC.

 

[CCBoy]

Yeahhh, its a huge difference between 7 sacks and 8. We only had one guy with more than 7 sacks last year, DLaw with 8.

I cited Darren McFadden as a good analogy, he isn't an All Pro but gave us a good season, cost nothing and greatly outperformed his salary. Selvie did that his first year and so did Mincey. If Mayowa does the same, its a win for the team.

You can call it "bottom feeding" but that's the reality of the NFL under the salary cap. If you want to pay the Romos and Dez Bryants, you have to have the bargain guys like DMC.

True...and a function of 1/3 roster churn a season.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

Im taking about this:



Learn writing comprehension first.

We are talking about 2 different things. At the start of the conversation someone was talking about these players as the reason we lost to GB when none of those players were on the team. Never said they will break out and be solid players. I said they could never contribute or they could....young and unknown.

The entire basis was how can you blame players for something when they weren't on the team. Continue to think otherwise is a comprehension problem.....also jumping in without reading all the comments is another problem.

 

[wileedog]

Clowney? He's been a steaming pile of garbage since he was drafted. Epic bust so far. And didn't he have microfracture surgery, or something? I wouldn't be counting on Clowney for anything. And the Texans don't have much in the middle other than Wilfork when I glanced at their roster.

It doesn't matter. They are a 3-4 team, you are comparing apples and oranges as far as DEs and the Texans have a great LB core. Last year was effectively Clowney's rookie year, he's only going to get better.

I would trade our front 7 for Houston's right now and be ecstatic even without Watt.

 

[Stash]

Yeahhh, its a huge difference between 7 sacks and 8. We only had one guy with more than 7 sacks last year, DLaw with 8.

And is that some sort of attempt at justification or an indictment over a poor pass rush?

I cited Darren McFadden as a good analogy, he isn't an All Pro but gave us a good season, cost nothing and greatly outperformed his salary. Selvie did that his first year and so did Mincey. If Mayowa does the same, its a win for the team.

You can call it "bottom feeding" but that's the reality of the NFL under the salary cap. If you want to pay the Romos and Dez Bryants, you have to have the bargain guys like DMC.

I'm not criticizing the act of getting cheap talent that outperforms the cost, that's great, my disappointment is having to rely on talent like that to make up for shortcomings.

 

[Stash]

We are talking about 2 different things. At the start of the conversation someone was talking about these players as the reason we lost to GB when none of those players were on the team. Never said they will break out and be solid players. I said they could never contribute or they could....young and unknown.

The entire basis was how can you blame players for something when they weren't on the team. Continue to think otherwise is a comprehension problem.....also jumping in without reading all the comments is another problem.

Ok, call it whatever you'd like to, this conversation isn't worth the time or effort for either one of us.

 

[Blast From The Past]

A GM nor a HC or a position coach can predict with a 100% certainty what a player will or will not do. It is a total crap shoot.

 

[Nightman]

Yeahhh, its a huge difference between 7 sacks and 8. We only had one guy with more than 7 sacks last year, DLaw with 8.

I cited Darren McFadden as a good analogy, he isn't an All Pro but gave us a good season, cost nothing and greatly outperformed his salary. Selvie did that his first year and so did Mincey. If Mayowa does the same, its a win for the team.

You can call it "bottom feeding" but that's the reality of the NFL under the salary cap. If you want to pay the Romos and Dez Bryants, you have to have the bargain guys like DMC.

But then midnight strikes and they turn back into pumpkins and stink Year 2

You can't fake it for long in the NFL

 

[big dog cowboy]

JJ Watt just had back surgery and will be out maybe 10 weeks.

Anyone who believes that must have forgot about the drive he has. I'll be shocked if he doesn't play and play well week 1.

 

[JPostSam]

Of course they have. It is one of the easier positons to draft in comparison to most and they have spent three first round choices and basically got another one for next to nothing by signing Collins. The degree of difficulty is not nearly that difficult.

arkin and peterman say hi.

 

[Rogerthat12]

Yeahhh, its a huge difference between 7 sacks and 8. We only had one guy with more than 7 sacks last year, DLaw with 8.

I cited Darren McFadden as a good analogy, he isn't an All Pro but gave us a good season, cost nothing and greatly outperformed his salary. Selvie did that his first year and so did Mincey. If Mayowa does the same, its a win for the team.

You can call it "bottom feeding" but that's the reality of the NFL under the salary cap. If you want to pay the Romos and Dez Bryants, you have to have the bargain guys like DMC.

You are correct my friend but one thing they could have done is add another mid-range priced free agent DE without ruining the model of not desiring to overpay absurd free agent contracts.

The main issue is that Dallas has a disproportionate and unilateral allocation of resources on the offensive side of the ball including contracts and draft capital with future contracts pending for the offensive line.

To further compound the issue, defensively, the Cowboys have spent some draft capital but have very little production to show for it and also have taken big risks with respect to premium draft selections.

It did not help that Mo has been a bust and that the substantial Carr contract, regardless of market value considerations, was in retrospect a huge mistake.

Out of necessity, Dallas will have to start drafting better on defense and definitely will have to adjust their draft approach with respect to character/addiction concern prospects while also focusing on drafting healthy impact players.

They may need to add some impact free agents on defense if drafting defensive impact players continues to fail to bear fruit and pay the piper for a talent upgrade!

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Freeney almost had a double digit sack season a year ago.

We're not looking for an answer. We just need a band-aid right now.

All it takes is for a season for you to go from being a good player to a bad one. We've seen it time and time again. There's going to be a Cowboy on this team we expect to be good based on what he did last season and he won't be. That's just the NFL.

You aren't looking for a primo talent at this point. You are looking for a serviceable vet that can help a little in the pass rush department. Freeney is that type of guy. No one is thinking you are going to find a 10 sack guy on the street, but you can probably get 6 or so sacks out of Freeney next year which would be a help.

We have a bunch of serviceable young players on this team we need to find out if they can play in this league. If all you want is 6 sacks I see no reason why some of these guys here like Irving or Crawford can't do it. Maranelli got that out of Mincey and Selvie.

Picking over scraps that someone else cut and didn't want, which is where this team currently finds themselves.

Yeah I mean but that's where you find yourself when you enter free agency too though right? You're not getting premiere talent in free agency. Every once in awhile there's a Suh out there but the money is so much that you have to hurt the rest of your defense to sign them.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Of course they have. It is one of the easier positons to draft in comparison to most and they have spent three first round choices and basically got another one for next to nothing by signing Collins. The degree of difficulty is not nearly that difficult.

Ehhh I disagree here. You can find linemen but you don't find premiere linemen like the ones the Cowboys have had. The Browns and Raiders get top 10 picks and invest in linemen all the time and can't find them.

The Cowboys made it look easy being 3/3 on Tyron, Frederick's and Martin but trust there's nothing easy about finding perennial 1st and 2nd team offensive linemen.

 

[Kaiser]

You are correct my friend but one thing they could have done is add another mid-range priced free agent DE without ruining the model of not desiring to overpay absurd free agent contracts.

But who in particular? I never thought there was much in the way of FA DE's and just went back and looked at the list. I don't see any better bets than Mayowa - or Russell and Irving for that matter. I see Mayowa as a project similar to Jermy Parnell, only someone else did the development work.

Another note in looking at the list of FAs, the Cowboys gave Thornton the 5th highest amount of guaranteed money of the FA Defensive Lineman this offseason. I think he is going to have a much bigger effect on the passing game than people think, he is capable of penetrating from the 1T spot in ways this team hasn't seen in a long time.

 

[LocimusPrime]

Am I missing something?
Russell- 5th rd draft pick who couldn't make last years 53 man roster except for 1 game
Mayowa- 2 NFL sacks and has now been on three teams- kinda like the Kenyon Coleman deal. We got him from the raiders too.
Irving - signed off another teams PS

Now I understand that we have some hope that our later rd defensive picks Collins and Tapper might develop into something, We have had similar hopes with guys like Ben Bass, Sean Lissemore, Josh Brent.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Am I missing something?
Russell- 5th rd draft pick who couldn't make last years 53 man roster except for 1 game
Mayowa- 2 NFL sacks and has now been on three teams- kinda like the Kenyon Coleman deal. We got him from the raiders too.
Irving - signed off another teams PS

Now I understand that we have some hope that our later rd defensive picks Collins and Tapper might develop into something, We have had similar hopes with guys like Ben Bass, Sean Lissemore, Josh Brent.

We're comparing them to Selvie, Mincey, and the corpse of Anthony Spencer.

I cannot tell you that Russell and Mayowa can play. I haven't seen them succeed in this scheme. Irving has a fair chance to bust out. His quickness and size is remarkable and he bit hard as a puppy for us.

Lissemore was a 3-4 guy and I think he's still in the league. He was starting for SD for awhile at the very least while Velcro was stinking up the middle of our defense. Brent could play too but he killed his friend . Bass was a spare but again more of a 3-4 guy who ended up drawing interest from NE if I'm notmistaken.

 

[Rogerthat12]

But who in particular? I never thought there was much in the way of FA DE's and just went back and looked at the list. I don't see any better bets than Mayowa - or Russell and Irving for that matter. I see Mayowa as a project similar to Jermy Parnell, only someone else did the development work.

Another note in looking at the list of FAs, the Cowboys gave Thornton the 5th highest amount of guaranteed money of the FA Defensive Lineman this offseason. I think he is going to have a much bigger effect on the passing game than people think, he is capable of penetrating from the 1T spot in ways this team hasn't seen in a long time.

Mario Williams and Robert Ayers were available and signed reasonable contracts, they could have given you experience and known ability at the position.

I have no problem with Mayowa, Russell and Irvin in terms of potential but I certainly would like some experience at the rush end position.

I do think Thornton will be an asset and will assist in pushing the pocket from the interior but addressing rush end more substantially in free agency, notwithstanding Mayowa and Crawford, would have mitigated the issues we are currently experiencing at least to some extent.

We may still add someone with some experience that still has some gas left in the tank in the coming weeks.