McShay on Cowboys DE target

[reddyuta]

McKinley reminds me of a guy we already have on our roster in Tapper. Not to mention, I think Tapper has lost some weight and could even be quicker at this point. I'm in the glass half full crowd with Tapper and Smith so...

Charleton, Watt and Willis seam a little stiff to bend the corner quick enough, but maybe they can work on it and get better under Marinelli...who knows. Watt seems like the best candidate of those three.

I believe Harris played in the 235-240 range at Missouri, so when he bulked up to 253 for the combine his numbers were bad...go figure. I think the speed he showed at the combine is what you'll get as an edge rusher at 250+.

There's no chance of us drafting Garrett, Thomas or Barnett and I just don't like the idea of Basham at 28. I have Basham, Harris, Rivers, Willis and Lawson all in the 2nd round.

So, this leaves Bowser as the most intriguing prospect left (at least for me) for that edge rusher at 28. Bowser has enough size 6-3 250, arm length 33 1/4, can bend quickly with a 6.75 cone and can burst out of his stance with a 1.59 split.

Right now, I think Bowser is the 4th best edge rushing prospect and wouldn't be upset if he was our 28 pick....but will he even make it?

I thnk Bowser may be best fit as a SAM i wouldnt discount us drafting him but would you spend a 1st Rd pick on him?

 

[rambo2]

I just wonder the utility of spending 28 on a CB in this class. There is not going to be a player there that is significantly better than someone you can get at 60 unless something weird happens.

The pass rushers and corner class will play off each other in this draft. No doubt.

The depth of the corner class should make teams "wait" but the pass rushers might not be as strong at the top as needed to avoid a run.

Will be interesting to see what side of the fence has more rabid dogs on it.


Not really a Harris fan. Just better than some of the alternatives.

If they draft Kevin King in the first and Marcus Williams in the 2nd, they will be bringing in 2dbs with great hands that create turnovers.

 

[Alexander]

I thnk Bowser may be best fit as a SAM i wouldnt discount us drafting him but would you spend a 1st Rd pick on him?

A SAM in this scheme? Absolutely not.

Unless you think he can rush the passer and be a down lineman, I don't see any reason to consider him.

Imagine Marinelli taking that square peg and forcing it into a round hole.

 

[Silverstar]

A SAM in this scheme? Absolutely not.

Unless you think he can rush the passer and be a down lineman, I don't see any reason to consider him.

Imagine Marinelli taking that square peg and forcing it into a round hole.

You mean like coaching a rookie?

 

[WillieBeamen]

I dont get the Takk hate on this board. A lot of you would rather us select some Byron Jones-esque corner at 28, that will make no difference because we still have no pass rush

 

[StarBoyz83]

I dont get the Takk hate on this board. A lot of you would rather us select some Byron Jones-esque corner at 28, that will make no difference because we still have no pass rush

Takk won't help either since he's Injured lol

 

[stilltheguru88]

Watch these three straight plays starting at 5:30. Most impressive rushing I've seen from watching any of these guys. 3 straight plays of non stop pressure.

 

[gmoney112]

I thnk Bowser may be best fit as a SAM i wouldnt discount us drafting him but would you spend a 1st Rd pick on him?

I'm guessing you mean a SAM as a LEO type role. We don't really use our guys that way, but I agree that's one of his best fits. Probably won't be with us though.

I like McKinley. Barnett is my #1 if he's there, but McKinley is a solid player. I've been Tapper's unofficial pimp on CZ but McKinley is a better *pass rushing* prospect.

I don't think his height is an issue, a lot of guys like height because it means longer arms to keep OT's off, more room to fill out frame, using leverage, batting down balls, etc.

But Takk has almost 35 inch arms (irving has 37.75 for the record, good lord), that's pretty good. Those are longer arms than DWare and Julius Peppers. I don't think being 6'2 is an issue at all as far as him actually competing against NFL OT's. He needs to get stronger and pack on some more *good weight*, but that's basically every DE to ever come out.

The injury sucks but he's a quality pass rusher.

 

[LatinMind]

To Me personally there are 3 DEs who are justified being RD1 picks, and another if he wasnt injured would be too.

Myles Garrett
Solomon Thomas
Derek Barnett

Takkarist McKinley

The rest IMO are all RD2 guys. But because of need they will be picked in RD1.

The real value in RD1 is CB.

And i think a trade could possibly be there aswell.
Pittsburgh and NO are looking for their next QB as both are going to be in limbo after this yr. Roethlesberger is already thinking about retirement, and Brees is already Owed 18mil from 12018-2020 in restructured money.

So these teams at the top of RD2 could be in play. A team like cleveland could be the right team to trade down with.

 

[LatinMind]

Watt is good vs the run.

Passplays
:23 Passrush non existent. Tries to bullrush RT, no go. From Standup
:54 Again no pressure from Standup
1:05 again no pressure. Standup out really wide
1:43 Again no pressure, trying to out muscle RT, by the time get gets off block QB has thrown the ball. Standup
2:02 Stunts inside and looks to have a big lane to QB but gets easily blocked out by G. QB steps up. Standup
2:38 Again no pressure straight line rush no movement. Standup
2:59 Rushes and fights inside, QB has ball gone before he gets clear of blocker. Standup
3:09 Tries to bullrush and QB runs right by him because he cant get off RT block. Standup
3:21 Goes inside and gets piled up on blocks. Standup
4:32 Gets good push on the LT. SLB gets the sack and Watt finishes. Standup
Will note on here, Watt is celebrating alone, while everybody else is with Dooley who got the sack.
5:20 Watt go inside nothing there. Standup
5:27 Watt stunt all the way around the interior and by the time hes clear QB has thrown the ball. Standup
5:40 Watt gets around the Rt and gets to the QB but he gets the ball out. Standup Wide
5:46 Watt again beats Rt but QB has the ball out by that time to WR for first down. Standup

I would really like to know where the guy who posted the tweet on Watts 3pt stance pressure was gotten from. Because not one play was this guys hand on the ground. And he was linedup really wide on plays he got pressure. When he was on the T's outside shoulder the guy couldnt get off their blocks.

And im sorry there was 1 play in the 3 you said that he had pressure. It might look like it because hes in the clear, but by the time hes near the QB the ball had already been thrown or is being thrown. Thats not pressure. If so, Tyrone Crawford would be one of the best DEs in the league in terms of pressure on a QB.

He's a OLB for a 3-4 team. If he's near a T he's not going to get off that block. He needs to be lined up wide. IMO he looks like a really good ILB for a 3-4 team. Which some teams were scouting him for by the way.

 

[The Cleaner]

Tak McKinley reminds me of Danielle Hunter, similar speed, arm length, motor and rawness coming out of college. That may seem like a recommendation, but Hunter was seen as a risky pick at the time, and was selected in the 3rd round. Tak is both more injury prone, and less athletic than Hunter, with a three-cone drill around half a second slower. I think the bust potential is high, I don't know if he can turn the corner in the pros, he might be too tight in his hips. I would not take him in the first.

The other names like Watt, Harris, Willis and Charlton also have issues. I kind of like Willis the best because he tested out well, and although he also does not turn the corner well, his issues may not be athletic, but rather that he does not know what he is doing. His pass rushing technique is to get in a 4 point stance, rush straight at the OT's outside shoulder, and then slam his hands into him as soon as possible. There is no back up plan, if that technique doesn't work, he tries it again about 15 more times anyway. I saw one or two plays where he looked like he could do more, so he would be interesting later on in the draft, but he has a lot to learn. I wish I knew what Harris weighed at his pro day, where he performed well, because he was not good at 250+ at the combine. TJ Watt can at least play football, but I don't know if he is a 4-3 end, and I'd be nervous about picking a guy who was injured 2 of the last 3 seasons. Charlton is actually the one guy who might be available in the late first who can get low and get around the OT, but he is also the one guy who lacks timed speed.

I think the Cowboys are better off trading down or picking another position in the first. I have the feeling that the Cowboys may go DE though, they will probably take a high motor athletic guy because they think Rod can coach them up.

 

[stilltheguru88]

Watt is good vs the run.

Passplays
:23 Passrush non existent. Tries to bullrush RT, no go. From Standup
:54 Again no pressure from Standup
1:05 again no pressure. Standup out really wide
1:43 Again no pressure, trying to out muscle RT, by the time get gets off block QB has thrown the ball. Standup
2:02 Stunts inside and looks to have a big lane to QB but gets easily blocked out by G. QB steps up. Standup
2:38 Again no pressure straight line rush no movement. Standup
2:59 Rushes and fights inside, QB has ball gone before he gets clear of blocker. Standup
3:09 Tries to bullrush and QB runs right by him because he cant get off RT block. Standup
3:21 Goes inside and gets piled up on blocks. Standup
4:32 Gets good push on the LT. SLB gets the sack and Watt finishes. Standup
Will note on here, Watt is celebrating alone, while everybody else is with Dooley who got the sack.
5:20 Watt go inside nothing there. Standup
5:27 Watt stunt all the way around the interior and by the time hes clear QB has thrown the ball. Standup
5:40 Watt gets around the Rt and gets to the QB but he gets the ball out. Standup Wide
5:46 Watt again beats Rt but QB has the ball out by that time to WR for first down. Standup

I would really like to know where the guy who posted the tweet on Watts 3pt stance pressure was gotten from. Because not one play was this guys hand on the ground. And he was linedup really wide on plays he got pressure. When he was on the T's outside shoulder the guy couldnt get off their blocks.

And im sorry there was 1 play in the 3 you said that he had pressure. It might look like it because hes in the clear, but by the time hes near the QB the ball had already been thrown or is being thrown. Thats not pressure. If so, Tyrone Crawford would be one of the best DEs in the league in terms of pressure on a QB.

He's a OLB for a 3-4 team. If he's near a T he's not going to get off that block. He needs to be lined up wide. IMO he looks like a really good ILB for a 3-4 team. Which some teams were scouting him for by the way.

The first one was a stunt. The other two he beat the rt. I'll keep watching his tape for 3 point stance pressure though. Either way I think Harris is too small so it's either Watt or Basham for me as a 28 DE

 

[LatinMind]

The first one was a stunt. The other two he beat the rt. I'll keep watching his tape for 3 point stance pressure though. Either way I think Harris is too small so it's either Watt or Basham for me as a 28 DE

ive watched most of his videos from draftbreakdown. and theres not many

 

[CATCH17]

If we go DE I hope it's Charlton if the pick is between Takk, Harris, and Charlton.

I think he has the size and speed to impose his will better then the other 2 and just more upside.


Give me the guy with the elite physical attributes and let's hope 2 or 3 years from now you can mold that into an elite player.

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

If we go DE I hope it's Charlton if the pick is between Takk, Harris, and Charlton.

I think he has the size and speed to impose his will better then the other 2 and just more upside.


Give me the guy with the elite physical attributes and let's hope 2 or 3 years from now you can mold that into an elite player.

Just don't know if Taco has the athleticism for our WDE position. He's perfect for SDE.

 

[Szczepanik]

We might not even draft a DE. If we do it will be Watt.

I could see a draft with 2 CB, S, LB , TE.

Aka

King, Williams, best CB avail, Blair Brown and Kittle.

Dallas could bite the bullet and cement a new secondary and LB group if they draft Blair.

Not sure what to think.

 

[CATCH17]

Just don't know if Taco has the athleticism for our WDE position. He's perfect for SDE.

He probably doesn't but the WDEs in this draft aren't anything special.

Charlton has the size and a coach like Marinelli would be perfect for fixing all of his current weaknesses.

 

[CATCH17]

We might not even draft a DE. If we do it will be Watt.

I could see a draft with 2 CB, S, LB , TE.

Aka

King, Williams, best CB avail, Blair Brown and Kittle.

Dallas could bite the bullet and cement a new secondary and LB group if they draft Blair.

Not sure what to think.

Watt is an OLB.

There is no way he can hold up as an NFL DE.


He's going to be similar to Clay Matthews but my question is how will he be used in a Rod Marinelli defense that maximizes his talent and I just don't see any way we do something outside the box with any player we draft.

TJ Watt would be a waste here.

 

[NorthwestDallas40]

He probably doesn't but the WDEs in this draft aren't anything special.

Charlton has the size and a coach like Marinelli would be perfect for fixing all of his current weaknesses.

Maybe so. I would not be unhappy with Charlton if McClay thinks he is better pick over Watt and Bowser. I prefer Takk and Harris over any of them.

 

[CATCH17]

Maybe so. I would not be unhappy with Charlton if McClay thinks he is better pick over Watt and Bowser. I prefer Takk and Harris over any of them.

Tak 6'2 250.... Harris 6'3 250 with short arms and small hands.


I do not want to use a first on these guys in fear that they just don't have the physical ability that will ever warrant a first round pick.

Give me one of these tall corners over them any day. Some of these corners have ridiculous upside.