Newman vs. Vasher...Dollars and Cents

DCBoysfan

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ADMIN EDIT: Written by LatinMind

Nath Vasher 2004 rookie yr
career numbers
120 tackles 16 int's 17 pass def

Terence Newman
2004 to 2006
190 tackles 8 int's 53 pass def

Newman is a better tackler, vasher is the better playmaker, newman gets thrown at more, deflections indicate that. some of that is the product of that bears defense. maybe dallas should take a page out of the bears book, and sign newman now to an extension, to make it relativley cheaper, then just a whole new deal. it would be a stupid thing to sign newman to a 6-8 yr deal for a ridiculous amount of money when he'll be 30, and turning 31 when he gets his new deal, that is if dallas decides to wait. newman is roughly two yrs older then clements, and 4 yrs older then vasher.

that with the impending Romo contract, most likely a 40-50 mil deal over 5-6 yrs. And the possibility of a 65 mil deal if dallas does indeed get the #1 pick overall. could the cowboys afford to also pay newman? This one of the reason i dont think LJ will be in Dallas either. or Dallas will sign, Flozell, or julius. Also remember If Hamlin is indeed the key for FS, he'll get a bigger deal too. As will Colombo if he proves his worth, Dallas has promised to take care of him. Ferguson Might be cut because of an impeding newman deal. Canty is due a new contract as his expires next yr. Barbers expires in 08. Dallas has alot more to think bout then satisfying newmans needs. He signed a rich rookie contract, greed shouldnt be in his heart. But dollar signs have no conscience.

Dont laugh, or judge when I say the smartest thing to do could be to frachise his *** for a few yrs. He wont be happy, but he'll be paid a hefty sum of money. Maybe he should "take one for the team" as Ellis did. See if he's making them jokes when Jerry tells him, I dont talk to people under contract.

For me its a team concept, whatevers best for the team. Owens has been labeled a Me first player, but his contract goes down every yr. Not once has he said restructure. When the time comes, will the Newman who talks like he's a team first kind of player show up? Or will the greed come out?

Vasher got 28 mil with 14 in guarantees over 5 yrs. I'd like to see newman get a 5 yr deal for 35, with 17 mil guaranteed over the first 3 with minimum to livable base salaries. Newman has been good, but he hasnt been great. He's not worth 80 mil, or even 50 mil. His age and lack of playmaking ability are what keeps him from being Elite. 3 years for newman, and let him try to find a big deal someplace else. Dallas has youth across the board. With two exceptions. WR, and CB. Time to dedicate a couple of drafts.

Newmans Clock is ticking, Hopefully its not a bomb with a faulty Timer.
 

stilltheguru

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ERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR you sir are wrong!


Vasher is the better playmaker?nope.


They play in different schemes. Give newman that great front 4 that the bears have and he will have more pics than Vasher because he is quite simply better. If Newman could play cover 2 with a good front 7 and guard the wr moreso than the flats he would have more pics. But with our pass rush if he goes toward the wr more like Vasher does we would get destroyed in the flats even worse than last year.

Vasher is a top 5 corner but better than Newman?NO!


As for his age. If he is able to keep his body in shape i dont see anything wrong with giving him a 4 year contract with big money. People just dont understand how good he is. The only cb on his level is Champ Bailey. I think this new defensive scheme is going to show everybody what Newman is really about.
 

adamknite

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Newman is older but it isn't like he's been playing in the league for 8 years already. I bet he still has some good years ahead of him.
 

Yakuza Rich

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newman gets thrown at more, deflections indicate that.

That's not necessarily true in a lot of cases. AdamJT probably has a better answer to that question.

Don't forget to mention the Bears also had a far better pass rush than Dallas.





YAKUZA
 

jterrell

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Ultimately Newman wants shutdown corner money.
Can't blame him for wanting it at all, just like I don't blame Ellis for wanting pass rusher money.

If I had a winning lotto ticket I'd go cash it in. These guys skillsets are their lottery tickets.

From a team/business standpoint of course they do not want to pay anyone more than they have to.

I am not mad at either side in this stuff.

Long as they aren't passing our playbook to our rivals or loafing on the field they can call Jerry any bad names they want, egg his house, sit out training camp or whatever it takes to get paid.

Someone will pay Newman shutdown corner money. I wouldn't based on age and his style which is more play the man than attack the ball, but good grief I'd rather not ever be in the situation because he is too good to lose while at the same time its a hard pill to swallow to commit all that cap room to him yearly long term into his 30s.
 

firehawk350

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stilltheguru;1540145 said:
The only cb on his level is Champ Bailey. I think this new defensive scheme is going to show everybody what Newman is really about.

Champ Bailey has 10 INTs. Newman has 1. They have the same passes deflected but I remember that the amount of catches given up for Bailey was something like 7 or 14 or something really low. So low that if the pass was in Champ's direction, there was an equal chance Champ would come down with it vs. the receiver.

Newman is good, but not great. Champ is great.
 

DCBoysfan

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stilltheguru;1540145 said:
ERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR you sir are wrong!


Vasher is the better playmaker?nope.


They play in different schemes. Give newman that great front 4 that the bears have and he will have more pics than Vasher because he is quite simply better. If Newman could play cover 2 with a good front 7 and guard the wr moreso than the flats he would have more pics. But with our pass rush if he goes toward the wr more like Vasher does we would get destroyed in the flats even worse than last year.

Vasher is a top 5 corner but better than Newman?NO!





As for his age. If he is able to keep his body in shape i dont see anything wrong with giving him a 4 year contract with big money. People just dont understand how good he is. The only cb on his level is Champ Bailey. I think this new defensive scheme is going to show everybody what Newman is really about.





My fault I forgot to indicate that I copied this writing from another forum, I just found the economic part of the writing interesting. I agree that Newman is the better corner and he is a true Man-2-Man corner unlike Vasher who plays ALOT of cover-2-Zone
 

tomson75

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firehawk350;1540182 said:
Champ Bailey has 10 INTs. Newman has 1. They have the same passes deflected but I remember that the amount of catches given up for Bailey was something like 7 or 14 or something really low. So low that if the pass was in Champ's direction, there was an equal chance Champ would come down with it vs. the receiver.

Newman is good, but not great. Champ is great.

You want to talk low? How about 2 touchdowns given up in the last two years? Is that low enough for you? 0 in 2005, and 2 in 2006 IIRC. That's pretty damn GREAT if you ask me. If you're basing any of your argument of off Joyners' metrics, just do yourself a favor and stop right now, they've been proven faulty numerous times on this board.

As much as you'd hate to admit it, being a Commander fan and all, Newman is one of the top 3 corners in the league...and by far the best in the NFC east.
 

firehawk350

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tomson75;1540195 said:
You want to talk low? How about 2 touchdowns given up in the last two years? Is that low enough for you? 0 in 2005, and 2 in 2006 IIRC. That's pretty damn GREAT if you ask me. If you're basing any of your argument of off Joyners' metrics, just do yourself a favor and stop right now, they've been proven faulty numerous times on this board.

As much as you'd hate to admit it, being a Commander fan and all, Newman is one of the top 3 corners in the league...and by far the best in the NFC east.

Oh, so when it supports a Cowboys player, Joyner's metrics are gold (I remember them being thrown around in a Witten vs. Cooley debate) but when they are showing a Boys' player's fault, they are faulty.

I agree that Joyner's metrics aren't perfect, no stat is, but catches allowed (while subjective) isn't "his stat".

Anyways, Newman is NOT one of the top 3 CBs in the league. I will accept top 10, maybe even top 5. But no way is he top 3. Asante Samuel, Nate Clements, Charles Woodson and Rashaen Mathis are all superior to Newman is every statistical category by a good margin.

Most (relatively) unbiased sources has him ranked from 10-20.
 

Vintage

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tomson75;1540195 said:
You want to talk low? How about 2 touchdowns given up in the last two years? Is that low enough for you? 0 in 2005, and 2 in 2006 IIRC. That's pretty damn GREAT if you ask me. If you're basing any of your argument of off Joyners' metrics, just do yourself a favor and stop right now, they've been proven faulty numerous times on this board.

As much as you'd hate to admit it, being a Commander fan and all, Newman is one of the top 3 corners in the league...and by far the best in the NFC east.


Newman gave up 3 TD's last year.

Peyton Manning to Reggie Wayne.
Michael Vick to Ashley Lelie.
Jon Kitna to Mike Williams.
 

Vintage

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firehawk350;1540229 said:
Oh, so when it supports a Cowboys player, Joyner's metrics are gold (I remember them being thrown around in a Witten vs. Cooley debate) but when they are showing a Boys' player's fault, they are faulty.

I agree that Joyner's metrics aren't perfect, no stat is, but catches allowed (while subjective) isn't "his stat".

Anyways, Newman is NOT one of the top 3 CBs in the league. I will accept top 10, maybe even top 5. But no way is he top 3. Asante Samuel, Nate Clements, Charles Woodson and Rashaen Mathis are all superior to Newman is every statistical category by a good margin.

Most (relatively) unbiased sources has him ranked from 10-20.

Well, at least WE have a top 20 CB then.
 

firehawk350

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Vintage;1540231 said:
Newman gave up 3 TD's last year.

Peyton Manning to Reggie Wayne.
Michael Vick to Ashley Lelie.
Jon Kitna to Mike Williams.

Peyton Manning to Reggie Wayne... Best Qb to the 3rd best receiver, it happens.
Michael Vick to Ashley Lelie... Bad luck maybe.
Jon Kitna to Mike Williams... Ouch, that has to hurt.
 

firehawk350

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Vintage;1540234 said:
Well, at least WE have a top 20 CB then.

Actually, ESPN rates Shawn Springs in the teens somewhere. I just closed the page out and don't feel like going back to it.
 

Vintage

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firehawk350;1540235 said:
Peyton Manning to Reggie Wayne... Best Qb to the 3rd best receiver, it happens.

Michael Vick to Ashley Lelie... Bad luck maybe.

He extended the wrong hand....not bad luck. Bad choice.

Jon Kitna to Mike Williams... Ouch, that has to hurt.

Mike Williams ONLY touchdown catch of the season.
 

superpunk

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firehawk350;1540182 said:
I remember that the amount of catches given up for Bailey was something like 7 or 14 or something really low.

Quoted for outrageous embellishment.
 

adamknite

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firehawk350;1540235 said:
Peyton Manning to Reggie Wayne... Best Qb to the 3rd best receiver, it happens.
Michael Vick to Ashley Lelie... Bad luck maybe.
Jon Kitna to Mike Williams... Ouch, that has to hurt.

Michael Vick to Lelie if memory serves me was just a great pass and a great catch. Newman had good coverage it was just one of those things. That is if memory serves me well.

The Kitna to Williams.... yeah that one was pretty bad.
 

firehawk350

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Vintage;1540239 said:
He extended the wrong hand....not bad luck. Bad choice.



Mike Williams ONLY touchdown catch of the season.

Doesn't this just kind of underscore my point though? I'm saying Newman is good, not great and your showing me reasons why he isn't. Mike Williams pick up one TD catch, and it was on a top 3 CB? I don't think so...
 

Frozen700

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Vintage;1540231 said:
Newman gave up 3 TD's last year.

Peyton Manning to Reggie Wayne.
Michael Vick to Ashley Lelie.
Jon Kitna to Mike Williams.

Aaron glenn?
 
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