NFL vs MLB - Cheating - Antonio Gates - HOF

[Nightman]

I don't feel sorry for them, do what you have to do to win.

just stick to wrestlin'

 

[risco]

I have no clue why we as fans are OK with NFL players using PEDs and are not Ok with MLB players using them. We all know that NFL players are clearly on them humans are not meant to be this big and fast. Head injuries will continue to get worse in the NFL, along with tendon and muscle injuries. And the head injuries in the future will DESTROY the NFL. Lawsuits from the players will take down the NFL in the future because clearly the NFL turns a blind eye to the players taking PEDs. They catch the players that are dumb enough to screw up there PED schedule. NFL knows it and Fans know it. I do not think PEDS make a better product. If everyone was on the same playing field and NOBODY was on them the product on the field would be better than it is now. You would have players that actually use proper form to play this game we all love.


This conversation in my opinion is fascinating.

It just leads to one thing, money. Bigger, stronger, faster are attribute all players want in order to get that big payday... So the root is money.

 

[Section446]

Did you read all my posts? I think the whole NFL is using. Every single player. I say do Olympic standard testing for PEDs. You are right that the sport of football is in trouble despite the PEDs. But its in far more trouble because of PEDs. I think if you have a clean NFL you will actually have players that know how to properly play, block, tackle and with that change these head issues will subside.

We're almost on the same page.

We know, based on recent studies, that something as innocent as heading a soccer ball can cause major brain trauma. As long as football is a sport where men are clashing, there's going to be brain trauma, no matter what you're injecting yourself with. I like to think of myself as someone who's as big a football fan as you'll ever find, but if the good lord ever blessed me with a son, I'd never let him play football like I did. I never took a single supplement, much less PED's and steroids, and my entire body is completely wrecked from head to toe (brain included). I regularly tell people new to the game to enjoy it while they can, because it's going to be a very different looking sport in the coming years.

 

[Swanny]

It just leads to one thing, money. Bigger, stronger, faster are attribute all players want in order to get that big payday... So the root is money.

You are right and its a shame that the NFL and the Union are ok with these players taking PEDs. I don't blame the players I blame fans, the Union and the NFL for turning a blind eye

 

[Section446]

It just leads to one thing, money. Bigger, stronger, faster are attribute all players want in order to get that big payday... So the root is money.

Great post, money is the root of everything wrong with the world today.

 

[Swanny]

We're almost on the same page.

We know, based on recent studies, that something as innocent as heading a soccer ball can cause major brain trauma. As long as football is a sport where men are clashing, there's going to be brain trauma, no matter what you're injecting yourself with. I like to think of myself as someone who's as big a football fan as you'll ever find, but if the good lord ever blessed me with a son, I'd never let him play football like I did. I never took a single supplement, much less PED's and steroids, and my entire body is completely wrecked from head to toe (brain included). I regularly tell people new to the game to enjoy it while they can, because it's going to be a very different looking sport in the coming years.

Yeah I only played through High School. Thank god no head stuff going on (I did have a concussion) but I now have arthritis in my hand, fingers and knees because I never got my injuries checked our because I never wanted to come off the field. And I'm only 30

 

[Section446]

Yeah I only played through High School. Thank god no head stuff going on (I did have a concussion) but I now have arthritis in my hand, fingers and knees because I never got my injuries checked our because I never wanted to come off the field. And I'm only 30

Playing football is my one regret in life.

 

[BotchedLobotomy]

I disagree, I'm all about steroids and PED's, it makes any sport a lot more entertaining, and I'm in it soley for the entertainment.

 

[gmoney112]

I think he should get in, PED's or not.

Most guys in professional sports have, at one time, taken one substance or another. It's simply the result of such fierce competition in a physically demanding sport. It would not surprise me in the least if you told me 50% of the guys in the HoF took a "PED" at some point in their career. At the college level, they are everywhere, for all the reasons of why a college guy would want to go pro.

If you're going to use such strict protocol for the HoF, then you should get serious about the testing regiment that's taking place. Punishing a guy because a compound didn't clear his bloodstream in time while another guy squeeks by because he had better advice, isn't right.

It's pretty obvious the NFL only has this "testing" in place as a CYA procedure, I doubt they really care at all if players are taking in the offseason, like Section said, it makes the game more entertaining and that means more viewers, more revenue, more excitement.

If they were serious, they'd be testing guys every month, including the offseason.

For the record, I'm also of the opinion that all professional players in a physically demanding sport should be on an HGH protocol, for the numerous benefits involving strengthening/healing connective tissue, tendons, and cartilage. That'd be a great benefit for all these guys that face joint problems, etc. when they get on in their career and hang them up.

 

[Craig]

I assume its more common in the nfl than it ever was in mlb, so i dont really care.

 

[conner01]

I don't think most players are on peds
Once you are caught it gets very hard to use most of them with HGH being the exception, most though are hard to hide
One fact, if you threw all the players that are now in the hof out who juiced at a time they were not tested the steelers wouldn't have any players in the hof
Well,maybe Bradshaw lol
I think the big difference in baseball is some guys were using them their entire careers even during the season
Unless most are using HGH it would be difficult to juice during the season
Maybe I'm nieve but I just don't think the majority of players are using peds

 

[Swanny]

I don't think most players are on peds
Once you are caught it gets very hard to use most of them with HGH being the exception, most though are hard to hide
One fact, if you threw all the players that are now in the hof out who juiced at a time they were not tested the steelers wouldn't have any players in the hof
Well,maybe Bradshaw lol
I think the big difference in baseball is some guys were using them their entire careers even during the season
Unless most are using HGH it would be difficult to juice during the season
Maybe I'm nieve but I just don't think the majority of players are using peds

HGH or PEDs they are all using something that they shouldn't.

 

[xwalker]

Let me start by saying that I am not sure where this post should be placed but I hope the mods could keep it around the main forum for a little bit to get some feedback.

Anyways, we all know how anyone who cheated and used banned substances in MLB or whos names were even tied to using have not and will not get into the HOF. Well now with a player like Antonio Gates who in my eyes is/was a future HOFamer, will he get in? would you vote him in? What kind of impact do PEDS have on the NFL and it HOF?

1. I had to look it up to see what you were referring to in regards to Gates and PEDs.

2. A lot of NFL suspensions have turned out to be for silly stuff like Adderall. Drugs like Adderall are not remotely close to Anabolic Steroids in terms of performance enhancement.

3. In regards, to HGH, that is a bigger deal than Adderall, but again I don't believe that it is close to Anabolic Steroids in terms of performance enhancement.

4. In order for a significant number of NFL players to be on PEDs, they would have to be PEDs that can't be detected by the current tests. I'm skeptical that there are any super performance enhancing drugs like Anabolic Steroids that can't be detected.

5. Outlawing HGH is probably dumb. It is likely that it primarily helps with recovery from injury and is probably safe in reasonable doses.

6. Do they test for just Testosterone by itself? If I were an athlete, I would want to get my T level as high as allowed by the rules. I'm fairly certain they can't detect if you have T supplementation unless your overall level is above some point. Some people just have very high levels naturally. I don't think they can prevent a 35 year old NFL player from having his level boosted to the same as some 18 year olds have naturally.

7. I think the rush to outlaw certain drugs could be missing out on some benefits. As said previously, HGH might just help recovery from injury. If it does, then it would be helpful to non-athletes also. I've wondered if Anabolic Steroids used in reasonable doses could be useful in medicine. People that are weak from cancer and other diseases might get a few more months/years of being active with some of these powerful drugs.

The issue, IMO, with steroids was always that people in sports always went overboard using these types of drugs. I've always been curious of the long term effects of using Anabolic Steroids in reasonable doses. For instance, I know a guy that does physical labor (Carpenter) and his legs got to the point that the fatigue limited how much he could work. He is only in his fifties, but can only be on his feet for about 4 hours per day now. If he takes a day off, then he can work longer the following day, so it appears to be a recovery issue to some extent. Would small or reasonable doses of Anabolic Steroids be safe for him? I'm certain that Body Builder levels of Anabolic Steroids would help him but those obviously have negative long term effects. Also, normal people don't want to take black market drugs without a Doctor's supervision.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

The boards biggest authority on cheating and bias penalties enters in.... 3.............2........1

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I have no clue why we as fans are OK with NFL players using PEDs and are not Ok with MLB players using them. We all know that NFL players are clearly on them humans are not meant to be this big and fast. Head injuries will continue to get worse in the NFL, along with tendon and muscle injuries. And the head injuries in the future will DESTROY the NFL. Lawsuits from the players will take down the NFL in the future because clearly the NFL turns a blind eye to the players taking PEDs. They catch the players that are dumb enough to screw up there PED schedule. NFL knows it and Fans know it. I do not think PEDS make a better product. If everyone was on the same playing field and NOBODY was on them the product on the field would be better than it is now. You would have players that actually use proper form to play this game we all love.


This conversation in my opinion is fascinating.

Whether it is true or not, the perception among a lot of fans are NFL players use steroids to heal faster from injuries, MLB players use them to hit home runs.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Whether it is true or not, the perception among a lot of fans are NFL players use steroids to heal faster from injuries, MLB players use them to hit home runs.

MLB is not perception. It is biological/science/physics fact!

If you make the case that a player can hit the ball 10% further(conservative %) then it is a matter of fact that a ball can go over the fence when it should have been caught. Ball parks 300ft average. 10% is 30 feet.

Simple math and common sense really.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

MLB is not perception. It is biological/science/physics fact!

If you make the case that a player can hit the ball 10% further(conservative %) then it is a matter of fact that a ball can go over the fence when it should have been caught. Ball parks 300ft average. 10% is 30 feet.

Simple math and common sense really.

steroids can be used for either goal in either sport, but I tend to agree that fans do not judge NFL players as harshly as MLB players. there are obvious reasons behind it, like years of mistrust, but fans by and large give NFL players a pass

 

[Wolfpack]

Did you read all my posts? I think the whole NFL is using. Every single player. I say do Olympic standard testing for PEDs. You are right that the sport of football is in trouble despite the PEDs. But its in far more trouble because of PEDs. I think if you have a clean NFL you will actually have players that know how to properly play, block, tackle and with that change these head issues will subside.

It starts at levels below the NFL. The NCAA is one of the more corrupt organizations in the U.S.

What do you do as an NFL FO that is looking at a draft that has 70%+ kids using and plugged into the system?

 

[Swanny]

It starts at levels below the NFL. The NCAA is one of the more corrupt organizations in the U.S.

What do you do as an NFL FO that is looking at a draft that has 70%+ kids using and plugged into the system?

You are right. It comes down to fans demanding the sport to be clean. If we as fans do not the Union and NFL will just ride this wave until they are forced to stop. The future of football scares me.

 

[TellerMorrow34]

I have no clue why we as fans are OK with NFL players using PEDs and are not Ok with MLB players using them. We all know that NFL players are clearly on them humans are not meant to be this big and fast. Head injuries will continue to get worse in the NFL, along with tendon and muscle injuries. And the head injuries in the future will DESTROY the NFL. Lawsuits from the players will take down the NFL in the future because clearly the NFL turns a blind eye to the players taking PEDs. They catch the players that are dumb enough to screw up there PED schedule. NFL knows it and Fans know it. I do not think PEDS make a better product. If everyone was on the same playing field and NOBODY was on them the product on the field would be better than it is now. You would have players that actually use proper form to play this game we all love.


This conversation in my opinion is fascinating.

Interesting read. I appreciate the thoughts.

A big part of the reason the blind eye is turned is that these PED also allow guys to get back on the field faster. If you've been around here long enough you know without question that anyone who isn't just jumping right back from an injury is considered some giant ***** by a good portion of this board.

The same folks who call in sick when they have a minor hang over are on here talking about how a football player should rub some dirt on it when they've got a strain, tear, or other issue keeping them off the football field.


So I can't imagine how much more people would be pissing and moaning about injuries if these guys didn't use stuff that helps them get bigger, stronger, and recover faster.