Offensive Creativity

[Corso]

I think he is.. He’s not my favorite coach by any means but the guy started his career in 1975 and he’s seen just about everything this game can throw at someone and he has an answer for just about anything.

I wish there were more footage of watching him coach guys. It’s ashamed these coaches are so worried about things that we don’t get to see them do their job much.

Preach.

 

[Corso]

"12 personnel" refers to who is on the field, not where they line up. It's any formation with two tight ends on the field.

And Sturm's blog even says we used one tight end about 69 percent of the time and "12" personnel about 14 percent of the time.

https://sportsday.***BANNED-DO-NOT-...2/decoding-linehan-evaluating-went-wrong-2017

So I'm not sure where you came up with more than 50 percent for "12" personnel.

Always good to see Ra pay a visit.

 

[Jake]

I like that the Cowboys are trying to change things for 2018, but I'm not confident we've got the best coaches to do it. Linehan and Garrett like their power running, play action football. I suspect they may actually double down on it, rather than develop a more dynamic, 21st century passing attack.

 

[Bobhaze]

"12 personnel" refers to who is on the field, not where they line up. It's any formation with two tight ends on the field.

And Sturm's blog even says we used one tight end about 69 percent of the time and "12" personnel about 14 percent of the time.

(sorry, not allowed to post the link, but it was posted on Jan. 2 if you want to find it)

So I'm not sure where you came up with more than 50 percent for "12" personnel.

Well brother, apparently I was wrong, and it won’t be the first time, lol. Got no problem admitting my mistake. I appreciate your work on this. I do stand by my belief that our offensive coaches could certainly stand to be more creative with the personnel deployment.

 

[Dre11]

I think that you're overthinking things. The Cowboys were 9-1 in games that Sean Lee started and finished last year and 0-6 in games that he didn't. Let that sink in for a minute. Yes, I know, injuries happen - but the Cowboys' lack of depth at the linebacker position was a KILLER last year. Same thing with the Zeke suspension and Tyron Smith injury.

Remember that they went 13-3 with the same scheme in 2016.

Exactly, funny how these scheme criers overlook that...lol

 

[Dre11]

Yeah, I understand that about Sean Lee and also 2016. But you’re actually reinforcing my argument. The league adjusted to the Cowboys’ 2016 attack and DCs began to take away things that had worked for this offense. It’s seemed as if our coaches responded with “let’s keep fighting”. Creativity in today’s NFL is no longer a luxury. It’s the coin of the realm.

lol, creativity isn’t an option when you don’t have the players to be creative. You actually don’t know what creativity is. They made adjustments to the offense without Zeke, for exampl, they put Rod Smith in the slot some, he actually had a nice catch and score vs Giants. Also considering they didn’t show much of the offense game plans , you don’t know what other changes were made.

 

[Dre11]

Think about it from OC Linehan's point of view.

Garrett forced him to play Witten 100% of the snaps. Witten lack of speed coupled with a lack of speed at WR was a problem.

Then he has Dez as the #1 WR who somebody decided needed a very high number of targets. I doubt if that was Linehan's decision. Probably Garrett again. Dez could only run a few routes effectively and needed a perfect throw just to have a chance to catch it. Any type of complicated play would end up confusing Dez more than the defense.

Beasley is very limited. His quickness works in the short area but CBs has such a length advantage that intermediate distance routes just don't work well for him unless they are a surprise to the defense. Beasley is not much of a RAC threat.

TWill struggles with short passes because he needs more time to "see" the ball in the air. He is not a deep pass catcher either. He must be used in the intermediate area.

Butler was only good on go routes. He had Dez type lack of route running prowess.

Any RB other than Zeke was speed limited.

They didn't have a speed threat to run jet sweeps or reverses. Switzer just wasn't that fast/elusive in those situations.

How does anyone get creative with those options?

Draw up a new play and then start reviewing each players role and likely half or more are not within their niche role. Then the play gets adjusted to fit the players at which point the play looses it's originally intended function.

Linehan didn't have the option to use 4 WRs, 1 RB because Garrett would not allow Witten to be taken off the field.

Just 1 decent NFL WR that could run all routes and not get confused would have drastically altered what types of plays Linehan could design.

An elite speed player at slot-WR or as the backup RB could open up many other options. Zeke is physically great and a decent receiver but I'm not sure he has the attention span to practice the nuances of more complicated route running and he can't play all the snaps.

The only way to function was to run the ball with an elite RB and elite OL. When the OL started to struggle then the wheels started to come off. Then Zeke was out and it was impossible to function in a structured manner.

The main thing they could have done is mix up shotgun equals likely pass and under center equals likely run. Running from shotgun does limit the RB and passing from under center puts limitations on the QB and the pass blocking; therefore, it's obvious why they have heavy tendencies in those formations. Nevertheless I think they could have fooled defenses by mixing it up a bit more.

They have now addressed their many limitations.
Hurns/Gallup are detailed route runners.

Austin has the speed that scares defenses and he'll operate in the underneath areas either in the flats as a RB or a short catch with big YAC if made a focus of the coverage scheme.

Thompson has the deep speed and deep catching ability like Butler had but he is not an idiot like Butler and has some ability to run other routes.

They'll likely run some 4 WR, 1 RB sets now based on match-up advantages.

They can run jet sweeps and reverses with Austin and maybe do some things with Thompson.

Beasley is still a niche player but if some of the new options can prevent him from seeing double coverage then he'll thrive.

TWill is still limited but it will be much easier to keep him in situations where he can function effectively because players like Hurns/Gallup don't have limitations from a schematic perspective.

Hopefully they've cleaned up the OLine issues also. They added Connor Williams who not only looks like an upgrade at LG but is an option at OT also. Imagine if Connor Williams was the LG in the Atlanta game. Once Green struggled Williams could have moved over to LT and even with zero practice would have been better than Byron Bell. A year of experience at RT for La'el should make him much better.

Summary: The new players might not be super stars but from a schematic perspective, it's a drastic improvement. The OC went from designing with Crayons to a High End computer and High End software tools.

So where’s you proof Linehan didn’t want Witten on the field? I love how you make ish up...lol

 

[Dre11]

Witten was the only tight end on the field for 67 percent of our plays last season. We used one tight end 68 percent of the time, two tight ends 23 percent of the time and three tight ends 9 percent of the time. So we definitely did not use 12 personnel more than 50 percent of the time.

It’s fun to see folks try to criticize coaches and schemes when they don’t understand the offense and it’s intricacies...lol

 

[Flamma]

After watching the outstanding series “All or Nothing”, I was struck by how much our coaching staff seemed to stick with the same offensive tendencies whether they continued to work or not. Garrett is often seen repeating the mantra “We just need to fight harder” when the team has a bad game. “Fight” is a great slogan, but in the NFL, fighting hard is not enough. You have to sometimes have some new wrinkles.

If fact what this team desperately needs from its coaching staff going into 2018 is creativity, especially on offense. I know it’s popular on these boards for fans to scream, “Just run the ball”, as if all we need to do for 60 straight plays is hand it to Zeke. The NFL is never that simple.

Looking back on the 2017 season, it was a tale of two seasons on offense. In the first 8 games of the season, we went 5-3 (should have been 6-2 or 7-1), averaged 28 points a game, which was 5th in the NFL, averaged 379 yds a game (8th in NFL). In the last 8 games, we averaged 16 points a game (28th in NFL) and 293 yds a game (26th).

First half of the season, we had Zeke and Tyron Smith, the last half we had Zeke for 2 games and Tyron for 3 and a half. Sure that hurt, but is this team going to fold anytime key starters are hurt? Is that just the way it’s going to be? We have to depend on injury good luck to remain a good offense?

Somehow Doug Pederson was able to get the beagles offense continue to hum all the way to a SB without its star QB and it’s starting LT. How? Through creativity and some risk taking in key moments.

When Nick Foles started the playoffs, conventional wisdom was that the beagles were toast and that Pederson would just have a few basic plays for Foles to run as a bus driver. Instead, we saw that offense roll out some unusual plays and creative formations that threw DCs into head scratching fits. All based on finding creative ways to make the offense less predictable and more edgy.

It’s no secret the Cowboys coaching staff likes these formations best:
1. “12 Personnel”- 1 RB, 2 TEs and 2 WRs. They run this formation over 50% of the time, regardless of opponent, regardless of who’s playing for us.
2. “11 Personnel” - 1 RB, 1 TE, 3 WRs- second most common formation, most often used for passing situations. The RB can be used as a slot receiver in an empty set.
3. “22 Personnel”- 2 RBs, 2 TEs, 1 WR- a common formation for short yardage and goal line situations.

These are not the only formations of course, but my point is, the Cowboys are actually pretty predictable on offense. I don’t care how great your OL and skill people are, in 2018 NFL world you cannot just run the same stuff a la the 90s Cowboys. Those days are long gone.

With the addition of Tavon Austin and the new “committee” approach at WR, the Cowboys can be much less predictable by spreading the ball around between more options, and getting more creative with Zeke as well. Just asking your players to “fight harder” isn’t enough.

Thoughts?

I agree with you but for one thing. The 90s Cowboys ('92 through '95) ran every play from under center. They also passed and ran the ball from the same formations. It's not so much the formations, but what they do from them.

In your #1 example, they usually run from that. In your #2, and like you said, they usually pass, and use shotgun. This drove me nuts all last year as to how predictable we were.

 

[Buzzbait]

I think that you're overthinking things. The Cowboys were 9-1 in games that Sean Lee started and finished last year and 0-6 in games that he didn't. Let that sink in for a minute. Yes, I know, injuries happen - but the Cowboys' lack of depth at the linebacker position was a KILLER last year. Same thing with the Zeke suspension and Tyron Smith injury.

Remember that they went 13-3 with the same scheme in 2016.

So you think they should repeat the "same scheme" every year? You don't think defenses would figure out how to beat it after a while?

 

[Buzzbait]

There was never a more predictable offense than the early 90s Cowboys. That worked out OK.The

We don't have the QB to run a tricked-up passing offense. Dak can't yet read a defense at the line of scrimmage to make the calls necessary to do that.

Brady, Peyton, Brees, Roethlisberger, Romo, Rivers, Rodgers.....those aren't play calls by the offensive coordinator. Those are mostly decisions made by QBs at the line of scrimmage based on coverage.

The early 90s Cowboys had the talent to run a predictable offense and get by with it.
We don't have that same talent level so we can't afford that kind of predictability. They don't need a "tricked up" offense, just smarter and a little more deceptive.

Have you ever tried running a bluff in a poker game with all your cards face up? Keeping your cards hidden doesn't require trick plays, just smart play. Same thing when you reach the red zone and come to the LOS with an empty backfield. Which screams to the defense exactly what you're going to do.
If you have the talent to dare fate, great. But if you don't, then it's stupid to tell the defense what you're doing as soon as you line up, especially in the red zone.

 

[Whyjerry]

After watching the outstanding series “All or Nothing”, I was struck by how much our coaching staff seemed to stick with the same offensive tendencies whether they continued to work or not. Garrett is often seen repeating the mantra “We just need to fight harder” when the team has a bad game. “Fight” is a great slogan, but in the NFL, fighting hard is not enough. You have to sometimes have some new wrinkles.

If fact what this team desperately needs from its coaching staff going into 2018 is creativity, especially on offense. I know it’s popular on these boards for fans to scream, “Just run the ball”, as if all we need to do for 60 straight plays is hand it to Zeke. The NFL is never that simple.

Looking back on the 2017 season, it was a tale of two seasons on offense. In the first 8 games of the season, we went 5-3 (should have been 6-2 or 7-1), averaged 28 points a game, which was 5th in the NFL, averaged 379 yds a game (8th in NFL). In the last 8 games, we averaged 16 points a game (28th in NFL) and 293 yds a game (26th).

First half of the season, we had Zeke and Tyron Smith, the last half we had Zeke for 2 games and Tyron for 3 and a half. Sure that hurt, but is this team going to fold anytime key starters are hurt? Is that just the way it’s going to be? We have to depend on injury good luck to remain a good offense?

Somehow Doug Pederson was able to get the beagles offense continue to hum all the way to a SB without its star QB and it’s starting LT. How? Through creativity and some risk taking in key moments.

When Nick Foles started the playoffs, conventional wisdom was that the beagles were toast and that Pederson would just have a few basic plays for Foles to run as a bus driver. Instead, we saw that offense roll out some unusual plays and creative formations that threw DCs into head scratching fits. All based on finding creative ways to make the offense less predictable and more edgy.

It’s no secret the Cowboys coaching staff likes these formations best:
1. “12 Personnel”- 1 RB, 2 TEs and 2 WRs. They run this formation over 50% of the time, regardless of opponent, regardless of who’s playing for us.
2. “11 Personnel” - 1 RB, 1 TE, 3 WRs- second most common formation, most often used for passing situations. The RB can be used as a slot receiver in an empty set.
3. “22 Personnel”- 2 RBs, 2 TEs, 1 WR- a common formation for short yardage and goal line situations.

These are not the only formations of course, but my point is, the Cowboys are actually pretty predictable on offense. I don’t care how great your OL and skill people are, in 2018 NFL world you cannot just run the same stuff a la the 90s Cowboys. Those days are long gone.

With the addition of Tavon Austin and the new “committee” approach at WR, the Cowboys can be much less predictable by spreading the ball around between more options, and getting more creative with Zeke as well. Just asking your players to “fight harder” isn’t enough.

Thoughts?

Linehan and Garrett are awful coaches. They have been propped up over the years with good QB play. When they don’t get that you have the 2007 Rams and the 2015 Cowboys. Not pretty. I have zero confidence they do anything well. As fans we have to pray the talented OL and RB can just push through teams.

 

[Buzzbait]

Creativity isn’t an option when you don’t have the players to be creative........

No, creativity isn't an option when you don't have the COACHES to be creative.

 

[GORICO]

After watching the outstanding series “All or Nothing”, I was struck by how much our coaching staff seemed to stick with the same offensive tendencies whether they continued to work or not. Garrett is often seen repeating the mantra “We just need to fight harder” when the team has a bad game. “Fight” is a great slogan, but in the NFL, fighting hard is not enough. You have to sometimes have some new wrinkles.

If fact what this team desperately needs from its coaching staff going into 2018 is creativity, especially on offense. I know it’s popular on these boards for fans to scream, “Just run the ball”, as if all we need to do for 60 straight plays is hand it to Zeke. The NFL is never that simple.

Looking back on the 2017 season, it was a tale of two seasons on offense. In the first 8 games of the season, we went 5-3 (should have been 6-2 or 7-1), averaged 28 points a game, which was 5th in the NFL, averaged 379 yds a game (8th in NFL). In the last 8 games, we averaged 16 points a game (28th in NFL) and 293 yds a game (26th).

First half of the season, we had Zeke and Tyron Smith, the last half we had Zeke for 2 games and Tyron for 3 and a half. Sure that hurt, but is this team going to fold anytime key starters are hurt? Is that just the way it’s going to be? We have to depend on injury good luck to remain a good offense?

Somehow Doug Pederson was able to get the beagles offense continue to hum all the way to a SB without its star QB and it’s starting LT. How? Through creativity and some risk taking in key moments.

When Nick Foles started the playoffs, conventional wisdom was that the beagles were toast and that Pederson would just have a few basic plays for Foles to run as a bus driver. Instead, we saw that offense roll out some unusual plays and creative formations that threw DCs into head scratching fits. All based on finding creative ways to make the offense less predictable and more edgy.

It’s no secret the Cowboys coaching staff likes these formations best:
1. “12 Personnel”- 1 RB, 2 TEs and 2 WRs. They run this formation over 50% of the time, regardless of opponent, regardless of who’s playing for us.
2. “11 Personnel” - 1 RB, 1 TE, 3 WRs- second most common formation, most often used for passing situations. The RB can be used as a slot receiver in an empty set.
3. “22 Personnel”- 2 RBs, 2 TEs, 1 WR- a common formation for short yardage and goal line situations.

These are not the only formations of course, but my point is, the Cowboys are actually pretty predictable on offense. I don’t care how great your OL and skill people are, in 2018 NFL world you cannot just run the same stuff a la the 90s Cowboys. Those days are long gone.

With the addition of Tavon Austin and the new “committee” approach at WR, the Cowboys can be much less predictable by spreading the ball around between more options, and getting more creative with Zeke as well. Just asking your players to “fight harder” isn’t enough.

Thoughts?

sir--- this very thing has chapped my behind for some time....Jason Garrett is way to caught up in his Vince Lombardi wanna-be philosophies..

He thinks ok the guy across from you is more talented and wants to win as much as you but somehow just out-will them?....If we dont do some drastic changes in our offense this year same thing will occur...or worst...we are in big trouble if we are not one of the teams that stays way better than average healthy....when i watched that 3-game slide after Zeke went on suspension and we could not score more than 10 points and we had no contingency plan other than the schedule where we played inferior teams later on...it would have been a lot more than losing 3 in a row....I wish i did not read your post cause now i am really upset again....oh well...time for a deep breath and let it go?

 

[GORICO]

Linehan and Garrett are awful coaches. They have been propped up over the years with good QB play. When they don’t get that you have the 2007 Rams and the 2015 Cowboys. Not pretty. I have zero confidence they do anything well. As fans we have to pray the talented OL and RB can just push through teams.

why jerry----- i agree 100%....look how the NFC east uprgraded this offseason and we may very well have gone backwards?....time will tell....but i too have no confidence this coaching staff will employ a consistent scheme or have a contingency plan when it does not work?...if our O line and Zeke are not effective we are in trouble...I am glad though we got Connor for LG but i worry about Smith LT and his back...backs dont get better with age and abuse...but who knows maybe they will pull a great game plan out of the hat?

 

[Roadtrip635]

I agree, there's no good reason to not use Zeke as a receiver on occasion just to stir the pot, but Garrett failed "NFL Creativity 101" at Princeton, and he usually doesn't utilize all the tools he has at his disposal anyway. He'd rather just run Zeke up the middle and forget the X's and O's and the creativity.
OH! And don't forget that dumb jet sweep that never works!

He's saving that jet sweep for Austin. That'll fool 'em! That's why they drafted Austin, he needed somebody for the jet sweep.

I don't get all the love for the jet sweep either, but I have read more posts over the last couple weeks about the jet sweep than should ever be allowed. There have been so many "jet sweep" mentions that I want to start a new drinking game on CZ. Every time it's mentioned.................. DRINK!!!!!!

 

[Buzzbait]

I don't get all the love for the jet sweep either, but I have read more posts over the last couple weeks about the jet sweep than should ever be allowed. There have been so many "jet sweep" mentions that I want to start a new drinking game on CZ. Every time it's mentioned.................. DRINK!!!!!!

YIKES!
Yeah I'm with ya, I hate that dumb play.

 

[erod]

The early 90s Cowboys had the talent to run a predictable offense and get by with it.
We don't have that same talent level so we can't afford that kind of predictability. They don't need a "tricked up" offense, just smarter and a little more deceptive.

Have you ever tried running a bluff in a poker game with all your cards face up? Keeping your cards hidden doesn't require trick plays, just smart play. Same thing when you reach the red zone and come to the LOS with an empty backfield. Which screams to the defense exactly what you're going to do.
If you have the talent to dare fate, great. But if you don't, then it's stupid to tell the defense what you're doing as soon as you line up, especially in the red zone.

You can't run a complicated offense with Dak Prescott. Not now anyway.

 

[Zman5]

I think that you're overthinking things. The Cowboys were 9-1 in games that Sean Lee started and finished last year and 0-6 in games that he didn't. Let that sink in for a minute. Yes, I know, injuries happen - but the Cowboys' lack of depth at the linebacker position was a KILLER last year. Same thing with the Zeke suspension and Tyron Smith injury.

Remember that they went 13-3 with the same scheme in 2016.

They also went 4-12 with the same scheme in 2015. Any scheme that can't win games without all the staters playing is not a very good scheme. Any scheme will work if you have superior players. With this scheme, when a key player is out, the whole team falters.

Look at the Patriots. They literally can get a guy off the couch and have him be a star player in the SB. Look at the Eagirls. They lost their all pro LT, starting MLB, key RB/PR, and their QB who was playing at MVP level. They lost more key players than we did last season yet they won the SB with a backup QB who barely played before the playoff started.

 

[Beast_from_East]

My thought every time this criticism is trotted out are “how much does it matter if we’re consistently inside the top 5 or 10 teams in the league in terms of offensive points production?”

Followed closely by “why are we preoccupied with intangible things like ‘creativity’ when there are tangible areas where the team falls short (like 3rd down success percentage or takeaways) all over the defense?”

Hey buddy, whats up.

I think the team views the offense as a real problem, despite where they rank in points per production or whatever else stat you look at. Just look at what they have done since the season ended.................

A) 7 of the team's 10 draft picks were used on offensive players, including trading a 6th for wr/rb. A team does not use 70% of their draft capital on the offensive side of the ball if they think things are going good there.

B) The entire WR core has pretty much been gutted. Out of the 8 WRs currently on the roster, only 3 were here last year, and that includes Noah Brown who played very little. So really, only Twill and Beasley are the only main WRs still left on this team.

C) They are chucking the entire offensive playbook and going to more RPOs, or as Jerry said "more college stuff". Again, a team does not totally remake the playbook if they think the offensive is fine and dandy.

So lets recap, over 70% of the team's draft capital was spent on offensive players, the entire wr core has pretty much been gutted, and the offensive scheme is changing to heavy RPO, similar to what the Chiefs run for best NFL comparison. Like I said, a team does not do all of this if they are happy with their points per production and if that ranks in the top 5 or top 10, they just don't.