On The Topic of Leadership

[Alexander]

leadership is not calling people out in the media and following their every footstep to make sure they're doing what they're suppose to, you can't hold their hands all day

Who on earth has suggested it is anything like this?

And honestly, if leadership is "overrated" in your eyes, show me a winner that doesn't have it either from a dynamic player that backs up what he says or a charismatic coach who understands how to motivate.

Take your time.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Who on earth has suggested it is anything like this?

you brought up Peyton Manning telling his teammates to get to practice, who's also the same guy who threw his Oline under the bus in the '05 playoffs btw

And honestly, if leadership is "overrated" in your eyes, show me a winner that doesn't have it either from a dynamic player or a charismatic coach.

Take your time.

not saying leadership itself is overrated, just leadership is getting overrated because people have wide interpretations of it that aren't exactly what leadership is supposed to be, like all the people saying we need a player like Ray Lewis to jump around pre-game yelling in everyone's ears, or a coach on the sideline fist-pumping

go look up at leadership in the dictionary

here's your example, the greatest franchise of the salary cap era, the Pats, they are a businesslike team w/ not many superstars and a bland head coach

 

[Dallas]

This just in. Leadership is over-rated.

Ask Mr. Lebron James.



Just take the game over yourself and carry the team to victory. :laugh2:

 

[Alexander]

here's your example, the greatest franchise of the salary cap era, the Pats, they are a businesslike team w/ not many superstars and a bland head coach

http://img118.*************/img118/392/caveman1of8.jpg

Next time I suggest you do a little research.

Brady is not a superstar? Seymour is not a superstar?

Belichick is anything but bland. His intellectualism garners instant respect. And if you pay attention to anything about that program, he has his own charm and charisma. You see bland, but that is far from the case.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

http://img118.*************/img118/392/caveman1of8.jpg

Next time I suggest you do a little research.

Brady is not a superstar?

he is, because he's won 3 rings, has some endorsements because of his good looks, and has dated a beautiful actress and now a supermodel

Seymour is not a superstar?

:laugh1: how can someone who averages barely 5 sacks be considered a superstar? it's not likel his stats pop out to the casual fan, he's a very good player, but noone is calling him a superstar

Belichick is anything but bland. His intellectualism garners instant respect. And if you pay attention to anything about that program, he has his own charm and charisma. You see bland, but that is far from the case.

Belichick comes off as aloof, that's why Bill Parcells is always getting sound-bites from his PC while Belichick is not

it all comes back around to the definition of leadership being setting an example, you hardly see these guys acting wild, they approach games w/ a business-like mentality, hell, Belichick is the epitome of operating an NFL team as a business

 

[ZeroClub]

you brought up Peyton Manning telling his teammates to get to practice, who's also the same guy who threw his Oline under the bus in the '05 playoffs btw



not saying leadership itself is overrated, just leadership is getting overrated because people have wide interpretations of it that aren't exactly what leadership is supposed to be, like all the people saying we need a player like Ray Lewis to jump around pre-game yelling in everyone's ears, or a coach on the sideline fist-pumping

go look up at leadership in the dictionary

here's your example, the greatest franchise of the salary cap era, the Pats, they are a businesslike team w/ not many superstars and a bland head coach

What I most want:

1. A couple of guys on defense who can spark that intimidating, emotional frenzy that Parcells spoke of (but never really got) in Dallas.

2. The Staubach-Montana-Brady -like leadership from the QB position that instills supreme confidence in the clutch.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

What I most want:

1. A couple of guys on defense who can spark that intimidating, emotional frenzy that Parcells spoke of (but never really got) in Dallas.

we could use some of that

2. The Staubach-Montana-Brady -like leadership from the QB position that instills supreme confidence in the clutch.

you don't see that in Romo? and you always hear players talking about how cool Romo is, instilling confidence is also acting cool, because it rubs off on people

 

[AsthmaField]

http://img118.*************/img118/392/caveman1of8.jpg

"Maybe if you'd have said that leadership is important in the first place... I wouldn't be having an exestesential meltdown right now."

 

[JackMagist]

While Parcells did a great job of putting together a talented team he also held them back with his overbearing and stifling personality. He had done all he could do for this team and it was time for him to go. Now that he is gone I think we will see the leaders step forward and emerge from his shadow.

I don't know who the leaders are on this team…especially on Defense. The last true team leader that we had was Darren Woodson. I'm sure we have others on the team who are capable of stepping up the way Woody did but we will have to wait for them to emerge. As for Romo, I think he still has to prove that he is the leader. He has to bounce back from the fumbled snap and the late season meltdown (of the entire team) from last year. I fully expect him to step up and take over this team this year. But it is not yet his time to be calling other players and encouraging them to come to practice. If he responds and performs this year the way I expect then it will be his time.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Leadership is a mixed bag. it certainly helps as there are far too many examples of it being succesful but then there are cases where it is there and it doesnt seem to help.

The offensive line for example. Rivera for the past several years ahs filled that role. He filled it admirably in Green Bay and from all indications he was doing what was necessary as a leader. he would hold meetings outside of VR, he would help the new guys and get on peoples butts if they slacked off.

Our offensive line has been one of the weaker points ont he team.

Then take our wideouts. I dont think anyone will credit Owens as a leader no matter how he helped Hurd along. Glenn works hard but he is the quiet type and not exactly what one would see as a leader of men.

Our receivers have been a strong suit on our team for quite some time.

we still do have leaders on this team. ferguson leads the dline no question about that and i got the impression that newman began asserting himself as well. james tries to be one but until he can put his money where his mouth is before he can fill that role.

On offense look no farther than our quarterback, Mr. Romo. im just hoping one of the olinemen step up and asserts themselves as that is a unit that is going to need cohesiveness to e successful.

 

[Alexander]

he is, because he's won 3 rings, has some endorsements because of his good looks, and has dated a beautiful actress and now a supermodel

And he is perhaps the most efficient and successful QB of this generation. Carry on, you are demonstrating how little you really do know about the game.

:laugh1: how can someone who averages barely 5 sacks be considered a superstar? it's not likel his stats pop out to the casual fan, he's a very good player, but noone is calling him a superstar

You have further proven my above observation, summer.

Keep on quoting your statistical basis for evaluating Seymour's talent. It is very amusing.

Belichick comes off as aloof, that's why Bill Parcells is always getting sound-bites from his PC while Belichick is not

it all comes back around to the definition of leadership being setting an example, you hardly see these guys acting wild, they approach games w/ a business-like mentality, hell, Belichick is the epitome of operating an NFL team as a business

I think I have said it before and I suppose I will have to repeat it. The classic "foaming at the mouth" stereotype isn't even what I was getting at and demonstrates you have missed the point entirely.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

And he is perhaps the most efficient and successful QB of this generation. Carry on, you are demonstrating how little you really do know about the game.



You have further proven my above observation, summer.

Keep on quoting your statistical basis for evaluating Seymour's talent. It is very amusing.



I think I have said it before and I suppose I will have to repeat it. The classic "foaming at the mouth" stereotype isn't even what I was getting at and demonstrates you have missed the point entirely.

he doesnt understand how good 5 sacks for a 3-4 DLinemen is in and of itself and that doesnt surprise me. seymour is possibly the most disruptive defensive lineman in the league.

 

[AsthmaField]

While Parcells did a great job of putting together a talented team he also held them back with his overbearing and stifling personality. He had done all he could do for this team and it was time for him to go.

I did like Parcells... but I think this is probably correct. I hope so, at least.

As for Romo, I think he still has to prove that he is the leader. He has to bounce back from the fumbled snap and the late season meltdown (of the entire team) from last year. I fully expect him to step up and take over this team this year. But it is not yet his time to be calling other players and encouraging them to come to practice. If he responds and performs this year the way I expect then it will be his time.

I agree with this too. I think it might be a year early for him to start acting like Manning with his team... he still has some proving to do.

I do think that Romo has one very important thing going for him... something that isn't easy to come by and has to be proven to his teammates: That he will come through in the clutch.

I think he has proven this enough times already that the team can rest assured that if they do their job, Romo can bring them back and win the game. He has shown that and shown it consistantly enough that I think the team believes it.

IMO that is crucial in a QB being a team leader. The fact that the team realizes that because of Romo they have a chance to come back and win from behind. If he's out there, he can direct them down the field in a short amount of time and do what is neccesary to win the game. Once a QB has a team believing that... then he has their full attention out on the field and it is only a matter of stringing together some wins before they're all completely in his corner.

Romo has done that... now he only needs to put together some more wins and this team is his, IMO.

 

[Alexander]

he doesnt understand how good 5 sacks for a 3-4 DLinemen is in and of itself and that doesnt surprise me. seymour is possibly the most disruptive defensive lineman in the league.

And do not forget, Brady is what he is only because he's impregnated a super model.

Perhaps all Romo needs to do is sire a few with Underwood and he will have arrived.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

And he is perhaps the most efficient and successful QB of this generation. Carry on, you are demonstrating how little you really do know about the game.

Brady leads by example, which I brought up

You have further proven my above observation, summer.

Keep on quoting your statistical basis for evaluating Seymour's talent. It is very amusing.

wow, I said Seymour is a VERY GOOD player, but unless you are a devouted Patriot fan, or a hard-core football fan, you aren't going to know how impressive he really is

I think I have said it before and I suppose I will have to repeat it. The classic "foaming at the mouth" stereotype isn't even what I was getting at and demonstrates you have missed the point entirely.

the foaming at the mouth example was just one of the wrong rationalizations of leadership I was pointing out, since you decided to bring up the "emotional" aspects of leadership like that's the only quality there is to it

but you've entirely disregarded my point that leadership is leading by example and on the field, it's getting your teammates in position to be at the right place, at the right time

 

[Bob Sacamano]

he doesnt understand how good 5 sacks for a 3-4 DLinemen is in and of itself and that doesnt surprise me. seymour is possibly the most disruptive defensive lineman in the league.

but does the casual fan know that? how can you be a superstar when maybe half of the people who watch football don't know how impressive you really are? and will just look at the stats and see that Seymour has never ranked in the top 5 in sacks?

edit: to make sure everyone understands, Seymour is an outstanding player, but not everyone knows that, since a superstar is someone everybody recognizes

 

[AsthmaField]

What Bob is saying, I think, is that Brady is in a position to get the supermodels and is such a superstar because he has won the SB a few times and been such a good QB in NE.

He's saying that he wouldn't have had the superstardom or the models if he wasn't a good QB. He's saying that he became a good QB, not because of those things, but that he got those things because he's a good QB.

Play good first and then get the perks... not the other way around.

Not getting in the argument... I'm only saying that I understand where Summer (bob) was going with that.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

What Bob is saying, I think, is that Brady is in a position to get the supermodels and is such a superstar because he has won the SB a few times and been such a good QB in NE.

He's saying that he wouldn't have had the superstardom or the models if he wasn't a good QB. He's saying that he became a good QB, not because of those things, but that he got those things because he's a good QB.

Play good first and then get the perks... not the other way around.

Not getting in the argument... I'm only saying that I understand where Summer (bob) was going with that.

all I'm saying is that Brady doesn't do anything more than lead by his play on the field and wins

 

[ZeroClub]

we could use some of that



you don't see that in Romo? and you always hear players talking about how cool Romo is, instilling confidence is also acting cool, because it rubs off on people

Oh, sure, I see that potential in Romo. I've been on the Romo bandwagon well before it got crowded (3 years ago), primarily because he showed signs of performing especially well under pressure.

But he's got a ways to go. It's only bluster until he actually delivers consistently. I am cautiously optimistic about his chances, but he's got a really long way to go before he's the second coming of Staubach.

 

[Alexander]

wow, I said Seymour is a VERY GOOD player, but unless you are a devouted Patriot fan, or a hard-core football fan, you aren't going to know how impressive he really is

Then consider yourself uninformed. Try to become a more well-rounded football fan and student of the game, then you can understand how the Patriots have been successful and are very mischaracterized as a bland, passionless lot that show that business wins.

No, they carry themselves like businessmen. They take that approach in running the franchise. But they are certainly smarter and more intense on the field than any franchise around. They are driven. That's why they are winners.

the foaming at the mouth example was just one of the wrong rationalizations of leadership I was pointing out, since you decided to bring up the "emotional" aspects of leadership like that's the only quality there is to it

When you have shown everything else and have failed to win a playoff game for a decade, that's all that is left.

but you've entirely disregarded my point that leadership is leading by example

We have players that do that. Greg Ellis is the posterchild for that.

It is not working and hasn't for the last decade.

I am ready for change. Not more of the same.