Pacman suspended for 2007; Henry suspended 8 games

[jay cee]

Of course it's retroactive and in a coupl eof cases before due process of law has been established. These are the two main reasons upon which their lawyers will fight this.

That's why I agree with SuperPunk, it's just grandstanding.

Hell Leonard Little killed a lady, and he did not garner nearly as much outrage as Jones and Henry. Why? Because too many people can identify with a guy driving drunk.

A large segment of our society has done that very thing themselves. They know that could have easily have been any number of us.

Now in this instance they can get all self righteous, because they can't identify with these guys.

Although I don't mind the lengths of their suspensions, IMO, it is just grandstanding.

 

[adamknite]

"We just need some heart. Excuse my French, but we need some thugs to go out there and get it. We have too many nice guys." - Adam "Pac-Man" Jones

...... when did he say that?.....

 

[sacase]

They are being punished on the OLD policy. I'm sure they will appeal but in the end they won't get anywhere because the PLAYERS themselves want this.

The NFLPA's job is to represent ALL players no matter what they have done. They don't decide who they represent. The players have no say in who the NFLPA represents since the NFLPA represents all players equally. If this action goes against the CBA then the NFLPA MUST represent the players in question no matter how many players dislike it. Its not a hard concept.

 

[superpunk]

"Grandstanding" That's the word I was looking for.

I thought about using "Al-Sharptoning", but I'm not sure that's accepted in the general lexicon.

 

[Mr Cowboy]

It is an administrative punishment....it has nothing to do with whether he was arrested or convicted. Every company has an employment policy that the employees must adhere to. Not doing so can result in ADMINISTRATIVE punishment, up to being fired. That is the Company policy that they are enforcing.

If any of you, at your place of employment, refuse to abide by the company rules, I am sure you will be dealt with appropirately, regardless if you have had a brush with the law.

So quit talking about arrest, convictions, due process. I am sure the NFL has a system for appeals and such, but their decisions are binding.

The NFLPA has an obligation to represent the players in matters like these, but the level of representation is up to the NFLPA. In other words, if they see that it is in the best interest of the NFLPA as a whole to not proceed with all barrels blaring, they don't have to.

 

[Big Dakota]

The NFLPA's job is to represent ALL players no matter what they have done. They don't decide who they represent. The players have no say in who the NFLPA represents since the NFLPA represents all players equally. If this action goes against the CBA then the NFLPA MUST represent the players in question no matter how many players dislike it. Its not a hard concept.

And Jones and Henry will lose.

 

[5Stars]

Set free? They weren't sent to prison. They were suspended from playing in the NFL.

Well, duh! :laugh2: I figured you would have know what I meant...

In other words, if guys like this get off with a slap on the wee-wee for doing what they are doing, and will continue doing things like that, then no NFL player is ever going to take the NFL serious again...it's time for a change.

 

[McCordsville Cowboy]

Poor Pacman....

If he "Makes it Rain" with 80 large, he surely must have alot of bills to pay with no NFL paycheck.

 

[sacase]

It is an administrative punishment....it has nothing to do with whether he was arrested or convicted. Every company has an employment policy that the employees must adhere to. Not doing so can result in ADMINISTRATIVE punishment, up to being fired. That is the Company policy that they are enforcing.

If any of you, at your place of employment, refuse to abide by the company rules, I am sure you will be dealt with appropirately, regardless if you have had a brush with the law.

So quit talking about arrest, convictions, due process. I am sure the NFL has a system for appeals and such, but their decisions are binding.

The NFLPA has an obligation to represent the players in matters like these, but the level of representation is up to the NFLPA. In other words, if they see that it is in the best interest of the NFLPA as a whole to not proceed with all barrels blaring, they don't have to.

Wrong and wrong. The company may have its own policies for conduct but there are also state and federal regulations concering employment. So if the policy violates the regulation then yes it can be overturned.

The NFLPA must represent all players EQUALLY they don't get to pick and choose. If they did then they would be setting themselves up for a lawsuit.

 

[theogt]

Wrong and wrong. The company may have its own policies for conduct but there are also state and federal regulations concering employment. So if the policy violates the regulation then yes it can be overturned.

The NFLPA must represent all players EQUALLY they don't get to pick and choose. If they did then they would be setting themselves up for a lawsuit.

And what federal or state law would prohibit suspending an employee for cause, when their employment contract specifically allows such suspension?

 

[Stash]

Wrong and wrong. The company may have its own policies for conduct but there are also state and federal regulations concering employment. So if the policy violates the regulation then yes it can be overturned.

The NFLPA must represent all players EQUALLY they don't get to pick and choose. If they did then they would be setting themselves up for a lawsuit.

Too bad for the felons that their own union was instrumental in getting this policy implimented.

They may get our joke of a legal system to hear their cases, but I doubt their union will back them.

 

[joseephuss]

The NFLPA will and probably should appeal this. Not from the stand point of getting the suspensions lessoned or removed all together. They should do it to set up standards that will be used in the future. There are clear rules established for suspensions for drug or steroid use. There are no clear definitions for Pacman and Henry type situations. Appeals are a natural part of the process and help bring about these types of standards.

From what I understand, the commisioner has always had the authority to lay down these types of suspensions. It just wasn't done. Now if he can work with the NFLPA, a system can be set up that more clearly defines the process. Players will then have no excuses.

Grandstanding? Maybe to some extent. Sometimes it takes that to make a change. Same with the Haynesworth incident. A record 5 game suspension will make players think twice about taking cheap shots on the field. Merriman's steroid suspension is bringing about possible changes in rules about post season awards. This stuff is not being ignored.

Next in line is probably Tank Johnson. He may be hit with a suspension for next year.

Pacman was not arrested 10 times, but twice is too many. Why should anyone be arrested even once? It really is not that difficult to stay out of trouble. He has been involved with ten separate incidents. There may not have been enough to issue arrest warrants for him in each case, but 10 incidents is a lot for a two year period. That doesn't count the stuff he did while still in college at WVU.

 

[sacase]

And what federal or state law would prohibit suspending an employee for cause, when their employment contract specifically allows such suspension?

it all depends on what the CBA says and also if the CBA is challenged.

 

[theogt]

it all depends on what the CBA says and also if the CBA is challenged.

That would be a contract violation. Obviously if this was applied retroactively and there was no provision allowing such retroactive action, then they'd have a pretty good claim. I doubt the NFL's counsel is dumb enough to allow something like that to happen.

What I'm asking is, what federal or state employment law could have possibly been violated? Seriously. Give me a cite. I'll look it up, cause I'm interested. Or at least a theory.

 

[5Stars]

it all depends on what the CBA says and also if the CBA is challenged.

Where do you work? If you broke company guidlines and got fired or suspended for a year, could you go to the courts and make the company give you your job back?

 

[Kangaroo]

This is about several things even for the Players and why the Union wanted something done themselves. This is about money even for them; a league that is consider trying to do the right thing (testing for steroids; unlike baseball)Not saying it is implemented properly but the NFL seems to be trying and the players seems to care.

So what does that have to do with money well; it creates good will to fans who buy the tickets; jeresy and watch TV the salary. Then marketing deals for shoe contracts etc. So the players having a clean image and the league having a clean image generates more opportunities to get endorsement deals locally or nationally

 

[sacase]

That would be a contract violation. Obviously if this was applied retroactively and there was no provision allowing such retroactive action, then they'd have a pretty good claim. I doubt the NFL's counsel is dumb enough to allow something like that to happen.

What I'm asking is, what federal or state employment law could have possibly been violated? Seriously. Give me a cite. I'll look it up, cause I'm interested. Or at least a theory.

Best bet would look up employement laws, they deal with employee/employer situations and then Labor laws which deal with employer/unions. Although I suspect that much of what will be debated will be the language of the CBA as well as precident that was set with prior incidents. look up the Federal Fair Labor Standards Act it might have some direction but again so much depends on what type of contract these guys are on.

 

[DallasEast]

There's a nasty little bit of Al Sharpton/Jesse Jackson hatin' in this thread. What's that all about?

Anyhoo, I'm going to back the commissioner 100% on his decisions and my support for him has nothing to do with league policy, the law, NFLPA countersuits, general fan opinion, yada, yada, yada. I simply hope that this will be a true wake up call for Jones and Henry.

No, not every player. I don't know or frankly care how the other players will react to one of their own's punishment. IF this punishment, or a variation of it, can generate an epiphany for either of them to understand what it truly means to be a wealthy, famous and eternally blessed National Football League member...

...it will be well-worth the sacrifice for them and them alone. You're in the NFL now. Either finally act like you're a pro football player, both on or off the field, or get the hell out the League. There will always be someone else ready and willing to take your place. And that someone else may even appreciate their career more than you do your own.

/end rant

 

[sacase]

Where do you work? If you broke company guidlines and got fired or suspended for a year, could you go to the courts and make the company give you your job back?

Actually with my job the guidelines are very strict if I break anyof them they don't have to fire me. They just revoke my clearence (which I can appeal) and if I cannot maintain my security clearence then I cannot maintain my job. Besides I work for the goevernment do you know how hard it is to fire us.

 

[5Stars]

There's a nasty little bit of Al Sharpton/Jesse Jackson hatin' in this thread. What's that all about?

Anyhoo, I'm going to back the commissioner 100% on his decisions and my support for him has nothing to do with league policy, the law, NFLPA countersuits, general fan opinion, yada, yada, yada. I simply hope that this will be a true wake up call for Jones and Henry.

No, not every player. I don't know or frankly care how the other players will react to one of their own's punishment. IF this punishment, or a variation of it, can generate an epiphany for either of them to understand what it truly means to be a wealthy, famous and eternally blessed National Football League member...

...it will be well-worth the sacrifice for them and them alone. You're in the NFL now. Either finally act like you're a pro football player, both on or off the field, or get the hell out the League. There will always be someone else ready and willing to take your place. And that someone else may even appreciate their career more than you do your own.

/end rant

A year punishment would be a good lesson for Pacman...besides, I really doubt he is going to starve or have any financial problems for one lousey year! Time to grow up and be responsible for yourself...