Pearson vs. Swann vs. Carmichael: Objective look

Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by StarOfGlory, Jan 15, 2020 at 3:21 PM.

  1. StarOfGlory

    StarOfGlory Well-Known Member

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    Like many of us on these boards, I am incensed that Drew is not in the HoF. I decided to take a look at each receiver and figure out why Drew is not in while the others are.

    First, the raw stats.

    Drew Pearson (11 years)
    489 receptions
    7,822 yards
    48 TD
    Yards per game: 50.1
    1,000 yards seasons: 2
    4x Pro Bowler
    3x 1st Team All Pro
    1x 2nd Team All Pro
    Made the Hail Mary Catch
    1970's All Decade Team

    Lynn Swann (9 years)
    336 receptions
    5,462 yards
    51 TD
    Yards per game: 47.1
    1,000 yard seasons: 0
    3x Pro Bowler
    1x 1st Team All Pro
    2x 2nd Team All Pro
    Super Bowl MVP
    1970's All Decade Team

    Harold Carmichael (13 years, his 14th year in Dallas he barely saw the field, so 13 years)
    590 receptions (played TE his first year at a time they were barely thrown to)
    8,985 yards
    79 TD
    Yards per game: 49.4
    1,000 seasons: 3
    4x Pro Bowl

    Playoffs:
    Drew Pearson:
    22 games, 68 receptions, 8 TD's, 1,,131 yards, 51.4 yards per game
    Lynn Swann: 16 games, 48 receptions, 9 TD's, 907 yards, 56.7 yards per game
    Harold Carmichael: 7 games, 29 receptions, 6 TD's, 465 yards, 66.4 yards per game

    What do these raw stats tell us? Two things jump out:
    • Lynn Swann is the least impactful of the three, though he has been in the HoF for years.
    • Harold Carmichael is by far the most impactful in the playoffs.
    • Carmichael's teams, judging by playoff appearances, have been awful compared to Swann's or Pearson's

    Let's go further. Who were the QB's and how stable was each franchise?

    Swann: One HC (Chuck Noll), One QB (Bradshaw)
    Pearson: One HC (Tom Landry), Two QB's (Staubach and White)
    Carmichael: Six HC's, of which only one was any good (Dick Vermeil), Seven QB's (3 years of Roman Gabriel, of which he was healthy for one, Jaworski, Pisarcik, Boyela, Arrington, Reeves, and three games with the corpse of Dan Pastorini).

    Swann and Pearson played for great coaches and good to great QB's. Carmichael played under mostly garbage coaching and garbage at the QB position. Vermeil was an excellent coach--the other five were horrible-- one year of a very good healthy Roman Gabriel (2 bad injured years), and the good but overrated Jaws with Vermeil. The other QB's were hot garbage.

    After looking at this, and remembering all these receivers play, I would take Carmichael over either Swann or Pearson. And how Swann got in the HoF and Pearson didn't is a mystery. I can't imagine what Staubach could have done with Carmichael, or how good Carmichael would be considered if he had a team with solid ownership, QB play, and coaching.

    My opinion will not be popular. I don't give a ****.
     
  2. brdawk20forever

    brdawk20forever Member

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  3. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    Swann was simply snuck is as part of the Steelers crew.
    Probably because he was also a broadcaster and made friends.

    Carmichael's stats were great until you dig deeper.
    He didn't get many of the broader awards such as Pro Bowl and All Pro because that was one of the darkest periods in Eagles history.
    They won 5 games or less 7 times in his 13 years there.

    I def think he deserved to go in but no one has the combination of success and stats that 88 did.
    He was recognized at the time as majorly impactful on great teams.
    He was selected to All Pro and the All Decade team.
    He played in 22 playoff games.

    The NFL Hall of Fame should be about impact and Drew Pearson was enormous and started the original 88 thread which carried through Dez.
     
  4. Boyzmamacita

    Boyzmamacita CowBabe Up!!! Zone Supporter

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    Perfectly stated.
     
    Bleedblue1111, jterrell and Jake like this.
  5. tyke1doe

    tyke1doe Well-Known Member

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    Swann made among the most memorable Super Bowl catches on a Super Bowl dynasty. That's why he's in.
     
    aikemirv, RD21, Jack Burton and 3 others like this.
  6. eromeopolk

    eromeopolk Well-Known Member

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    When Carmichael retired, he was a top 10 NFL All Time Leading Receiver.

    But he never caught "the Hail Mary", children did not want to grow up to play WR and where no. 17, He never held his hand up with a Super Bowl Ring, he was not named to the NFL 70's All Decade Team, he did not make Clint Longley a one game legend, and he never had to share the football with other WR/TE named Tony Hill, Butch Johnson, Doug Donley, Billy Joe Dupree, Doug Cosbie, Golden Richards, Jay Saldi, and pass receiving RBs like Preston Pearson and Ron Springs.

    Harold Carmichael was 6-8-225 7th round pick WR/TE. Drew Pearson was a UDFA QB from Tulsa.

    So go rethink your ranking position. Yes, opinion are like butt holes, everyone has one including me.

    However, I do not argue, I just explain why I am right and you are wrong.
     
  7. StarOfGlory

    StarOfGlory Well-Known Member

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    I have no reason to rethink my opinion. Carmichael was stuck on a garbage Eagles team with little talent, being the focus of the defense because for most years everyone else on the team sucked. He has trash at QB and for coaches most of the time. Put Carmichael on the Cowboys in his early and prime years and people would think he's a god. He's not first team because he doesn't have the rings. If Pearson didn't have the rings this wouldn't even be a discussion.

    You are allowed to be wrong. It's okay. I don't argue either.

    And Lynn Swann is overrated Steeler trash.
     
  8. cowboy_ron

    cowboy_ron You Can't Fix Stupid

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    BUT.....only one is known for one of the most exciting plays in the game........the HAIL MARY
     
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  9. JustChip

    JustChip Zone Supporter

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    Bingo! Plus, the Steelers were 2-0 head-to-head versus the Cowboys in the Super Bowl. The HoF voters favor players on winning, successful teams over those on also-ran teams. Reverse the Cowboys-Steelers Super Bowl results and Drew most likely is in and Swann isn’t.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020 at 5:11 PM
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  10. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    That makes sense but makes much less sense then with regards to the guy who made the most memorable catch of all time, and member of America's Team not getting in even with far better stats.

    Swann went into broadcasting/media and unquestionably made friends with the very people who decided on entry.
    That is why he was in, But yea Super Bowl X didn't hurt lol.

    The irony is Swann said Calvin Johnson didn't deserve to be in. ROFLMAO.
    Megatron was the best WR in football for a few season's something Swann never accomplished.
    And in 9 years put up astronomical catch and TD totals.
    Again, something Swann never did.

    Megatron simply didn't have that Steelers team around him for the free ride to Canton.
     
  11. daboyzruleperiod

    daboyzruleperiod ♡☆

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    Again the Egals clawed one by us, no matter the topic. The luck of that franchise is neverending. :angry:

     
  12. AbeBeta

    AbeBeta Well-Known Member

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    Stop comparing to the worst WRs.

    Just because one mediocre WR is in it doesn't make mediocre the bar for entry
     
  13. blueblood70

    blueblood70 Well-Known Member

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    east bias
     
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  14. Plankton

    Plankton Well-Known Member

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    My feelings can be summed up very simply.

    Can you tell the story of the NFL, specifically the decade of the 1970s without mentioning Drew Pearson, Lynn Swann and Harold Carmichael?

    For Swann and Pearson, I say no. They played big roles, and are part of the fabric of the 1970s.

    For Carmichael, I say yes. While he was a very good player on a very bad team for most of his career, he doesn't come to mind for most people when you think of the great receivers of the 1970s. You think of guys like Fred Biletnikoff, Paul Warfield, Harold Jackson, Cliff Branch, Lynn Swann and Drew Pearson. Harold Carmichael wouldn't be on that list.
     
  15. cowboysfan99

    cowboysfan99 Well-Known Member

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    Season averages

    Pearson: 44.45 Rec, 711.09 Yds, 4.36 TDs

    Swann: 37.33 Rec, 606.89 Yds, 5.67 TDs

    Carmichael: 45.38 Rec, 691.15 Yds, 6.07 TDs

    Some other guys from his era in the hall of fame:

    Joiner: 44.11 Rec, 714.47 Yds, 3.82 TDs

    Biletnikoff: 42.07 Rec, 641 Yds, 5.42 TDs

    None of those guys (including Stallworth as well) had more than 1 First Team All Pro selection. Carmichael had 0. Pearson had 3.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2020 at 5:26 PM
  16. Sydla

    Sydla Well-Known Member

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    One can't really sit here and argue that Pearson, a Cowboys player, suffered from a lack of exposure.
     
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  17. percyhoward

    percyhoward Research Tool

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    There's no doubt in my mind that the only reason Pearson didn't get in was because Harris and Johnson did.

    And the only reason Howley wasn't even a finalist was because Pearson, Harris, and Johnson were finalists.
     
  18. john van brocklin

    john van brocklin Captain Comeback

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    Nice info, thanks for posting.
    Cant believe Swann is in and Pearson is not.
     
    Keithfansince5 likes this.
  19. CF74

    CF74 Vet Min Plus

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    Carmichael is 6’8” is there really a comparison? And I totally love Drew Pearson, Pearson has been robbed for decades. Swann is trash....
     
  20. john van brocklin

    john van brocklin Captain Comeback

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    Howley not being in, is a crime
     

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