Penalties: caused by aggression, stupidity or lesser talent?

[yimyammer]

Has anyone done an analysis to see what percentage of penalties were the result of a player getting beat versus a mental lapse?

I kind of put penalties in three categories:

1. Mental-These in my mind are unacceptable because they are the result of simply not understanding a rule or not concentrating. Example: false starts, not establishing yourself back in bounds before making a tackle.

2. Skill/Talent/Physical-These are the result of being beat by the opposing player and seem to be evidence of a lack of talent or simply losing a given play. These bother me less because if a player is less talented, a penalty may be the better option to simply being beat. An example would be when a cornerback is beat and has to commit pass interference in order to prevent a TD.

3. Aggression-These bother me the least and I almost feel a few of them might actually be good for a team. These are penalties where a team is so aggressive and violent that they occasionally get a few late hits that result in personal fouls. An example would be where a player hits the QB a smidge too late and gets a personal foul. I think it might be beneficial to be known as a team that will bring the pain in exchange for a few penalties if that means you get in the other teams head and cause the QB to rush his decisions.

I haven't gone back and reviewed every penalty, but my guess is the bulk of the penalties are the result of categories 1 and 2 with little to no penalties resulting from category 3.

I may be wrong here but it seems to me the penalties on Jenkins last weekend were the result of him being beat on the play. Likewise with Baron's hold in Washington.

If the bulk of the penalties are the result of category 2, then I think this is a reflection on the talent we have (or don't have) and maybe that's something we're having trouble coming to grips with.

Thoughts?

 

[Hoofbite]

Caused by laziness and all of the above.

Plus, when you are known as a penalized team the refs look out for it more.

This team will have to play flawless ball to break that label off.

 

[burmafrd]

Ware is the top player at his position in the Game and makes very few mistakes and virtually no penalties (not his fault refs are too dumb to see how quick he is and keep calling him offsides). Witten on the other hand is a top player and makes a lot. Romo is a top player and makes some but not that many. Tnew is same; so is Spencer. Gurode makes too many; Colombo some. Bigg stinks. So does Ball. Jenkins had a really bad game and I hope its not a trend; Scandrick is beginning to look a lot like that CB we got some years ago that could not progress. A lot of the mistakes are made by lesser players, those struggling to make it and stay there.

 

[Venger]

You play like you practice. Something tells me we are not paying attention to these things in practive, ergo they are carrying over into games.

Then you get skill penalties - you got beat by your man and now you have to foul in order to save the TD/QB/whatevah. See above.

 

[LittleBoyBlue]

Plus, when you are known as a penalized team the refs look out for it more.

Yeah, it sucks but that is what appears to be happening. I will go even further in saying we get called for some stuff that other teams dont.

You play like you practice. Something tells me we are not paying attention to these things in practive, ergo they are carrying over into games.

Then you get skill penalties - you got beat by your man and now you have to foul in order to save the TD/QB/whatevah. See above.

Yep, not paying attention. I believe it.

The 2nd part is right on the money. Play like crap - get beat - foul to save....

 

[sago1]

Sure would like to know what those penalties were. We all know many offensive penalties come on pre-snaps. Bet almost all of our offensive penalties are either false starts or holding; too many of the latter are made by players not even involved in the play.

 

[EPL0c0]

the dumbest penalties of all, IMO, are when either a Dlineman or OLB line up offsides or in the neutral zone. It's stupid because it's not like it happens accidentally. They diliberately line up wrong. Coaches can tell them "DON'T DO THAT" but ultimately it's up to them to execute; Ware and Spencer in particular. That extra inch may/may not make the difference, but if you're gonna get flagged for it, what's the point anyway? They were better about this last game, so hopefully they keep it up

 

[CATCH17]

Caused by laziness and all of the above.

Plus, when you are known as a penalized team the refs look out for it more.

This team will have to play flawless ball to break that label off.

This team lacks focus and week to week enthusiasm under Wade and it results in penalties and silly mistakes.

 

[superonyx]

It more complicated than just the categories you mentioned.
Sometimes its scheme that can lead to penalties also. For example the defense is left playing bump coverage with no safety help and the blitz doesnt get to the QB. That scheme just put the defensive back in a bad position to fight for the ball and that can lead to penalties or illegal contact. Also sometimes the coach can get so fancy with sets and formations that a player is forced to adjust mentally on the fly and this causes them to appear to be beat and then they hold. The substitutions, formation changes, ect may have some players feeling unprepared at the last second during a play. It's not a lack of effort on the part of the players. They all want to play 100 percent every play. It is a combination of things. Players out of position who feel the pressure to perform and execute on every play will sometimes hold or grab a little more than they should. This hurts when you see a block in the back away from the play that brings back a long gainer (like the felix screen 2 weeks ago). It is in a way aggression. But not entirely. The players are so amped up to score that sometimes they have a mental lapse during a play and get too aggressive with their assignments.

It seems like we are watched and flagged for so many penalties. You rarely see the opposing team get flagged for half of the things we do. I am biased though so yes i think the refs have labeled us and are abusing us. Things like holds and illegal use of hands or illegal contact are completely judgement calls and i see them going against us way too often for them to be neutral.

 

[DallasEast]

the dumbest penalties of all, IMO, are when either a Dlineman or OLB line up offsides or in the neutral zone. It's stupid because it's not like it happens accidentally. They diliberately line up wrong. Coaches can tell them "DON'T DO THAT" but ultimately it's up to them to execute; Ware and Spencer in particular. That extra inch may/may not make the difference, but if you're gonna get flagged for it, what's the point anyway? They were better about this last game, so hopefully they keep it up

Agreed and that's not the only one that fits into that category. Any penalty which occurs before the ball has been snapped is stupidity incarnate.

Delay of game fits that category. If the play comes in late, it's stupidity on the part of the coaches sending in the call. If player(s) do not line up correctly, it is stupidity on the part of each and every player who does not know their assignment. It is not the quarterback's fault when that happens.

However, when the play has been delivered timely and players have positioned themselves correctly, delay of game caused by the quarterback is his stupidity alone. Play clock management in conjunction with audibling is his sole responsibility in getting right before the play clock expires.

Unless crowd noise is affecting the hearing of every none offensive lineman, false start is another one that falls into this category. Offensive linemen have zero excuses for false starts. Any advantage you are attempting to gain, by only watching the defensive player you're designated to block, is wiped out if you move before the ball is snapped.

If difficulties arise due to crowd noise, linemen must keep the football within their peripheral vision. I say again, "must". It is not optional. No matter how quick the guy(s) are playing in front of you, the ball must be snapped before you move. The only thing which can help you on the line when you can't hear the quarterback is to watch the football. Unless you are blind, there should not be a problem.

False starts caused by receivers/tight ends with clear line-of-sight of the football (e.g. they are positioned up to the line of scrimmage) before the snap are equally guilty of stupidity for the exact same reason given to offensive linemen.

At this point, false start penalties caused by any player (excluding the quarterback) not previously mentioned is relative according to how difficult crowd noise affects hearing the snap count. If a slotted wide receiver, tight end or running back can hear his quarterback, stupidity on the part of the player is 100% if he commits a false start.

Should crowd noise become too great, it is up to the coaches to provide some form of compromising alternative to a verbal snap count. Silent counts, one hut counts and/or hand signals are all viable alternatives. If coaches do not implement them during or before the game, it is the coaches who should wear the mantle of stupidity.

 

[LarryCanadian]

I don't think this team has an "attitude" problem. It is made up of high character - team guys - not "bad boys" or "prima-donnas" for the most part.

Discipline is a problem from another angle. Accountability. There has been no significant repercussion for repeated errors.

I think some of the fouls have been from good effort - the blocks by Austin and Bennett this year have been iffy calls - and they are doing their jobs.

So it comes down to smarts and focus and confidence too. The false starts and offsides by defense, lining up wrong, those are repetition and reminder penalties and DO come down to coaching in my opinion. Work on it over and over or change guys. Bench guys, etc.

The celebration penalty is a symptom of a team that is still "inmature" somehow. This team should have higher expectations of itself and not need to celebrate a TD that ties up a game in a 1-2 season already. Good God, if you are 3-0 and up by 3 scores, maybe, but just hand the ball to the ref and go win your individual battles. That is leadership and coaching. Someone needs to step up and say "we aren't a friggin Pee Wee team, and let's celebrate when we have actually accomplished something". That attitude or lack of professional/hungry smart/focussed footbal is what BUGS me as a fan.

They should have higher expectations of themselves. They play like they are so happy to be able to score a touchdown. What does that say about the overall team confidence level and focus. Really surprises me with the truly high amount of talent. They don't play with the tough swagger.

Mental toughness. I do believe it can be trained into these guys, not sure the headcoach is the one to do it. Don't know enough about Garrett.

Please everyone stop talking about penalties under Parcells though. Parcells team had 1/4 the talent of these guys, so his teams had to cheat at times to compete. Our guys shouldn't have to. They should win on ability and execution. Just look at the rosters.

Our penalties are more out of sloppiness. Penalties under Parcells were partially nerves/fear of Parcells, and guys trying to not look bad.

The benching of Davis was a great move. More of that please. Need depth to do that, but other than Oline I think we have the depth.

I don't care how talented or highly paid, or "professional" anybody can use a wake-up call to be more focussed.

LarryCanadian