Position needs and the draft

Dalmations202

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Draft BPA that will start in the first round.
Round 2-4 need to be biggest needs : (QB depending on Dak signature), DT, MLB, FS, OT or C, CB
Rounds 5-7 need to be players with huge upside, but warts in their game -- not warts in mental makeup.

Football is a continual upgrade game. Jerry needs to remember that. Skills decline. Never be satisfied. It isn't a family, but a hard very profitable business.
 

visionary

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Great thread

The way I look at "need" in the draft is a combination of scarcity, BPA, and need plus .

When it comes to scarcity there are two principles. First is big man theory. It is the idea that there are only so many men above 6'2"+ 300+ lbs men with athletic talent and college experience in the world. If you need one then they go to the top of the list.

BPA and need I assume everyone understands but here I combine them. You create a pool of positions of need and then you pick the BPA. If there is a RB at the top of the round and a DT at the bottom as the remainder of your need group then you pick the DT. Only way this is deviated from is if the round is completely wiped out. Then you have to be creative. Trade downs, reaches, or ignoring need.

Of course this makes things difficult if you are picking at the end of the round. Your need groups are often wiped out. We are unlikely to have to deal with that this year.

Group 1: Enormous needs. Missing starters.

DT: World theory and lack of talent describe this roster even when healthy. This team has needed an athletic 315 lber in the middle of the defense for a long time.

OT: This one is tricky. On the one hand, you have world theory on the other you have Smith and Collins. The reason why i include this is because Smith has been out of service for two years now because of recurring injuries. On top of that is stories of cartilage damage leading to bone on bone with Collins. If Collins is good to go then I believe OT is still a need just not as big of one. If Collins' injuries are overblown OT goes to the bottom of the list. It is still a need just not quite so dire.

S: We don't need SS types. We need an instinctive S that can run and change direction. 40, shuttle and cone scores are key here. The tape tells the rest.

LB: We have bodies. We don't have reliable talent. LVE can play but he cannot stay on the field and Smith is soft, dumb, and selfish to detriment. We need a physical, instinctive LB with good SPARQ. He needs to be able to take on blocks and have the off the field work ethic to learn route combinations and opponents tendencies.

Group 2. Bodies present and nothing behind

CB: Brown and Diggs are starters. A top 100 pick to move Brown to the slot or play the boundary themselves is not a bad idea but you can pick up slot guys with talent in the middle of the draft because they do not need ideal size. Resigning Lewis or similar lessens this need, but 5 good corners is still the goal. World theory applies to a lesser degree. There are only so many prospects with 4.40 speed and 3.9 shuttles.

C: Biadasz is a good prospect but he has done nothing to solidify the spot. Looney is a FA. A good interior OL prospect with the head to handle the pivot is the ideal here. With McGovern in the fold backing up the starters the pick here needs to be able to start. Developmental types early are out of the question.

QB: Dalton is a FA. We need a backup. FA is likely the better option and I'd wager the one the Cowboys will take with either Dalton or elsewhere. QB in the first is not going to happen and outside the first it is typically a bust. I do look forward to the tears when Prescott is franchised.

Group 3. Starters and depth present

RB: We have Zeke and Pollard. RB is not a position where you need to draft early as they are often plug and play. We do need 3 though and a FB prospect would help a lot. McCarthy has always liked them and we don't have one.

TE: Jarwin and Schultz are locks and talented. We have the inline and the downfield threat. Still need 3 and Bell is a FA.

WR: Cooper, Lamb, and Gallup oh my. Wilson and Brown are FA but I expect one or both to be back as they won't be costly. Late round SPARQ guy is not a bad idea. World theory.

OG: Martin, Williams, and McGovern are already in the fold. Late rounder is not out of the question.

DE: DLaw, Gregory, Armstrong, and Anae. Smith needs to be our priority FA but even then our cup is full.

Great post :clap:
 

USArmyVet

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we have 3 qbs on the roster that are worth keeping, 1 is a top 5-6 in the nfl, one is a low end starter or high end backup, one is a project with potential

and while you might not consider yourself a “dak hater” and are just looking not to overpay dak as you state, the vast majority that make a one word reply in a thread like this like you did, do so because they are firmly against dak....so based on the history on this site, my response was very logical, nothing personal against you.- my apologies if I insulted you.

however, teams do not move on from top 10 starting qbs in their prime and I would bet the farm that Dallas doesn’t not deviate from that.

dak will get the 35 mil or so that he wants and the time frame in length...which is why all of the big draft picks have to go to defense to make sure we have top talent on defense at cheap contracts


We have 1 QB on the roster as Dak and Dalton are not under contract after this season. Dak is not a Top 5-6 QB and Dalton has shown he can get the job done so why not sign Dalton to a 2-year contract to start while drafting a QB to learn under Dalton......both of whom would count less than Dak against the cap so the savings could go toward improving the defense. Hell, call up the 49ers after applying the non-exclusive franchise tag on Dak and work out a deal wherein Dallas gets the 49ers 1st round draft pick in 2021 as well as LB Fred Warner (SF can move on from Jimmy G. and can't afford to extend Warner).

Dallas then gets a quality improvement at LB while also getting an additional 1st round pick in 2021. Hell, trade Jaylon Smith to the Raiders for a 3rd round draft pick as their GM loved Jaylon when he was coming out in the draft.
 

Doomsday101

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We have 1 QB on the roster as Dak and Dalton are not under contract after this season. Dak is not a Top 5-6 QB and Dalton has shown he can get the job done so why not sign Dalton to a 2-year contract to start while drafting a QB to learn under Dalton......both of whom would count less than Dak against the cap so the savings could go toward improving the defense. Hell, call up the 49ers after applying the non-exclusive franchise tag on Dak and work out a deal wherein Dallas gets the 49ers 1st round draft pick in 2021 as well as LB Fred Warner (SF can move on from Jimmy G. and can't afford to extend Warner).

Dallas then gets a quality improvement at LB while also getting an additional 1st round pick in 2021. Hell, trade Jaylon Smith to the Raiders for a 3rd round draft pick as their GM loved Jaylon when he was coming out in the draft.

So you think little of Dak but the 9ers will feel different? lol. I have no doubt Dak will be the QB of this team and all this talk here means nothing. Some don't like Dak that is fine but it changes nothing
 

Jipper

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We have 1 QB on the roster as Dak and Dalton are not under contract after this season. Dak is not a Top 5-6 QB and Dalton has shown he can get the job done so why not sign Dalton to a 2-year contract to start while drafting a QB to learn under Dalton......both of whom would count less than Dak against the cap so the savings could go toward improving the defense. Hell, call up the 49ers after applying the non-exclusive franchise tag on Dak and work out a deal wherein Dallas gets the 49ers 1st round draft pick in 2021 as well as LB Fred Warner (SF can move on from Jimmy G. and can't afford to extend Warner).

Dallas then gets a quality improvement at LB while also getting an additional 1st round pick in 2021. Hell, trade Jaylon Smith to the Raiders for a 3rd round draft pick as their GM loved Jaylon when he was coming out in the draft.

I disagree with you that Dak is not a 5-6 qb and the majority pundits and analysts out there agree that he is in that range. Additionally his stats and wins back that up as well over his career.

Dalton is not Dak - he has had a couple of good games against very very bad teams (cincy, philly, 49ers) so trying to rely on him to build a team around will get you what? 8-8, 9-7?, also what makes you think he wants to help a young qb develop? Further, why waste draft capital on a QB when you are arguing that we need a lot of defensive help?

We already have a top qb - the defense needs fixing. Plus the deals and trades you are talking about are so hypothetical and you and I both know extremely unlikely to materialize.

I personally think you are pretty far off if you think that Dallas isn't resigning Dak, teams do not let top qbs in their prime go....and based on your assessment of dak, it appears you have a bias against Dak or at least a lesser view of him than is warranted, so we will agree to disagree.
 

jazzcat22

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It gets old. I have them all on ignore. Tired of seeing them cry. Anyhoo, put them on ignore, it's a quick fix. :muttley:

I have a Dak hater or a few, almost another one, and a few Zeke haters on ignore as well. And a 3rd close to it. :laugh:
It does make a difference.
Could add the Jaylon haters, but that means 3/4 of the board, and can't disagree with some of them on certain topics. :laugh:
 

jterrell

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QB - They are determined to sign Dak. ---Of Course. Dak is a top 10 QB. Tag then quickly extend.
RB - Stuck with Zekes contract and Pollard is solid ---I'd still consider a comp pick at RB., They need a 3rd guy and future cheap option.
WR - we are set ---yes
TE - Jarwin and Schultz are solid and Bell is a contributor ---yes
OG - Martin, Williams and Mcgovern - good to go ---yes
OT - Tron, Collins, Knight, Steele, maybe re-sign Irving and Martin in a pinch - set ---We don't know the actual health status of our OTs so this one is a wildcard.
C - Biadasz and hopefully re-sign Looney --- yes

You never ignore a side of the ball completely in the draft but you gotta really find a sterling value to pull that trigger before late.

DE - DLaw , Gregory, Hopefully Aldon will re-sign and Anae waiting in the wings --- Still can use a young Edge here but it is a lower priority than anything else on defense.
3tech - Trysten Hill, Gallimore and Crawford if he wants to stick around cheaply --- They don't really use 1T and 3T now as that was Rod terminology.. Gallimore and Hill will return but neither is a starter caliber player at this point. T%C isn't returning.
1tech - a need in the draft and keep one of the current suspects as backup --- See above... AWoods comes back and you need a starting Nose Tackle.
LB - draft 2--yes yes if chance occurs.
CB - Draft 2 and re-sign Lewis if affordable to go with Diggs --ideally you;d draft 2 but most importantly you need 1 that can start.
FS - draft one early --- would be nice to draft one early
SS i Wilson might be the answer --- agree though i'd draft one if I could for depth.

P - keep the new guy ---yes
K - Zuerline --- is likely back.

Not mad at your draft but A, you will have comp picks. 3.4.5.7 says spotrac.
B. You do not want to draft Adrian Frye. He was like CB4 at Tech last year and would be insane to come out. But Zech McPhearson... absolutely.
 

FiveSuperBowls

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QB - They are determined to sign Dak.
RB - Stuck with Zekes contract and Pollard is solid
WR - we are set
TE - Jarwin and Schultz are solid and Bell is a contributor
OG - Martin, Williams and Mcgovern - good to go
OT - Tron, Collins, Knight, Steele, maybe re-sign Irving and Martin in a pinch - set
C - Biadazz and hopefully re-sign Looney

I don't see any reason to use any draft picks on offense

DE - DLaw , Gregory, Hopefully Aldon will re-sign and Anae waiting in the wings
3tech - Trysten Hill, Gallimore and Crawford if he wants to stick around cheaply
1tech - a need in the draft and keep one of the current suspects as backup
LB - draft 2
CB - Draft 2 and re-sign Lewis if affordable to go with Diggs
FS - draft one early
SS i Wilson might be the answer

P - keep the new guy
K - Zeurline

I think the draft should look something like this

1:15 Caleb Farley CB Virginia Tech
2:15 Nick Bolton LB Missouri
3:14 Trevon Moehrig FS TCU
4:15 Jordan Davis NT Georgia
6:15 Ernest Jones LB South Carolina
7:15 Adrian Frye CB Texas Tech
Defense all the way, but going to need an OT at some point in the draft. I will be pissed if they draft a TE.
 

TheCoolFan

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Need a DT but I don't see any worth taking in the 1st round. 3rd round might be the sweet spot to take one, especially if it's a run stuffer
 

Sydla

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Draft oline every year

This team needs to do much better at finding mid-round OL and turning them into good players. It seems we can only find good ones if we use a first round pick on them (yes, I know, Collins was a UDFA but he would have been a first round pick - it was an easy move to sign him).
 

Bigdog

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QB - They are determined to sign Dak.
RB - Stuck with Zekes contract and Pollard is solid
WR - we are set
TE - Jarwin and Schultz are solid and Bell is a contributor
OG - Martin, Williams and Mcgovern - good to go
OT - Tron, Collins, Knight, Steele, maybe re-sign Irving and Martin in a pinch - set
C - Biadazz and hopefully re-sign Looney

I don't see any reason to use any draft picks on offense

DE - DLaw , Gregory, Hopefully Aldon will re-sign and Anae waiting in the wings
3tech - Trysten Hill, Gallimore and Crawford if he wants to stick around cheaply
1tech - a need in the draft and keep one of the current suspects as backup
LB - draft 2
CB - Draft 2 and re-sign Lewis if affordable to go with Diggs
FS - draft one early
SS i Wilson might be the answer

P - keep the new guy
K - Zeurline

I think the draft should look something like this

1:15 Caleb Farley CB Virginia Tech
2:15 Nick Bolton LB Missouri
3:14 Trevon Moehrig FS TCU
4:15 Jordan Davis NT Georgia
6:15 Ernest Jones LB South Carolina
7:15 Adrian Frye CB Texas Tech
Sign me up for that draft. Love the first 4 picks.
 

xwalker

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QB - They are determined to sign Dak.
RB - Stuck with Zekes contract and Pollard is solid
WR - we are set
TE - Jarwin and Schultz are solid and Bell is a contributor
OG - Martin, Williams and Mcgovern - good to go
OT - Tron, Collins, Knight, Steele, maybe re-sign Irving and Martin in a pinch - set
C - Biadazz and hopefully re-sign Looney

I don't see any reason to use any draft picks on offense

DE - DLaw , Gregory, Hopefully Aldon will re-sign and Anae waiting in the wings
3tech - Trysten Hill, Gallimore and Crawford if he wants to stick around cheaply
1tech - a need in the draft and keep one of the current suspects as backup
LB - draft 2
CB - Draft 2 and re-sign Lewis if affordable to go with Diggs
FS - draft one early
SS i Wilson might be the answer

P - keep the new guy
K - Zeurline

I think the draft should look something like this

1:15 Caleb Farley CB Virginia Tech
2:15 Nick Bolton LB Missouri
3:14 Trevon Moehrig FS TCU
4:15 Jordan Davis NT Georgia
6:15 Ernest Jones LB South Carolina
7:15 Adrian Frye CB Texas Tech

In the 2021 NFL draft, any focus on need should be based on the projected need in 2022.

Betting on a draft pick to be successful long term is a risky bet based on draft history.

Betting on any specific draft pick to be a quality player as a rookie makes it a 100x more risky bet.

There is a good probability that some players in a team's draft class will be quality contributors as rookies; however, betting on it being any 1 specific player makes it a low probability.
 

cern

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So you think little of Dak but the 9ers will feel different? lol. I have no doubt Dak will be the QB of this team and all this talk here means nothing. Some don't like Dak that is fine but it changes nothing
good response. it is odd that some vilify a player, but then think they can trade him to another team for a huge windfall. the salary cap isn't played with monopoly money. too many think you can find another 20-30 million any time you need to just by restructuring deals. jerry put us in cap hell with that strategy.
 

FuzzyLumpkins

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We have 1 QB on the roster as Dak and Dalton are not under contract after this season. Dak is not a Top 5-6 QB and Dalton has shown he can get the job done so why not sign Dalton to a 2-year contract to start while drafting a QB to learn under Dalton......both of whom would count less than Dak against the cap so the savings could go toward improving the defense. Hell, call up the 49ers after applying the non-exclusive franchise tag on Dak and work out a deal wherein Dallas gets the 49ers 1st round draft pick in 2021 as well as LB Fred Warner (SF can move on from Jimmy G. and can't afford to extend Warner).

Dallas then gets a quality improvement at LB while also getting an additional 1st round pick in 2021. Hell, trade Jaylon Smith to the Raiders for a 3rd round draft pick as their GM loved Jaylon when he was coming out in the draft.

What job? Win a championship? Unreasonable.

He is productive and efficient. He was leading the league in yards and very high in YPA, TD, and accuracy. He is 5000 yd, 30 TD, 8 ypa, 68% productive.

He does not turn the ball over. He has pocket presence and the ability to escape trouble. He is a threat when he runs the ball. He can read defenses quickly and accurately. Players gravitate towards him and follow his lead. The coaches trust him.

Off the field, he is a diligent worker that improves his game every year. He is an outstanding citizen who contributes significantly to charities and community outreach.

Dalton is 33 years old while Dak is 27. You can sign Dak to 5 years and expect improvement. Not so with Dalton who is year to year at his age and at his best was a 4000 yd 20 TD guy with middling pick rate.

Dalton is an excellent backup and at best middling starter worse he has a short shelf life. He is significantly inferior to Prescott in every way.

The only argument I see against him is W-L and as I keep saying that is the same type of thinking that got Newton an MVP. Football is the ultimate team game and our defense was awful for months and has only improved to making some plays while giving up tons of yards.
 

cjlopez

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QB - They are determined to sign Dak.
RB - Stuck with Zekes contract and Pollard is solid
WR - we are set
TE - Jarwin and Schultz are solid and Bell is a contributor
OG - Martin, Williams and Mcgovern - good to go
OT - Tron, Collins, Knight, Steele, maybe re-sign Irving and Martin in a pinch - set
C - Biadazz and hopefully re-sign Looney

I don't see any reason to use any draft picks on offense

DE - DLaw , Gregory, Hopefully Aldon will re-sign and Anae waiting in the wings
3tech - Trysten Hill, Gallimore and Crawford if he wants to stick around cheaply
1tech - a need in the draft and keep one of the current suspects as backup
LB - draft 2
CB - Draft 2 and re-sign Lewis if affordable to go with Diggs
FS - draft one early
SS i Wilson might be the answer

P - keep the new guy
K - Zeurline

I think the draft should look something like this

1:15 Caleb Farley CB Virginia Tech
2:15 Nick Bolton LB Missouri
3:14 Trevon Moehrig FS TCU
4:15 Jordan Davis NT Georgia
6:15 Ernest Jones LB South Carolina
7:15 Adrian Frye CB Texas Tech


The only think ....Crawford is GONE.....any DT in the DRAFT or one on the PS would be a better bet than him. Crawford should have been waived this year prior to his salary being guaranteed. Always DRAFT a LB and a CB. I would also DRAFT a OL within Round 1-3. I like your mock.....UP to 3 Rounds. I don't see Trevon Moehrig lasting until the 3rd Round. Nick Bolton might be there at two, but I think you are going to have to pick between Bolton or Moehrig.
 
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