Projected Starting Lineup on Defense

[Alexander]

We need lots of things to fall into place for this to be a competitive defense:

1. Rivers needs to be a solid backup.
2. Lee needs to be healthy for an entire season
3. Demarcus Lawrence has to be the guy we thought he was.
4. Brent needs to be able to carry a full load.

If we are counting on this as a necessity, we are already doomed. Rivers is basically a roster fill signing, if we are "counting on" him to suddenly be worthwhile, heaven help us. I could also go with the Brent thing, since apparently there is the misperception he was some sort of destroyer of worlds even before he took a layoff. Lee and Lawrence points are 1 and 2, respectively.

 

[sureletsrace]

Seriously, Sean Lee deserves so much better than to be surrounded by these clowns (Tyronne Crawford and Orlando Scandrick excluded)

The only thing he's been surrounded by as of late is an ice bath.

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/if

Giggidy ?

 

[Aven8]

Projected Starting Lineup on Defense if McClain returns:

Position 2014 Starter > 2015 Starter
RDE Mincey > Lawrence
DT3T Crawford > Crawford
DT1T Hayden > Brent
LDE Selvie > Mincey
WLB Hitchens/Durant > Lee
MLB RoMc > RoMc
SLB Carter/Wilber > Hitchens
CB1 Scandrick > Scandrick
CB2 Carr > Carr
CB3 Moore > Patmon or Draft Pick unless Moore returns
Safety1 Wilcox > Wilcox
Safety2 Church > Church

The starting lineup looks as good or better than in 2014, IMO.

There is currently less depth, but they can add to that with the draft and from several intriguing developmental types from last season (Bishop, Coleman, Whaley ) and some veteran depth like Dekoda Watson, Keith Rivers and Okoye.

Can Lawrence be better than Mincey? Yes.
Can Brent be better than Hayden? Yes.
Can Mincey move to LDE and be better than Selvie? Definitely Yes.
Can Lee be better than Hitchens/Durant? Definitely Yes.
Can Hitchens be better than Carter/Wilber? He was already starting over Carter at the end of the season.
Can Patmon, a draft pick or low level veteran signing be better than Moore? Probably.

A free agent DE could really have pushed the 2015 lineup way past the 2014 lineup in terms of ability.

Full Definition of IF

a : in the event that

b : allowing that

c : on the assumption that

d : on condition that

Thanks for the effort X. If you wouldn't mind, would you mind doing this with the current backups as well? I know it's hard to project this early, but I wouldn't mind seeing the depth chart.

With Marinelli the rotation IMO is a huge deal and I hope somehow we replinish it!

 

[TrailBlazer]

That starting lineup is not good. And there's no depth. Several of these projected starters will go down. And we will yet again be relying on unproven players. Need to hit a home run in the draft. Not exactly pleased with how the defense has been addressed the past 2 years bit will withhold judgment for now.

 

[Nightman]

Projected Starting Lineup on Defense if McClain returns:

Position 2014 Starter > 2015 Starter
RDE Mincey > Lawrence
DT3T Crawford > Crawford
DT1T Hayden > Brent
LDE Selvie > Mincey
WLB Hitchens/Durant > Lee
MLB RoMc > RoMc
SLB Carter/Wilber > Hitchens
CB1 Scandrick > Scandrick
CB2 Carr > Carr
CB3 Moore > Patmon or Draft Pick unless Moore returns
Safety1 Wilcox > Wilcox
Safety2 Church > Church

The starting lineup looks as good or better than in 2014, IMO.

There is currently less depth, but they can add to that with the draft and from several intriguing developmental types from last season (Bishop, Coleman, Whaley ) and some veteran depth like Dekoda Watson, Keith Rivers and Okoye.

Can Lawrence be better than Mincey? Yes.
Can Brent be better than Hayden? Yes.
Can Mincey move to LDE and be better than Selvie? Definitely Yes.
Can Lee be better than Hitchens/Durant? Definitely Yes.
Can Hitchens be better than Carter/Wilber? He was already starting over Carter at the end of the season.
Can Patmon, a draft pick or low level veteran signing be better than Moore? Probably.

A free agent DE could really have pushed the 2015 lineup way past the 2014 lineup in terms of ability.

Full Definition of IF

a : in the event that

b : allowing that

c : on the assumption that

d : on condition that

I'm usually optimistic but this is a tough sell and there is no reason for it. Spend some darn money and get some decent players. They have become obsessed with value over quality. Not ever deal has to a win for the team on paper.

We lost Spencer-SDE, Melton-DT, Selvie-DE, Carter-SLB, RoMc-MLB, Durant- WLB, Moore-Nickel CB

We gained Lee-WLB, Rivers- SLB, Brinkley-MLB

We need a DT, SDE, SLB and CB to break even on a pretty average Defense that lost it's best player Demarco Murray.

 

[Nightman]

..........................Mincey.......BCrawford.......Brent.........DLaw.............
.........................Gardner......McClain...........Bishop.....JCrawford...........
......Hitchens....................................Brinkley..............................Lee..........
......Rivers........................................CLawrence........................Wilber.....
Carr........................Church........................................Wilcox................OScan
Patmon..................Heath..........................................?????................Claiborne

 

[endersdragon]

I'm usually optimistic but this is a tough sell and there is no reason for it. Spend some darn money and get some decent players. They have become obsessed with value over quality. Not ever deal has to a win for the team on paper.

We lost Spencer-SDE, Melton-DT, Selvie-DE, Carter-SLB, RoMc-MLB, Durant- WLB, Moore-Nickel CB

We gained Lee-WLB, Rivers- SLB, Brinkley-MLB

We need a DT, SDE, SLB and CB to break even on a pretty average Defense that lost it's best player Demarco Murray.

Spencer was a 2nd string DE who had 0 sacks last year. Melton was a 3rd string DT who played decently in a few games but his lack of run defense really hurt us. Selvie is also a second string DE who had a good 2013 season but was hit and miss last year, Carter is a big loss but should replaced by Lee, I firmly believe that McClain is coming back, Durant wasn't on our team 2/3 of last year and Hitchens (a 4th rounder) replaced him well, and Moore is a JAG who might be back. Nothing there seems that hard to replace.

 

[windward]

Looks like a league average defense, which is what we were last year. Improving the D Line will go a long way to making this an above average unit.

 

[honyock]

Projected Starting Lineup on Defense if McClain returns:

Position 2014 Starter > 2015 Starter
RDE Mincey > Lawrence
DT3T Crawford > Crawford
DT1T Hayden > Brent
LDE Selvie > Mincey
WLB Hitchens/Durant > Lee
MLB RoMc > RoMc
SLB Carter/Wilber > Hitchens
CB1 Scandrick > Scandrick
CB2 Carr > Carr
CB3 Moore > Patmon or Draft Pick unless Moore returns
Safety1 Wilcox > Wilcox
Safety2 Church > Church

The starting lineup looks as good or better than in 2014, IMO.

There is currently less depth, but they can add to that with the draft and from several intriguing developmental types from last season (Bishop, Coleman, Whaley ) and some veteran depth like Dekoda Watson, Keith Rivers and Okoye.

Can Lawrence be better than Mincey? Yes.
Can Brent be better than Hayden? Yes.
Can Mincey move to LDE and be better than Selvie? Definitely Yes.
Can Lee be better than Hitchens/Durant? Definitely Yes.
Can Hitchens be better than Carter/Wilber? He was already starting over Carter at the end of the season.
Can Patmon, a draft pick or low level veteran signing be better than Moore? Probably.

A free agent DE could really have pushed the 2015 lineup way past the 2014 lineup in terms of ability.

Full Definition of IF

a : in the event that

b : allowing that

c : on the assumption that

d : on condition that

Nice thread xwalker.

The biggest glaring weakness in that starting lineup (other than the giant IF of Lee's ability to stay healthy) is the backups along the defensive line. The starting four has a plus player (Crawford) and a possibly plus player (we'll find out about Lawrence). But given Marinelli and his rotating rushmen, the backups will play significant minutes. And so far its a really big dropoff from starters to backups.

Crawford and Mincey played too many snaps last year, especially Mincey. Maybe TMcClain can be healthy from the start and give decent play at the 3 rotation, but that's a big maybe. And there just doesn't look to be anyone yet to give quality snaps as rotational DE's. If they can't find a stud rusher, then at least they need to find a solid LDE who will allow Mincey to spend some time both at LDE and rotating at RDE with Lawrence.

I feel better about the possibility of a rookie linebacker to come in and give some significant help...that happens a lot more frequently than rookie d-linemen, as many have said already. I'm less nervous about the linebacking corps than I am about the line.

 

[BlindFaith]

LDE------------1T---------3T---------RDE
Mincey-------Bryant--Crawford--Lawrence
M Edwards---Brent---Bennett-----Hunter
-----Gardner-------Whaley

Pick up Red Bryant. He's an upgrade over Brent/Bishop and certainly Hayden.

Trade down with Jax. Jax gets our 1 and picks Gurley. We get Jax 2nd, 3rd and 5th

Draft
2nd Danielle Hunter DE (from Jax)
2nd Michael Bennett DT
3rd Jay Ajayi RB (from Jax)
3rd Mario Edwards DE
4th Doran Grant CB
5th Kwan Alexander OLB (from Jax)
5th Ty Montgomery WR
7th Dean Marlowe FS
7th Corey Grant RB/Returner (ran a 4.26 at pro day, some had him as low as 4.19)

 

[xwalker]

Nice thread xwalker.

The biggest glaring weakness in that starting lineup (other than the giant IF of Lee's ability to stay healthy) is the backups along the defensive line. The starting four has a plus player (Crawford) and a possibly plus player (we'll find out about Lawrence). But given Marinelli and his rotating rushmen, the backups will play significant minutes. And so far its a really big dropoff from starters to backups.

Crawford and Mincey played too many snaps last year, especially Mincey. Maybe TMcClain can be healthy from the start and give decent play at the 3 rotation, but that's a big maybe. And there just doesn't look to be anyone yet to give quality snaps as rotational DE's. If they can't find a stud rusher, then at least they need to find a solid LDE who will allow Mincey to spend some time both at LDE and rotating at RDE with Lawrence.

I feel better about the possibility of a rookie linebacker to come in and give some significant help...that happens a lot more frequently than rookie d-linemen, as many have said already. I'm less nervous about the linebacking corps than I am about the line.

They have many options at DT but are very thin at DE, IMO. I would be OK with Crawford, Brent, Bishop and T. McClain as the DTs with the 1 or 2 of Coleman, Whaley, Okoye making the roster as upside guys. I'm less optimistic at DE with not much behind Lawrence and Mincey. I can see 1 of Gardner, Edwards or Boatright stepping up but that still leaves them need 1 or 2 more DEs.

I'm not too worried about LB. I wouldn't be worried at all if I thought Lee could stay healthy. Rivers, Watson and Brinkley are all legit NFL players.

 

[waving monkey]

Since we weren't going to sign Murray, I was expecting at least one or two FAs picked up on Defense;

It didn't happen.....yet. And I don't think it will. They will rotate rookies in that list xwalker put together and pick up some tier 2 tier 3 guys and see if they can make the rotation too.

We really do have a no-name Defense.... We need are own nickname for them though....

It didn't happen. it hasn't happened this is March 14th 2015

 

[waving monkey]

X, I like your shot at the defense. I think that the just signed journeymen linebackers holds that positional group together. I am very looking forward to a group of Lee, McClain, and Hitchens.

I think that Anthony Spencer means more to this defense and a rotational strength, than meets the eye to a lot fans.

Me, I think that two defensive linemen and a running back are paramount in the draft.

Spencer seems pretty important to me too.
DL pressure guys are essential and a RB in the top two rds.

 

[waving monkey]

They have many options at DT but are very thin at DE, IMO. I would be OK with Crawford, Brent, Bishop and T. McClain as the DTs with the 1 or 2 of Coleman, Whaley, Okoye making the roster as upside guys. I'm less optimistic at DE with not much behind Lawrence and Mincey. I can see 1 of Gardner, Edwards or Boatright stepping up but that still leaves them need 1 or 2 more DEs.

I'm not too worried about LB. I wouldn't be worried at all if I thought Lee could stay healthy. Rivers, Watson and Brinkley are all legit NFL players.

wouldn't you think Spencer is fairly important this year and then needing one high dart pick at DE

 

[gimmesix]

Ah, you read from the handbook very well.

Any objective fan looks at that projected starting lineup and sees a severe lack of talent.

Hey, that might account for these horrible defensive seasons we've seen here lately, but what do I know.

Not completely. There's definitely some weaknesses, especially if we don't get McClain back, but there's some good players and players with potential as well. I do think our depth is shaky unless some of the younger players come through. (We seem to be relying on that, though, which I don't think is a good way to go about it.)

At end, we need Lawrence to build on what he showed in the playoffs, and Mincey was our best end last year ... but I don't know how well he'd play left end.

Crawford was clearly our best 3-tech and was quite disruptive. Terrell McClain flashed a little when he was in the 3-tech role, but not sure how much he adds.

I wasn't impressed with Brent at all in the 1-tech and think that would be one of our weakest positions. Quite frankly, I'd rather have Hayden than what Brent provided.

The combination of Lee and McClain (if healthy) could be as good as any LB combo in the league, and Hitchens was good enough to earn a shot at starting, although I don't like him being given a starting spot by default.

Orlando is a very good corner, while Carr has been up and down. Depth is hurt without Moore, but I do like Patmon and hold out slim hope for Claiborne.

Neither safety is anything great, but both are good players.

If we get McClain back, I think we can be middle of the pack on defense again, although depth might hamper our ability to do that because we rotated a bunch of guys to allow our linemen to stay fresh. Without that, I think the guys we have will get worn down and go from OK to awful.

 

[Nightman]

My ideal at this point........Draft1 has to be Gurley now

.............Mincey/DLaw.......Crawford........Draft2...........Da Kracken..............
.......Hitchens.................................RoMcClain.................................Lee..........
Carr..................Church......................................Wlicox..........................OScan
Draft3

 

[romothesavior]

I wish I could share your optimism but I really don't see how this defense got better.

 

[davey999]

Compare that lineup to some of the top 10 defenses in the league - it's not even close.

 

[xwalker]

Thanks for the effort X. If you wouldn't mind, would you mind doing this with the current backups as well? I know it's hard to project this early, but I wouldn't mind seeing the depth chart.

With Marinelli the rotation IMO is a huge deal and I hope somehow we replinish it!

In regards to backups, they have a lot of possibilities on DL and at LB but not much at all at CB and Safety.

Backups
DE
Gardner - A really good college play with good measurable(s) other than short arms.
Boatright - Beat out Michael Sam and other to get promoted to the 53 last last season.
Edwards - Flashed some athletic ability last season.

DT
Bishop - Played a playoff game and a couple of regular season games. Had 5 tackles in 1 playoff game compared to 2 tackles in 2 games for Hayden. Very strong and quick.
T. McClain - Veteran. Flashed in 2014 but limited by injuries. Just as he appeared to be getting back for form from original injury, was then out with a different injury.
Coleman - Good physical ability but has to learn to play the game correctly.
Whaley - Looked terrific in college game footage at Texas but was injured and known to be out for the season at draft time.
Okoye - A legit veteran and still only 27. Youngest 1st rounder ever, IIRC. Had the brain infection and basically lost a year of his life.
Jack Crawford - Played both DT and DE in 2014. Looked best at DT.

LB
Rivers - Legit NFL player but very often injured.
Brinkley - Legit NFL MLB on base downs. Limited in coverage.
Watson - Oddly cut by Jax while injured after they had just given him a significant contract. The Cowboys kept him on the 53 despite him injured and inactive for several weeks. A good indicator that they like him for the future.
Wilber - Solid if unspectacular SLB.
Cam Lawrence - Special Teamer
Keith Smith - Played some at LB in 1 or 2 games. Back and forth between the 53 and practice squad but got more snaps at LB than Cam Lawrence.
Will Smith - Draft pick. Looked decent in college game footage but didn't run well in the preseason. Appeared to be playing though some type of injury like a hamstring.
Mister Alexander - Decent measurable(s)
Troy Davis - Decent measurable(s)

CB
Patmon - Small (5-10, 185) but nice instincts. Had a terrific INT in the preseason and another in the regular season.
Robert Steeples - Decent measurable(s)

Safety
Heath - Started several game in 2013 as a rookie. Has good size and speed (4.45).