Roster Mismanagement

[Galian Beast]

I'm stunned to see a couple reports out there that are baffling to me. The only conclusion I can come to and maybe this is my own bias, but it seems people are trying to save face on previous decisions and are seriously doubling down.

Chaz Green expected to start at Left Guard over Jonathan Cooper and Kellen Moore to be re-signed?

Absolutely baffled by both of these moves on top of the slew of JAGs we brought in last minute who have no knowledge of the system in Dallas.

Moore has proven he can't play and at best you're going to rob Rush of *some* reps.

Green has proven he can't stay healthy but they're going to plug him in there at guard because they invested a 3rd round pick on him and they still have two years of his contract whereas Cooper is a free agent at the end of the year and I'm sure they don't want to have to pay Martin and him if Cooper progresses. At this rate you can probably sign Cooper again to an extension without paying him if he doesn't start.

This mismanagement is also highlighted with the Cedric Thornton release. They gave this guy 3 million guaranteed for this season and most of us knew he was a JAG from day 1. The same can be said for Nolan Carroll.

 

[lockster]

The good part is having guys on psq. , it, susp. List to replace those guys partly at least.

 

[CowboyStar88]

1. Chaz Green is the better player, and it has nothing to do with draft status. I really don't get the uproar over this? Cooper is on what his 4th team? He's not the same guy who was entering the draft. There's no weird conspiracy here about signing him after this season. You think they'd really risk a full season of starting so they won't have to pay him? Highly doubtful. They obviously have concerns over his play.

2. The KM deal is meh who were they going to bring in as a vet who knows the system? They didn't want to risk losing Rush, and they knew nobody would snag Moore. Really no big deal

3. Can't comment on the guys they brought in over the weekend, but what's been posted is positive stuff and the 2 guys from GB seem to have talent and fill some needs.

4. Thornton was a 3-4 guy going to a 4-3 who we all thought could make the transition. Obviously as other posters have pointed out he doesn't have a fletcher cox next to him here. He just wasn't a fit.

5. As far as Nolan? Yea beats me, I don't understand this one at all.

I think at the end of the day it's not all doom and gloom or complete mismanagement, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. We get to see what some of these guys have this Sunday with game plans and assignments.

 

[Typhus]

I'm stunned to see a couple reports out there that are baffling to me. The only conclusion I can come to and maybe this is my own bias, but it seems people are trying to save face on previous decisions and are seriously doubling down.

Chaz Green expected to start at Left Guard over Jonathan Cooper and Kellen Moore to be re-signed?

Absolutely baffled by both of these moves on top of the slew of JAGs we brought in last minute who have no knowledge of the system in Dallas.

Moore has proven he can't play and at best you're going to rob Rush of *some* reps.

Green has proven he can't stay healthy but they're going to plug him in there at guard because they invested a 3rd round pick on him and they still have two years of his contract whereas Cooper is a free agent at the end of the year and I'm sure they don't want to have to pay Martin and him if Cooper progresses. At this rate you can probably sign Cooper again to an extension without paying him if he doesn't start.

This mismanagement is also highlighted with the Cedric Thornton release. They gave this guy 3 million guaranteed for this season and most of us knew he was a JAG from day 1. The same can be said for Nolan Carroll.

While Moore may have a sissy arm, he is a playbook nerd, and will run the scout team, he has that ability.
The battle between Green and Coop is so tight it probably wont matter,, last man standing there.
Thornton never lived up to his contract, and I'm glad the FO is finally making decisions based on talent over contract.

 

[casmith07]

I'm stunned to see a couple reports out there that are baffling to me. The only conclusion I can come to and maybe this is my own bias, but it seems people are trying to save face on previous decisions and are seriously doubling down.

Chaz Green expected to start at Left Guard over Jonathan Cooper and Kellen Moore to be re-signed?

Absolutely baffled by both of these moves on top of the slew of JAGs we brought in last minute who have no knowledge of the system in Dallas.

Moore has proven he can't play and at best you're going to rob Rush of *some* reps.

Green has proven he can't stay healthy but they're going to plug him in there at guard because they invested a 3rd round pick on him and they still have two years of his contract whereas Cooper is a free agent at the end of the year and I'm sure they don't want to have to pay Martin and him if Cooper progresses. At this rate you can probably sign Cooper again to an extension without paying him if he doesn't start.

This mismanagement is also highlighted with the Cedric Thornton release. They gave this guy 3 million guaranteed for this season and most of us knew he was a JAG from day 1. The same can be said for Nolan Carroll.

Take another look at the talent at all offensive line positions league wide after most starters and you'll see why the offensive line looks the way it does.

Personally, I would've waived Cedric Thornton earlier, restructured whoever I needed to, and signed Ronald Leary to an extension - especially at the contract that he received, which once Romo's dead money comes off the books is not cost prohibitive to signing anybody else.

You also have picked a strange group of people to complain about "roster mismanagement" -- cherry picking a couple of depth signings absent examining the starting lineup is kind of a funny way to make your argument, in my opinion.

 

[Galian Beast]

People would defend this front office for the next 10 years without results.

CowboysStarter88 says that we all thought he could make a transition? No we didn't. First he came from the Eagles and was already playing in a 4-3. Second, he was not good when we signed him and overpaid him from day 1. The Cowboys have this pension for signing very low rated players to mid card money, and fans back them because they must know what they're doing... They don't.

Ron Leary's contract is a bit much, so I won't be too hard on them for not re-signing him. My point at guard is I've seen Green and Cooper play, and Cooper is better than Green and he isn't as injury prone. This is clearly about the draft pick and the contracts.

You think them signing/trading for JAGs is new. My point is, it isn't at all new. They make a couple of the same mistakes over and over again. They overpay players and they tend to keep them entirely longer than what is logical.

Tyrone Crawford - overpaid.
Nolan Carroll - overpaid.
Benson Mayowa - overpaid.

Why did we keep Hayden for so long? Doug Free? Kyle Wilber? How is Jeff Heath slated to start?

They did the same with Carr, Claiborne.

It's moves like these that separate a perennial super bowl team with a team that struggles to win playoff games despite having establish talent.

 

[casmith07]

So offer up solutions instead of just pointing the finger - you're a much better poster than that.

If you understand not signing Leary, then who would you have drafted or signed in lieu of working with Green and Cooper?

Nolan Carroll - same thing. For veteran depth in a rotation that includes two new rookies that were rated as 1st-2nd round picks plus the emergence of Anthony Brown...what else or who else are you doing with that instead?

Same answer for Mayowa.

Tyrone Crawford I'll concede to you. I think he's a JAG and is grossly overpaid.

 

[Galian Beast]

So offer up solutions instead of just pointing the finger - you're a much better poster than that.

If you understand not signing Leary, then who would you have drafted or signed in lieu of working with Green and Cooper?

Nolan Carroll - same thing. For veteran depth in a rotation that includes two new rookies that were rated as 1st-2nd round picks plus the emergence of Anthony Brown...what else or who else are you doing with that instead?

Same answer for Mayowa.

Tyrone Crawford I'll concede to you. I think he's a JAG and is grossly overpaid.

I think Cooper was a great signing and he should be given the opportunity to start. If he can't hack it, then let Green replace him, but even that won't be for very long as he won't be able to stay healthy.

Carroll is going to be a starter, not just veteran depth. And asking what else could be done here is a bit of a misnomer. In reality they've mismanaged the cornerback position from the start. The situation we're dealing with now is very late in the series of mismanagement. I wouldn't have kept Carr and Claiborne for as long as they did and my posting record here supports that.

Mayowa is a result of the front office not taking the defensive line very seriously. They've really botched putting together an even decent line.

 

[casmith07]

I think Cooper was a great signing and he should be given the opportunity to start. If he can't hack it, then let Green replace him, but even that won't be for very long as he won't be able to stay healthy.

Carroll is going to be a starter, not just veteran depth. And asking what else could be done here is a bit of a misnomer. In reality they've mismanaged the cornerback position from the start. The situation we're dealing with now is very late in the series of mismanagement. I wouldn't have kept Carr and Claiborne for as long as they did and my posting record here supports that.

Mayowa is a result of the front office not taking the defensive line very seriously. They've really botched putting together an even decent line.

I think Cooper will start, for what its worth. I think they really want Green to be the starter, and if healthy, he'd probably be an elite offensive guard, but he just can't stay healthy and never really has. They won't just cut him outright, because he's under contract and he can always maybe put it together health wise, but I wouldn't be surprised to see us go with a guard in the draft in 2018.

I agree on Claiborne, but not Carr. Carr was solid, if unspectacular, his entire time. He wasn't Revis with INTs, but he was a steady player his entire time here and with how the rules are for DBs these days, it's a miracle he was able to do as well as he did (or anyone who plays decent, for that matter - fantasy football officiating is basically set up for DBs to lose consistently). I also think the Cowboys made a mistake releasing Terence Newman several years ago, which I'll get into a little bit below.

I think Mayowa is a result of the same thing the Newman release and Claiborne drafting were a result of -- the front office, scouts, etc. giving too much deference to the defensive coach. All of these defensive linemen we keep drafting are Marinelli types -- maybe it's time the scouts and front office realize that Marinelli doesn't really seem to know what he's doing with respect to DL talent and just give him players and tell him to adjust. We've always gotten into trouble on defense when we try to draft and sign scheme fits instead of just drafting ballers and fitting the scheme around them like we're doing on offense now.

Edit: I also am enjoying this chat -- good football talk.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

Green isn't the better player at LG. You want to talk at tackle sure since Cooper plays inside. All preseason Cooper was the better LG. The offense moved the ball better with Cooper at LG

Using the 4 teams is lame and has no bearing on how he plays. Cooper is staying healthy for the first time and it shows. Not sure how Green became such a legend but his penalties and sub-par play is all most seen this preseason

 

[Silver N Blue]

1. Chaz Green is the better player, and it has nothing to do with draft status. I really don't get the uproar over this? Cooper is on what his 4th team? He's not the same guy who was entering the draft. There's no weird conspiracy here about signing him after this season. You think they'd really risk a full season of starting so they won't have to pay him? Highly doubtful. They obviously have concerns over his play.

2. The KM deal is meh who were they going to bring in as a vet who knows the system? They didn't want to risk losing Rush, and they knew nobody would snag Moore. Really no big deal
ts.

The fact the Giants, Igglets, and Deadskins didnt bring this guy in to even pick his brain is pretty telling...let alone all 31 other teams. The only place this kid belongs on Sunday is the booth or on the sideline in a jump suit. Wasted spot where a 25 yr old LB like a Jelani Jenkins could come in.

 

[Wolfpack]

You have to remember that the Dallas FO is structured as a committee set up. Group decisions tend to be overly conservative rafter than decisive.

 

[CowboyStar88]

The fact the Giants, Igglets, and Deadskins didnt bring this guy in to even pick his brain is pretty telling...let alone all 31 other teams. The only place this kid belongs on Sunday is the booth or on the sideline in a jump suit. Wasted spot where a 25 yr old LB like a Jelani Jenkins could come in.

Well I'm not Moore fan, but I think it's naive to believe the team would go into the regular season with a 2nd year guy and an UDFA rookie. It wasn't going to happen, and if they wanted to bring in Jelani they would've.

 

[casmith07]

You have to remember that the Dallas FO is structured as a committee set up. Group decisions tend to be overly conservative rafter than decisive.

This is true. While we might not have major splash with a signing like Cooper, we tend to avoid catastrophe more so than before this way (Greg Hardy notwithstanding - but he was in and out).

 

[Silver N Blue]

Well I'm not Moore fan, but I think it's naive to believe the team would go into the regular season with a 2nd year guy and an UDFA rookie. It wasn't going to happen, and if they wanted to bring in Jelani they would've.

Yeah I get both just an example with Jelani. Moore is wasted space and other teams do it. Rush has more reps at QB than Tribiscut for the Bears. Just another example as several teams go with an experienced back up at QB.

 

[Zimmy Lives]

Two words for you, Beast: Personnel strategy. Contemplate that for a while, then offer your revised thoughts.

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Thornton played well in Philly.

 

[Pokes12]

1. Chaz Green is the better player, and it has nothing to do with draft status. I really don't get the uproar over this? Cooper is on what his 4th team? He's not the same guy who was entering the draft. There's no weird conspiracy here about signing him after this season. You think they'd really risk a full season of starting so they won't have to pay him? Highly doubtful. They obviously have concerns over his play.

2. The KM deal is meh who were they going to bring in as a vet who knows the system? They didn't want to risk losing Rush, and they knew nobody would snag Moore. Really no big deal

3. Can't comment on the guys they brought in over the weekend, but what's been posted is positive stuff and the 2 guys from GB seem to have talent and fill some needs.

4. Thornton was a 3-4 guy going to a 4-3 who we all thought could make the transition. Obviously as other posters have pointed out he doesn't have a fletcher cox next to him here. He just wasn't a fit.

5. As far as Nolan? Yea beats me, I don't understand this one at all.

I think at the end of the day it's not all doom and gloom or complete mismanagement, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. We get to see what some of these guys have this Sunday with game plans and assignments.

Good post. I am tired of arm chair General Managers who know more than the coaches who watch these players every day. I think management gets an A for playing the rules to get Moore back and putting Gathers on the short term IR. I wonder what we have in Rush. Nothing in his resume at Central Michigan would have you believe he could play in the NFL. Maybe he was surrounded by lousy players, who knows but he threw 16 interceptions in a minor college league. Do you really want him to be your NO. 2? Or perhaps you are of the opinion that it does not matter who is NO. 2 that we would lose everyone of those games as we did three years ago in which case bringing Moore back makes no sense. He can play. We know that, we have seen if before in a real game. Plus he brings a psychological boost to Dak and even Linehan. He is an average QB but from what we have seen before after bringing in a clown car full of veteran QBs, he is definitely no worse than they were and at best he is smarter and a better bus driver. Do you really want Sanchez back?

 

[MichaelWinicki]

Some posters simply do not get it...

In a league with 32 participants and a limited talent pool players are apt to get overpaid rather than underpaid. And with young talent chances are taken on continued development. Thus overpaying is going to occur. And if you don't buckle up and secure younger talent you're going to be forever replacing it as that young talent takes their skill-set elsewhere.

 

[Stash]

Good post. I am tired of arm chair General Managers who know more than the coaches who watch these players every day. I think management gets an A for playing the rules to get Moore back and putting Gathers on the short term IR. I wonder what we have in Rush. Nothing in his resume at Central Michigan would have you believe he could play in the NFL. Maybe he was surrounded by lousy players, who knows but he threw 16 interceptions in a minor college league. Do you really want him to be your NO. 2? Or perhaps you are of the opinion that it does not matter who is NO. 2 that we would lose everyone of those games as we did three years ago in which case bringing Moore back makes no sense. He can play. We know that, we have seen if before in a real game. Plus he brings a psychological boost to Dak and even Linehan. He is an average QB but from what we have seen before after bringing in a clown car full of veteran QBs, he is definitely no worse than they were and at best he is smarter and a better bus driver. Do you really want Sanchez back?

Just stop with this nonsense of trying to defend Kellen Moore. The only thing it accomplishes is indicting your own reputation.

Now trying to minimize Cooper Rush only makes that worse.

"He can play." A complete fallacy, refuted by every relevant football statistic out there.

 

[chicago JK]

There has definitely been some odd and poor moves, but every team doesn't always make the right move. Having the benefit of looking back, it is much easier to see what moves did not pan out. As always, the final grade is the win/loss record at the end of the year.

I do find it comical that every year, some posters think we have one of the best and deepest rosters in the league and how we will have 5-6 of our cuts that get picked up. Sometimes that happens. But usually like this year, we wind up picking 2-4 guys off the street who the team thinks are upgrades over guys they have had all summer. It just goes to my opinion, that the Cowboys roster is pretty close in talent to most other teams. Having a QB certainly helps, but most teams are pretty close in overall talent in the NFL.