Scattershooting: Garrett and Stephen Jones

[Rockport]

My conclusion is that Garrett has much less control over roster decisions than he had in the past.

I think Stephen Jones has put Garrett in the corner.

I don't think Garrett wanted to cut Dez regardless of what Dez thinks happened. Stephen Jones never wanted to give Dez the mega-contract and Linehan campaigned to dump Dez.

I think that if Garrett was in complete control that he would have convinced Witten to stay.

It also appears that Garrett was against the cut of Dan Bailey.

If I'm correct, I think it's a great sign that things have changed for the better.

It is not ideal to have the front office and head coach not be on the same page; however, Garrett has not earned the trust that is given to coaches like Belicheck.

Only a few Head Coaches have earned the trust to be given complete control of personnel.

Giving complete control to coaches on the hot seat or 1st year coaches could be a disaster for teams.

The Eagles somehow managed to overcome the Chip Kelly debacle; however, that could have been a disaster for them.

Jon Gruden could be creating a huge mess in Oakland. They are making radical decisions before Gruden and his coaching staff have even seen players in a regular season game.

Coaches on the hot seat make high-risk decisions to win now even if it's a bad long term strategy for the team.

Some coaches like Garrett and Marinelli appear to make decisions because they like or dislike a player on a personal level. I think Garrett would have kept Witten forever and paid him whatever was required to keep him including Witten playing 100% of the snaps when he was 45 years old. Nick Golden Cock Hayden would likely still be here if Marinelli was making the decisions.

Even with great coaches teams need to be careful. Some people think Belicheck would sabbatoge the Patriots if he was ready to retire or move on to another team because he is not on great terms with the owner. Jimmy gave a young player to Dave Wannstedt in Chicago because Jimmy figured he would be gone by the time the player developed and he liked reminding Jerry that he was in charge of personnel decisions regardless of what Jerry told the media.

I'm not a Garrett hater and I believe he has done some very good things for the team; however, I don't want him to be the final decision maker for personnel decisions, especially now that Stephen Jones has put him on the hot seat.

It’s all conjecture at this point in the year. Let’s wait and see what happens this year. I know, fat chance.

 

[xwalker]

This seems to be opposite of what Dez thinks, since he thinks Garrett's guys are responsible for getting him gone.

Dez is a well known idiot.

He also thinks Sean Lee had something to do with it.

There were some interviews on video of Linehan being asked about Dez after he was cut. Linehan smiled and laughed then tried to downplay his excitement. He didn't do the Garrett method of praising a player that are now gone. He just talked about how great Dak will be this year and talked about needing to spread it around.

 

[northerncowboynation]

My conclusion is that Garrett has much less control over roster decisions than he had in the past.

I think Stephen Jones has put Garrett in the corner.

I don't think Garrett wanted to cut Dez regardless of what Dez thinks happened. Stephen Jones never wanted to give Dez the mega-contract and Linehan campaigned to dump Dez.

I think that if Garrett was in complete control that he would have convinced Witten to stay.

It also appears that Garrett was against the cut of Dan Bailey.

If I'm correct, I think it's a great sign that things have changed for the better.

It is not ideal to have the front office and head coach not be on the same page; however, Garrett has not earned the trust that is given to coaches like Belicheck.

Only a few Head Coaches have earned the trust to be given complete control of personnel.

Giving complete control to coaches on the hot seat or 1st year coaches could be a disaster for teams.

The Eagles somehow managed to overcome the Chip Kelly debacle; however, that could have been a disaster for them.

Jon Gruden could be creating a huge mess in Oakland. They are making radical decisions before Gruden and his coaching staff have even seen players in a regular season game.

Coaches on the hot seat make high-risk decisions to win now even if it's a bad long term strategy for the team.

Some coaches like Garrett and Marinelli appear to make decisions because they like or dislike a player on a personal level. I think Garrett would have kept Witten forever and paid him whatever was required to keep him including Witten playing 100% of the snaps when he was 45 years old. Nick Golden Cock Hayden would likely still be here if Marinelli was making the decisions.

Even with great coaches teams need to be careful. Some people think Belicheck would sabbatoge the Patriots if he was ready to retire or move on to another team because he is not on great terms with the owner. Jimmy gave a young player to Dave Wannstedt in Chicago because Jimmy figured he would be gone by the time the player developed and he liked reminding Jerry that he was in charge of personnel decisions regardless of what Jerry told the media.

I'm not a Garrett hater and I believe he has done some very good things for the team; however, I don't want him to be the final decision maker for personnel decisions, especially now that Stephen Jones has put him on the hot seat.

Stephen's title, among others, is Director of Player Personnel with McClay as Assistant Director. That would suggest the two of them pretty much control who is on the team and who isn't. I'm sure JG is consulted. So is JJ. When a head coach is left out of the decision totally, it's time for coach to start looking for a new coat and hat rack. On the flip side, Chip Kelly is a great example of a HC who had complete control and the Eagles tanked while he was there. I think Pete Carrol has that much control in Seattle as Executive Vice President and HC and look at what has happened there in 5 short years. Hard to be a HC PLUS have some control over contracts.

In order of emotions ruling personnel decisions, I rank JJ the number one offender followed by JG with SJ being less emotionally involved with the player when making decisions and I think that's a good thing. I'm not a JG or JJ hater.

I still don't understand why Tapper would be added to the PS one day and removed 2 days later. Then again I don't have to understand, news at 6

 

[CyberB0b]

A lot of positions in companies are received due to nepotism or the old "it's who you know" thing. Let's not pretend that this only happens with the Cowboys and no other football team or company.

It doesn't happen in any successful NFL organization.

 

[cowboy_ron]

No you don't Ron. Literally no one has said Garrett is great.

Don't you dare ruin my agenda...

 

[fredp22]

My conclusion is that Garrett has much less control over roster decisions than he had in the past.

I think Stephen Jones has put Garrett in the corner.

I don't think Garrett wanted to cut Dez regardless of what Dez thinks happened. Stephen Jones never wanted to give Dez the mega-contract and Linehan campaigned to dump Dez.

I think that if Garrett was in complete control that he would have convinced Witten to stay.

It also appears that Garrett was against the cut of Dan Bailey.

If I'm correct, I think it's a great sign that things have changed for the better.

It is not ideal to have the front office and head coach not be on the same page; however, Garrett has not earned the trust that is given to coaches like Belicheck.

Only a few Head Coaches have earned the trust to be given complete control of personnel.

Giving complete control to coaches on the hot seat or 1st year coaches could be a disaster for teams.

The Eagles somehow managed to overcome the Chip Kelly debacle; however, that could have been a disaster for them.

Jon Gruden could be creating a huge mess in Oakland. They are making radical decisions before Gruden and his coaching staff have even seen players in a regular season game.

Coaches on the hot seat make high-risk decisions to win now even if it's a bad long term strategy for the team.

Some coaches like Garrett and Marinelli appear to make decisions because they like or dislike a player on a personal level. I think Garrett would have kept Witten forever and paid him whatever was required to keep him including Witten playing 100% of the snaps when he was 45 years old. Nick Golden Cock Hayden would likely still be here if Marinelli was making the decisions.

Even with great coaches teams need to be careful. Some people think Belicheck would sabbatoge the Patriots if he was ready to retire or move on to another team because he is not on great terms with the owner. Jimmy gave a young player to Dave Wannstedt in Chicago because Jimmy figured he would be gone by the time the player developed and he liked reminding Jerry that he was in charge of personnel decisions regardless of what Jerry told the media.

I'm not a Garrett hater and I believe he has done some very good things for the team; however, I don't want him to be the final decision maker for personnel decisions, especially now that Stephen Jones has put him on the hot seat.

Hard to find anything I dont agree with

 

[xwalker]

Stephen's title, among others, is Director of Player Personnel with McClay as Assistant Director. That would suggest the two of them pretty much control who is on the team and who isn't. I'm sure JG is consulted. So is JJ. When a head coach is left out of the decision totally, it's time for coach to start looking for a new coat and hat rack. On the flip side, Chip Kelly is a great example of a HC who had complete control and the Eagles tanked while he was there. I think Pete Carrol has that much control in Seattle as Executive Vice President and HC and look at what has happened there in 5 short years.

In order of emotions ruling personnel decisions, I rank JJ the number one offender followed by JG with SJ being less emotionally involved with the player when making decisions and I think that's a good thing. I'm not a JG or JJ hater.

I still don't understand why Tapper would be added to the PS one day and removed 2 days later. Then again I don't have to understand, news at 6

We'll see if it makes more sense tomorrow.

 

[zerofill]

No one knows what they are doing in Dallas... Other then DLAW, Lee, and Zeke... Outside of those 3... (actually the cleaning staff looks like they do a good job as well, from what I have seen of the facilities) I think everyone else is just going with the flow.

 

[TexasBoys2288]

Because it’s not nearly as interesting.

Fans watch football games and listen to press conferences and think they know everything about the coaches and FO. Then when something happens that doesn’t fit their preconceived notions then obviously something in the heirachy has changed.

I stopped listening to Garrett's press conferences after I heard "It's a process" for the 10,000th time.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Mods, I’m offended by the OP’s flagrant use of the nickname “Golden Cock.”

Please levy the harshest penalty possible.

 

[waving monkey]

The problem is Stephen Jones wouldn't have his job, if his last name wasn't Jones.

I know I come off argumentative but I dont believe this at all. Jerry Jones for sure thats right.
But SJones grow up in the business and was tutored by many veterans in the NFL business.
His first assignment was learning the salary cap structure. He is respected around the league.

 

[OmerV]

Yep, when everybody is responsible, nobody is responsible. Dallas is truly a team ..........waiting for success to sneak up on them.

So, your belief is one person - Jerry maybe - should make unilateral decisions, not caring or considering what anyone else in the organization thinks. I never took you for such a huge Jerry fan. Who knew?

 

[Haimerej]

I know I come off argumentative but I dont believe this at all. Jerry Jones for sure thats right.
But SJones grow up in the business and was tutored by many veterans in the NFL business.
His first assignment was learning the salary cap structure. He is respected around the league.

I think it's reached the realm of irony when the Jones's are accused of being football idiots. You'd probably be hard pressed to find another front office with as much experience.

 

[CyberB0b]

He is respected around the league.

Sure.

I think it's reached the realm of irony when the Jones's are accused of being football idiots. You'd probably be hard pressed to find another front office with as much experience.

Yes, experience. That's my point. They would have been gone a long time ago if their job title was tied to their performance.

 

[Risen Star]

The problem is Stephen Jones wouldn't have his job, if his last name wasn't Jones.

And there's that whole other problem that this is just another homer fan creating a fantasy in their head about how the team REALLY operates.

When a complete fraud and failure like Stephen Jones is your hero in this story you got even bigger problems.

Could be a copy and paste error here though.

 

[Risen Star]

If you believe Jason Garrett is or has ever been the decision maker in personnel decisions in Dallas you don't have the slightest clue of what you're talking about.

That would be the lunatic. The one who covets and retains the position of final decision maker. Not his son. Not Jason Garrett. Not Will McClay. The lunatic.

It's not anymore complicated than that.

 

[visionary]

I think about the opposite of this. I think Garrett was on team 'cut Dez,' I think Witten's decision was a fait accompli and that there wasn't a realistic chance of convincing him to stay another year, though Garrett probably did try to make that happen and couldn't. I think Garret's comments re: Bailey made it clear that the decision was data-driven, and that he's being professional since Bailey's now a free agent.

I also think that Stephen Jones is an advocate for Jason, and always has been. I don't think they operate by heating up seats. I think they want to keep him as the HC, but that the reality is, if the organization doesn't deliver this season, he's going to be fired. But I think Jason knows that and understands that it's the reality of the situation. They're not looking at him to specifically perform. They're all working together to build a competitive team, and they all understand that if they can't progress in the postseason things are going to change. Jerry and Stephen won't get fired, but they'll understand it's not all on Garrett and his coordinators.

Jason's never going to have personnel control in Dallas, I think that's understood.

 

[visionary]

If you believe Jason Garrett is or has ever been the decision maker in personnel decisions in Dallas you don't have the slightest clue of what you're talking about.

That would be the lunatic. The one who covets and retains the position of final decision maker. Not his son. Not Jason Garrett. Not Will McClay. The lunatic.

It's not anymore complicated than that.

Garrett is building

Of course he has no control over what he's building or how he's building it

 

[TruBluSince1982]

Sounds like you guys are counting your eggs before they are layed. (Isn't that how that goes?) ...anyway

Before we praise the decisions being made, why not wait to see how this offense performs first. If this defense is top notch like many expect, (including myself), it's gonna be awfully excruciating if this offense stinks up the joint all season.

Whatever your feelings on Dez, Witt and Bailey, I would have been much more comfortable with those guys on offense plus Elliott being back plus a top notch defense this season. In other words, if this offense is noticeably worse and costs us down the line, that is going to go down as an absolute HORRIBLE decision.

 

[Haimerej]

Yes, experience. That's my point. They would have been gone a long time ago if their job title was tied to their performance

Maybe.