Sean Peyton v. JG - The Grass Is Always Greener

[Bobhaze]

Playoff success trumps everything. Garrett has 2 playoff wins in 8 full seasons. Sean Payton has won 8 playoff games, including a SB and played in 3 NFC championship games counting today.

Unfortunately we have an owner who judges his HCs by how comfortable they make him feel instead of playoff success. I choose not to drink the cherry picked kool aide stats that JerryJones and Mickey Spagnola love to throw down which is little more than an excuse factory.

 

[CalPolyTechnique]

Now compare it the right way, First 8 seasons to First 8 seasons. Oh wait, that means one made it to and coached a team to a win in the SB, thus spoiling your narrative. Far better to pick and choose.

Loooool, I know right?

Let’s start the analysis by dismissing one of the guy’s greatest accomplishments.....Super Bowl win.

This forum is hilarious.

 

[cowboyblue22]

the garrett fan boys will go to extreme lengths to defend there average at best head coach who has won two playoff games in 8 years hope this is his last year here

 

[Idgit]

2011 was Garrett’s first full season as HC.

Nothing wrong with a comparison that says “hey, let’s look at what both guys have done during a recent 8-season span.” I think it’s pretty interesting to see the comparison that way. We’ve all been fans long enough to remember Payton has a Super Bowl. But that’s not the point you’re making. The poking you’re making they’re actually staying away from because they don’t have an answer.

 

[speedkilz88]

 

[khiladi]

Sean Payton got screwed by the league, being banned for a year and the league destroying his team with a bunch of fines.

Garrett is a joke. All of Garrett’s division titles came with the OC they just fired, who was brought here to basically replace Garrett’s own play-calling.

 

[TrailBlazer]

He's had Drew Brees his entire head coaching career. Brees already had 58 starts under his belt when he signed with New Orleans.

So this "great coach" never had to break in a rookie QB, has had the benefit of a future hall of famer at the position, and still has managed five seasons of .500 or worse and only 1 SB. If your (not the OP) only response is "he's better than JG" that's not much of a response.

What did brees do before he got with sean payton?

 

[xwalker]

Food for thought......

There are many JG detractors here and throughout Cowboys fandom, and I've heard rumblings and musings about what life as a Cowboy fan would have been like with Sean Peyton at the helm, so I decided to do a little comparison.

Let's talk about won/loss records first. I'll use SP's record since 2012, Garrett's first full year as HC:

JG: Regular Season: 77-59 - 3 Playoff Appearances, 2-3 - No NFCCG - 3 Divisional Titles

SP: (Last 8 years) Regular Season - 76-60 - 4 Playoff Appearances - 4-3 - 1 NFCCG (today) - 1 Divisional Title

The nod goes to Garrett by just one game in the regular season. The Saints have been to the playoffs once more than the Cowboys, and they've won their first round game each time. We'll see today if the trend of losing their second playoff game continues when they face the Rams later today.

Garrett has had 1 losing season during his tenure, while Peyton has had 4 during the same time period. We had cries of mediocrity after three 8-8 seasons, with 3 'win and in' losses 2011-2013. I wonder what we would have heard about Peyton after he went 7-9 for 4 out of 5 seasons.

Numbers don't lie. SP has one extra playoff appearance and two additional wins. Is SP a 'better' coach? I'm betting the Garrett haters will be unequivocal with their answer, though unless one places ridiculously heavy weight on playoff appearances, they've had almost identical records.

It's worth noting that Peyton has had a HoF QB during his entire tenure, while Garrett has had Romo (possibly costing us 3 playoff appearances with his 'win and in' losses. One can choose to say that we wouldn't have had those opportunities if Romo hadn't 'carried the team' during those 8-8 seasons, but then what does that say about Brees during his 7-9 seasons?

Pete Carmichael has been the Saints OC since 2009. Using Cowboys fans logic, he should have been placed on the trash heap long ago. On the defensive side of the ball, there are some familiar names for the Saints: Rob Ryan, Steve Spagnuolo, and Dennis Allen, two of which have been head coaches in the NFL. We have Marinelli, also a former head coach. Take from that what you will.

Is Sean Peyton a better coach? Over the same time period, his regular season record says no (by a hair) and his playoff record says yes (by the same hair).

Sean Payton won a Super Bowl.

Romo might have been a HoF QB with a great Head Coach and better OC.

 

[LovinItAll]

Now compare it the right way, First 8 seasons to First 8 seasons. Oh wait, that means one made it to and coached a team to a win in the SB, thus spoiling your narrative. Far better to pick and choose.

It doesn't 'spoil my narrative'. It further supports my narrative. I think Peyton is a great coach, but I think it's incredibly difficult to get to the conference championship game, much less the SB. After all, if he did it in year 4, why hasn't he repeated (often?)? He only won 3 division titles over the next ten years and only got a bye once (this year).

The point is simple: Great coach + HoF QB does NOT equal playoff success. By design. parity rules the NFL. Except for the most dysfunctional franchises (and Dallas is not one of them), the margin between making the playoffs and then advancing is very, very small.

 

[LovinItAll]

Loooool, I know right?

Let’s start the analysis by dismissing one of the guy’s greatest accomplishments.....Super Bowl win.

This forum is hilarious.

Lol, I know right?! Because comparing recent success to something that happened over a decade ago is just absurd. Like, wow....what a dumb forum.

 

[cowboy_ron]

HOF, Legendary, GOAT .....Jason Garrett > Vince Lombardi

 

[LovinItAll]

Sean Payton won a Super Bowl.

Romo might have been a HoF QB with a great Head Coach and better OC.

Or Romo might have won a Super Bowl had he executed during any one of his 'win and in' games instead of laying and egg. Pretty sure the coach didn't say, 'Okay, on this play, I want you to throw an interception.'

 

[DFWJC]

Why exactly is Brees this "future hall of famer" you keep mentioning? He sure wasn't in San Diego. He was an injured, 62% completion quarterback who anyone could have signed. And Saban, Garrett, and Linehan passed on signing him in Miami. Does Payton get no credit for that?

Sure, Payton does get a ton of credit, but don't all highly successful QBs usually have a great coach behind them?

Drew Brees and Tom Brady are about as sure of a lock as a Hall of Famers as you'll find in the NFL today.

Are you saying Drew Brees won't be in the HOF?

 

[DFWJC]

Or Romo might have won a Super Bowl had he executed during any one of his 'win and in' games instead of laying and egg. Pretty sure the coach didn't say, 'Okay, on this play, I want you to throw an interception.'

Short bus alert.
REAL short bus stuff

 

[Stash]

Sure, Payton does get a ton of credit, but don't all highly successful QBs usually have a great coach behind them?

Drew Brees and Tom Brady are about as sure of a lock as a Hall of Famers as you'll find in the NFL today.

Are you saying Drew Brees won't be in the HOF?

Of course not, I'm saying he'll be in the HOF in large part to his career while working with Sean Payton, who might end up a Hall of Fame coach himself.

You can't discount the impact a coach can have on a player's career either, good and bad.

 

[TheCoolFan]

Yeah, Payton had three straight 7-9 seasons...but the Saints needed those higher draft picks to retool the roster around Brees to field the current core they have now. Garrett went through three straight 8-8 seasons, had the OL rebuilt to fit his scheme and the core retooled from the Wade/Parcells regime, and he still can't get far in the playoffs.

Garrett had the 2011 and 2016 Draft where they were picking early in every round and could get premium talent. The Saints haven't had a Top-10 pick since 2008.

 

[Stash]

Lol, I know right?! Because comparing recent success to something that happened over a decade ago is just absurd. Like, wow....what a dumb forum.

It's certainly "dumber" as the result of threads like this one.

 

[birdwells1]

That was a lot of writing trying to explain away a SB winning coach who still has more playoff success the last 8 yrs

And is playing in the NFCCG today, something that JGs never done.

 

[birdwells1]

Playoff success trumps everything. Garrett has 2 playoff wins in 8 full seasons. Sean Payton has won 8 playoff games, including a SB and played in 3 NFC championship games counting today.

Unfortunately we have an owner who judges his HCs by how comfortable they make him feel instead of playoff success. I choose not to drink the cherry picked kool aide stats that JerryJones and Mickey Spagnola love to throw down which is little more than an excuse factory.

Hey if you count intersquad scrimmages and preseason games.................JG>SP.

 

[TheDude]

Loooool, I know right?

Let’s start the analysis by dismissing one of the guy’s greatest accomplishments.....Super Bowl win.

This forum is hilarious.

It is remarkable isnt it? The next comparison will be Garrett's last 3 years compared to Landry's last 3 years....that will put a nail on anymore criticism