SI Top 10 College offensive draft prospects

[StanleySpadowski]

And don't think for a minute that the good QB play is the result of the O-line -- that's just silly.

Please tell me you were being sarcastic or that's one of the dumbest statements I've ever heard.


Given that Derek Anderson's play last year was dreadful, I wonder what's more likely -

Anderson found a secret potion that turned a crappy QB into an above average one.

OR.... Playing without quality skill players and a pourous offensive line makes any QB look terrible.

 

[theogt]

Please tell me you were being sarcastic or that's one of the dumbest statements I've ever heard.


Given that Derek Anderson's play last year was dreadful, I wonder what's more likely -

Anderson found a secret potion that turned a crappy QB into an above average one.

OR.... Playing without quality skill players and a pourous offensive line makes any QB look terrible.

Wait, so you're saying that he did find a secret potion that turned a crappy QB into an above average QB, and that that potion is a rookie lineman?

LOL, yeah that's plausible.

I'm not saying that good OL play doesn't help a RB or a QB. Obviously it does. But an elite OL won't help you one bit if you don't have a good QB or RB.

 

[YosemiteSam]

True...he MAY be another Emmitt Smith but some college analysts don't seem to think so. Look at most of the backs drafted early the past few years, while not too many of them are world-beaters most were drafted because of their size/speed combination, and Hart doesn't provide that. He runs hard but @ 200lbs he's not built to pound it between the tackles 25x a game like a true lead back should. That's why I don't think he'll be a first rounder but he might fit into a system like Dallas' where the carries are split (even though his running style doesn't complement MB3's).

Well, I didn't say he would drafted in the first round. He is only 200lbs, but like I said. A lot of backs come in to the league at 200lbs. The ones that stay usually haven't filled out their frame. The NFL trainers will get them where they need to be. I think Hart and Barber would be a great combo. While both lack that big burst of speed like Jones has, they both run very hard and are hard to bring down. With the Cowboys offensive line and their running style. They can wear down any defensive front seven. I don't think Barber or Hart will be a full type starter in this league, but could be deadly as a RB combination.

I liken Mike Hart (5'9 202lbs 4.46 40) to Maurice Jones-Drew (5'7 207lbs 4.39 40) coming out of college. A little taller, 5lbs less and about a 20th of a second slower in the 40.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Wait, so you're saying that he did find a secret potion that turned a crappy QB into an above average QB, and that that potion is a rookie lineman?

LOL, yeah that's plausible.

I'm not saying that good OL play doesn't help a RB or a QB. Obviously it does. But an elite OL won't help you one bit if you don't have a good QB or RB.

and I'm saying that a piss poor offensive line will cause sacks and tackles for a loss no matter who the hell your running back or quarterback is! :bang2:

EDIT: IE, you can have Peyton Manning and Emmitt Smith, but if you have the Browns offensive line last year, you aren't going to win many games.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Like my old high school football coach told me when discussing the offensive line. If you are standing behind a leaking dam, you had better build a boat, not a house.

 

[McCordsville Cowboy]

jake long would be a nice replacement for flo

Said that since last year.. Wont happen though if Cleveland keeps winning.

 

[theogt]

and I'm saying that a piss poor offensive line will cause sacks and tackles for a loss no matter who the hell your running back or quarterback is! :bang2:

EDIT: IE, you can have Peyton Manning and Emmitt Smith, but if you have the Browns offensive line last year, you aren't going to win many games.

I disagree. I think an elite QB or RB helps you much more than an elite OL. Look at how good our OL looked after Tony took over. Suddenly, it wasn't the same problem it was when Bledsoe was under center. And Brady has always played with patchwork O-lines. Yet he looks good becuase he's quick at making his reads an throwing the ball.

And look at Julius compared to Marion. They're running behind the same line, but the difference between their play is night and day. I guarantee if Marion was on another team, you'd have half the board saying "if Julius was running behind Marion's line he'd be just as good."

 

[StanleySpadowski]

Wait, so you're saying that he did find a secret potion that turned a crappy QB into an above average QB, and that that potion is a rookie lineman?

LOL, yeah that's plausible.

I'm not saying that good OL play doesn't help a RB or a QB. Obviously it does. But an elite OL won't help you one bit if you don't have a good QB or RB.

I don't think you realize the difference between a "good" QB or RB and a "crappy" one is so fine.

I'd bet there's a hundred guys on the street that could get 1000 yards rushing behind a quality OL.

I can't think of an NFL QB I've ever seen that didn't look pretty good on 7 on 7s.


And Anderson didn't just get help from a rookie OLineman. They were cursed with the injury bug last year on offense. They were starting their 4th stringer at some OL positions.

 

[theogt]

I don't think you realize the difference between a "good" QB or RB and a "crappy" one is so fine.

I'd bet there's a hundred guys on the street that could get 1000 yards rushing behind a quality OL.

I can't think of an NFL QB I've ever seen that didn't look pretty good on 7 on 7s.


And Anderson didn't just get help from a rookie OLineman. They were cursed with the injury bug last year on offense. They were starting their 4th stringer at some OL positions.

Yeah, and everyone said the problem with Bledsoe in 2005 was Petitti and Tucker. Yet we replaced them with Flozell and Colombo in 2006 and he still sucked. Tony Romo? DOesn't suck. Stick in Brad Johnson, and he probably sucks.

Again, my point isn't that a good OL doesn't help. My point is that an elite QB or RB is much more important than an elite OL.

 

[YosemiteSam]

I disagree. I think an elite QB or RB helps you much more than an elite OL.

An elite QB will be dog meat behind a garbage offensive line period.

Consider this. The offensive line is the gas in a car. While the QB maybe a Porsche Carrera GT engine in that car, it's going no where without its tank filled with gas. If a man is on his back, he isn't throwing/running for TDs.

 

[Chuck 54]

I would love Jackson at WR. We don't need more guys who are steady or even effective...we need a blaser, a burner, a guy who can take the hitch, screen, or reverse and take it to the house, a guy who can beat any CB deep on the play-action.

And it wouldn't be bad to have the next great return man in the NFL while he's making his rookie adjustment.

T.O. will be back...Glenn might be back...Crayton will be back...and we may add an average receiver in FA....Jackson's speed and playmaking is exactly what the ball coach ordered, imo. I don't care if there's a more rounded WR in the draft or not.

 

[theogt]

An elite QB will be dog meat behind a garbage offensive line period.

I strongly disagree with that.

And I think that a garbage QB will be garbage behind an elite OL.

 

[YosemiteSam]

And a garbage QB will be garbage behind an elite OL.

Yes, but he will probably be more effective than Peyton Manning behind a college football offensive line.

 

[theogt]

Yes, but he will probably be more effective than Peyton Manning behind a college football offensive line.

I couldn't disagree more with this. Peyton Manning will make his surrounding cast look much better.

 

[adamknite]

I disagree. I think an elite QB or RB helps you much more than an elite OL. Look at how good our OL looked after Tony took over. Suddenly, it wasn't the same problem it was when Bledsoe was under center. And Brady has always played with patchwork O-lines. Yet he looks good becuase he's quick at making his reads an throwing the ball.

And look at Julius compared to Marion. They're running behind the same line, but the difference between their play is night and day. I guarantee if Marion was on another team, you'd have half the board saying "if Julius was running behind Marion's line he'd be just as good."

I'm taking Theogt's side on this one. Having a great oline can make an average QB look good, and having a great QB can help make an Oline look good. But in the big picture of things I had the choice between a franchise QB and a franchise left tackle..... give me the franchise QB.

 

[YosemiteSam]

theogt,

Name one great QB who had a garbage offensive line and was still very effective as a QB.

I can name QBs that were at best only game managers (not great QBs) that were effective with very good offensive linemen.

• Trent Dilfer with the Ravens
• Brad Johnson with the Bucs
• Mark Rypien with the Commanders
• Chris Simms with the Giants

None of these guys are great QBs, but they were effective when they had an offensive line. Put them on teams without lines, and they suck horribly! I'm sure I could name more.

 

[YosemiteSam]

I'm taking Theogt's side on this one. Having a great oline can make an average QB look good, and having a great QB can help make an Oline look good. But in the big picture of things I had the choice between a franchise QB and a franchise left tackle..... give me the franchise QB.

I'm not just talking about a tackle, I'm talking about an offensive line.

I will give you Peyton Manning and my choice for your offensive line and you had better hurry off and get an insurance policy.

 

[theogt]

theogt,

Name one great QB who had a garbage offensive line and was still very effective as a QB.

I can name QBs that were at best only game managers (not great QBs) that were effective with very good offensive linemen.

• Trent Dilfer with the Ravens
• Brad Johnson with the Bucs
• Mark Rypien with the Commanders
• Chris Simms with the Giants

None of these guys are great QBs, but they were effective when they had an offensive line. Put them on teams without lines, and they suck horribly! I'm sure I could name more.

This is ridiculous. A good QB makes his O-line look better, so obviously any time you have a good QB his O-line is going to look good.

Did our O-line go from garbage to good when Tony replaced Bledsoe? No they were the same line, yet all of sudden people weren't *****ing about them every week.

What does Tony tell his O-line when they give up a sack? "I'll get the next one out quicker."

 

[adamknite]

I'm not just talking about a tackle, I'm talking about an offensive line.

I will give you Peyton Manning and my choice for your offensive line and you had better hurry off and get an insurance policy.

It's not fair comparing five positions to one.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Gosselin said on 103.3 yesterday that one NFL pro personnel director told him that McFadden was the best prospect he'd ever scouted.

Yes, ever.