Some perspective on Free

[waldoputty]

Is Emmit Cleary his replacement? they like him I heard but is he ready. Green Mr.IR ?
You want to go after a FA I know. Who?

Free was the 3rd worse OT in sacks and pressures.
Dump Free and use his salary on a FA.
$5M cap impact could EASILY get you any top RT as far as year 1 cap impact is concerned.

 

[Idgit]

While true, I don't think it's unreasonable to want to get better at his spot, just because the line is still effective with him in there.

I'm all for getting better wherever we can. But I don't want it to come at the expense of upgrading the talent on defense. If an affordable vet shakes loose and proves to be an upgrade, great. If they want to move Collins over and keep Leary (despite showing basically no inclination to really do that), fine. Let's just not spend top picks or a lot of VFA money trying to do it.

 

[RandyOh]

Nice thought.

But the time is NOW for this team. Don't waste a year waiting on this position.
Not next year - NOW.

Get an improvement here NOW.

great advice. We should absolutely overlook that this years draft is very deep at our 4 biggest needs of DE, CB, S, and WR so we can reach for an OT early in one of the worst OT draft classes in a good while. Our time is now. Wooo

 

[waldoputty]

I'm all for getting better wherever we can. But I don't want it to come at the expense of upgrading the talent on defense. If an affordable vet shakes loose and proves to be an upgrade, great. If they want to move Collins over and keep Leary (despite showing basically no inclination to really do that), fine. Let's just not spend top picks or a lot of VFA money trying to do it.

Signing a respectable RT should not affect the cap in a significant way that would affect the D.
We have the flexibility to sign 3 top D FAs if we want at $15M AAV.
Getting a top RT FA would cost less than 1 top D FA.

The will to get better on D is dependent on the FO's attitude.
If they keep doing the beancounter thing, they will just waste the remaining prime of Dez and most of Zeke's prime.
Come 2019, they are going to have so much cap space they may have to start frontloading contracts if they keep going cheap.

 

[waldoputty]

great advice. We should absolutely overlook that this years draft is very deep at our 4 biggest needs of DE, CB, S, and WR so we can reach for an OT early in one of the worst OT draft classes in a good while. Our time is now. Wooo

free agent...
who in the world would put a rookie to protect Dak?

 

[waving monkey]

Free was the 3rd worse OT in sacks and pressures.
Dump Free and use his salary on a FA.
$5M cap impact could EASILY get you any top RT as far as year 1 cap impact is concerned.

who

 

[waving monkey]

great advice. We should absolutely overlook that this years draft is very deep at our 4 biggest needs of DE, CB, S, and WR so we can reach for an OT early in one of the worst OT draft classes in a good while. Our time is now. Wooo

Yap RandyOh i think your point should be taken. Here's the truth this will be answered shortly,lets see.I think Free will be on our roster 17

 

[gimmesix]

CGreen and Cleary can do the same mediocre job Free has done, with a lot of help from Martin and TEs btw, for 1/10th the price........ I think CGreen can do even better ...... that 5m can directly help the defense like you suggest

I think you're assuming a lot. Cleary is a journeyman so far in his career who has not proven to be a starting-caliber lineman. I believe in the Parcells mandate that you are what you are, until you show otherwise.

The same holds true with Green. While we have a bigger sample size to look at, where he looked like he might can do the job, right now he's a player who can't stay healthy.

I'd feel comfortable letting them compete with Collins for the job, if we re-sign Leary and don't weaken our interior in the process.

It amazes me that some are willing to toss Free aside for players who've proven absolutely nothing. I'll toss him aside for a clear upgrade, but not for question marks. (I know that Collins also is a question mark at tackle, but as I've said, I believe that Leary is a better guard than Free is a tackle, so I'm willing to make that trade out.)

 

[RandyOh]

free agent...
who in the world would put a rookie to protect Dak?

Free agent RT or use free agency to fill the positions i named? Doesn't matter. The OT free agent class is just as a horrid as the OT draft class. We also ain't spending what its gonna take to sign the few worth while defensive free agents no matter how much money can be freed up.

The same coaches and GM who put 3 rookies to protect Romo. walked away with arguably the best LT, C, and RG(possibly the best LG too) in the NFL. i would say getting rookies to protect our QB has worked out just fine.

 

[waldoputty]

who

You can sign ANY of the OTs on FA with a $5M cap impact multi-year contract.
The only possible exception being Whitworth.
The most reasonable candidate is 27 year old Wagner.
Here is a cap impact estimate for a 5-year $8M AAV (Wagner valued at $7.6M AAV) could look like with a $15M signing bonus:
-----------------2017-------2018------2019------2020-----2021
base-----------$1M---------$1M-------$1M------$6.25M--$6.25M
signing--------$3M---------$3M-------$3M------$3M-------$3M
restruct yr 2-----------------$1.3M----$1.3M---$1.3M----$1.3M
restruct yr 3------------------------------$1.75M-$1.75M--$1.75M
total:------------$4M--------$5.3M------$7.05M-$12.3M-$12.3M

2017 $4M cap impact is $1M less than Free's salary.
2018/2019 cap impact is less than Free's 2017 cap impact of $7.5M.
Before you complain about 2020/2021 cap impact, you could easily release him after year 3.
Then you have dead money of $6M per year for last 2 years - remember the $10M cap rise per year and the $130M open cap currently for 2020. Also year 1 and 2 of Dak's extension would be very cheap for a franchise QB.

Free rated as #3 worst in sacks and pressures.
That include LTs who typically get the top DE.

 

[Longboysfan]

great advice. We should absolutely overlook that this years draft is very deep at our 4 biggest needs of DE, CB, S, and WR so we can reach for an OT early in one of the worst OT draft classes in a good while. Our time is now. Wooo

I never said that.
What I'm saying is this team needs to address that position now.
Upgrade - which the Cowboys will do - if they find someone on the current roster who steps up or a street FA.

 

[RandyOh]

Yap RandyOh i think your point should be taken. Here's the truth this will be answered shortly,lets see.I think Free will be on our roster 17

I understand what others are saying in this thread but they are overlooking multiple obvious holes on our team to and trying to make an upgrade at RT a bigger priority. The Pats just won again with a Oline that they patch together as the season goes on. The Broncos won a Superbowl with a average Oline. The Seahawks won with an average to above average line. We have the best Oline in the game and one of the worst D lines in the game yet the focus goes back on the Oline?

 

[waldoputty]

Free agent RT or use free agency to fill the positions i named? Doesn't matter. The OT free agent class is just as a horrid as the OT draft class. We also ain't spending what its gonna take to sign the few worth while defensive free agents no matter how much money can be freed up.

The same coaches and GM who put 3 rookies to protect Romo. walked away with arguably the best LT, C, and RG(possibly the best LG too) in the NFL. i would say getting rookies to protect our QB has worked out just fine.

What?
Free is the 3rd WORSE OT in sacks and pressures?
Hard to do worse with Wagner.

The coaches had no choice with Romo and the OL he was dealt with.
Look what happened - Romo broke.
We now have a young franchise QB - you want to take chances?

 

[Nightman]

I think you're assuming a lot. Cleary is a journeyman so far in his career who has not proven to be a starting-caliber lineman. I believe in the Parcells mandate that you are what you are, until you show otherwise.

The same holds true with Green. While we have a bigger sample size to look at, where he looked like he might can do the job, right now he's a player who can't stay healthy.

I'd feel comfortable letting them compete with Collins for the job, if we re-sign Leary and don't weaken our interior in the process.

It amazes me that some are willing to toss Free aside for players who've proven absolutely nothing. I'll toss him aside for a clear upgrade, but not for question marks. (I know that Collins also is a question mark at tackle, but as I've said, I believe that Leary is a better guard than Free is a tackle, so I'm willing to make that trade out.)

Because Free is terrible....he sticks out like a sore thumb every Sunday.......he has been the Freeloader since he signed the 32m deal and all his fans keep looking the other way

IF CGreen and Cleary are terrible they will at least save us 5m......Free is as bad as it gets...he always gets help, always gets beat and has terrible penalties misses...... I have seen both guys play and they were as good as if not better than Free

 

[waldoputty]

I understand what others are saying in this thread but they are overlooking multiple obvious holes on our team to and trying to make an upgrade at RT a bigger priority. The Pats just won again with a Oline that they patch together as the season goes on. The Broncos won a Superbowl with a average Oline. The Seahawks won with an average to above average line. We have the best Oline in the game and one of the worst D lines in the game yet the focus goes back on the Oline?

All the war daddies are taken.
You fix what you can fix.
If DL is going to be the about the same, make the O more unstoppable.

 

[RandyOh]

I never said that.
What I'm saying is this team needs to address that position now.
Upgrade - which the Cowboys will do - if they find someone on the current roster who steps up or a street FA.

If one of the few good OTs falls into our lap or Emmit Cleary looks like hes a better option then yes draft the player or give the man the position he earned during training camp and preseason. Some want RT to be one of the main focuses of offseason tho. I just dont understand that.

 

[Idgit]

Signing a respectable RT should not affect the cap in a significant way that would affect the D.
We have the flexibility to sign 3 top D FAs if we want at $15M AAV.
Getting a top RT FA would cost less than 1 top D FA.

The will to get better on D is dependent on the FO's attitude.
If they keep doing the beancounter thing, they will just waste the remaining prime of Dez and most of Zeke's prime.
Come 2019, they are going to have so much cap space they may have to start frontloading contracts if they keep going cheap.

I expect they don't think there's a FA RT out there who's an upgrade and a salary-cap neutral move. You may disagree, but I don't think that's how the team sees it. I look at Free as a position we're capable of upgrading, and we should look to do it basically the same way we flirted with bringing in a vet CB last season. Ie, not a priority, but great if they think they can make it happen or if looking at a few vets helps them solidify things. If nothing else, we can always upgrade Emmett Cleary's roster spot if the right guy is there.

I'm in favor of doing the beancounter thing. It's worked to build the competitive roster we've got now. Zeke's a rookie playing on a contender, so there's no wasting of his prime going on. Tough to make good cap moves overspending at premium positions in free agency. Much better to become adept at finding, developing, and signing your own guys who you know can play. I won't mind a strategic splurge or two once Romo's cap hit is absorbed and before we have to do a big deal for Prescott, but that's pretty much a one-off kind of deal there.

 

[waldoputty]

If one of the few good OTs falls into our lap or Emmit Cleary looks like hes a better option then yes draft the player or give the man the position he earned during training camp and preseason. Some want RT to be one of the main focuses of offseason tho. I just dont understand that.

3rd worst OT in terms of sacks and pressures.
37.5% of the dak turnovers in 2016.
throw out the trash

 

[RandyOh]

All the war daddies are taken.
You fix what you can fix.
If DL is going to be the about the same, make the O more unstoppable.

Their are 3 OT's with 1st round grades. only 2 if u believe what some of the NFL scouts are saying about Cam Robinson not being able to play OT in the NFL. OT is treated like DE. They will always be reached on due to need. Their are multiple teams ahead of us that need a OT. We actually have a much better chance of getting a DE then we do a OT this year.

 

[Teague31]

Being the weak link (by far) on a good offense isn't a good argument that he is "good enough". Dude is flat out awful. If you want to say we can't afford an upgrade, fine. If you want to say no one else currently on the roster would be an upgrade fine. But trying to argue he isn't flat out awful is sheer lunacy