Sources: Cleveland has agreement to acquire Kevin Love, including contract commitment

[jterrell]

I think they're definitely a top-tier East team (obviously) but their offense is going to have to average 120 a game, because they're going to give up a ton. They're also turning into the Heat North (which isn't a bad thing) but three huge contracts is going to fill the rest of the roster with minimum guys, and depth killed the Heat in the Finals. Still a great move for them, and one they had to make, but they still have a lot of holes.

No offense but you are not going to make anyone believe you are the rational Spurs fan with silliness like this.

The Cavs have a ton more talent than Heat did in year 1 and ton more trade assets to use to get better.
Kyrie and Love are babies. Thompson and Waiters are not even to baby status yet.

That is a team with a lot of youth and a lot of assets.

Miami was tapped out after the big 3 and Wade was hurt every other season BEFORE the big 3 era.

The Spurs are not even a lock as a top 4 team in the West to me. Too much depth in the West and too many injury concerns for the Spurs who start off one rotation player lighter than last year.

Vegas has the Cavs as the favorites to win the title.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

The Spurs have a 7 footer I don't know about?

The Cavs have a 7 footer in back up center Haywood. Haywood won a title as a back up center for Dallas.

Cavs:
PG Irving
SG Waiters
SF LeBron
PF Love
C Varajao

Rotational guys:
Thompson 4/5
Haywood 5
Miller SF

and probably Marion 3/4 defender.

What they could use is a solid vet back up PG. But again they have tons of ammo to make moves. Dallas would give them Felton for a high five.

Why does everything have to be about the Spurs? This is getting ridiculous.

I was commenting on the state of the Cavs' lineup after acquiring Love. I didn't know they had Haywood, so that might sort of change my stance. But with Love, Thompson and Varajeo, they have absolutely no shot blockers. Varajeo is like 6'11" but is more of a hustle player than a traditional big man.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

No offense but you are not going to make anyone believe you are the rational Spurs fan with silliness like this.

The Cavs have a ton more talent than Heat did in year 1 and ton more trade assets to use to get better.
Kyrie and Love are babies. Thompson and Waiters are not even to baby status yet.

That is a team with a lot of youth and a lot of assets.

Miami was tapped out after the big 3 and Wade was hurt every other season BEFORE the big 3 era.

The Spurs are not even a lock as a top 4 team in the West to me. Too much depth in the West and too many injury concerns for the Spurs who start off one rotation player lighter than last year.

Vegas has the Cavs as the favorites to win the title.

I think the Cavs are gonna kill the regular season, but might flake out in the playoffs. The defense has the potential to be horrendous. At the moment, they remind me of the run-and-gun Suns when they had Steve Nash. I could see a strong defensive team in the East stopping them, like Chicago. I don't see any team outscoring them though. You'll need to beat them with defense and/or having a good strategy, like the Spurs did in the finals. They'll be good and LeBron will probably win another MVP. People are crazy calling them a 4 or 5 seed in the East. But I don't think they'll win it all this year.

 

[jterrell]

Why does everything have to be about the Spurs? This is getting ridiculous.

I was commenting on the state of the Cavs' lineup after acquiring Love. I didn't know they had Haywood, so that might sort of change my stance. But with Love, Thompson and Varajeo, they have absolutely no shot blockers. Varajeo is like 6'11" but is more of a hustle player than a traditional big man.

Not sure what point you are making but again what shot blocking has the last 3 Title winners had?
The last good shot blocking for a title winner was probably Tyson Chandler in 2011 with the Mavs.

The thought CLE will be bad on defense is pretty poor basketball IQ.
LeBron changes a lot about a defense and might be the games best overall defender between strength, size and quickness.
Varajao is a hustle and effort guy and Thompson is an elite athlete with really no offensive game that can certainly defend when he enters the game.
The Cavs are very likely to add Marion who is an elite defender with again a terrible offensive game.

IF CLE has an issue it will be offensive efficiency not defense.

 

[jterrell]

Logically breaking down the Cavs and the 2014/15 season.

First let me state I think my track record is pretty strong in this forum for accurate BBall takes.
I am by no means infallible but I am well above the bell curve.
I had the Rox/Lakers as very overrated last year for instance and Dallas as underrated.
My projected champ was the Thunder who had a partial season from Westbrook then playoff loss of Ibaka
So an excusable miss there I think and probably a better overall choice than the 2 time defending Heat which was by far the popular pick.

I expect CLE starts off the season very well the first 20-25 games.
The fan excitement will make games feel like playoff contests to those Cavs who've not been aboard the LeBron train previously.
CLE will have an Xs and Os advantage as the Coach goes in with his system and teams take time to figure it out.
After that early hot stretch I think other teams will find which sets and defensive rotations work best.
I expect you see the Cavs hit a bit of a lull around the trade deadline time and make a move or two to correct issues they find.
The team will take another 20-25 games to tinker with things but should maintain high playoff seeding if not very top of the East.
I expect you see a lot of guys try to cement roles in a 9 man rotation. They may try 12-14 guys throughout the regular season but will settle in that last month plus on a playoff rotation.
I expect once in the playoffs the East provides a little tougher challenge than last year but still not a great threat barring it all going right for Chicago.
Whomever wins the West will be a very real test but that team may well be quite tired.
The Clippers won't have the Sterling thing pop up wrecking a historic season.
The Thunder are unlikely to lose their only decent big.
It should be a war every night in the West both regular season and playoffs.
Because of this odds on favorite to win it all has to be CLE.

Where CLE struggles: I think the biggest issue for them will be offensive efficiency in half court. Irving, Waiters, LeBron, Love all score plenty. But scoring on minimal shots and scoring in the last 4 minutes of games is a different thing. I expect some close losses as Kyrie grows up and Love finds his sweet spot. How the guards balance not getting LeBron mad enough to behead them via trade with being aggressive is anyone's guess. The Miami guards other than Wade were mostly scared to death to shoot the ball. The Cavs have to learn to pass up good shots for great shots while also always remaining an offensive threat. --this is Pop basketball.

Where CLE excels: Miami was 5th last year in points allowed at 95.5. This CLE team will be as good on defense. They are younger, more athletic and in general better defenders. It will be very hard to out-rebound CLE. With James, Love and Varajao or Thompson closing out games teams will have a hard time getting more than one shot per possession. They can go small with Marion, James and Love versus teams that go small and basically cause nightmares for those teams. James and Marion can both guard 3 or 4 different positions per team and do so in shut down fashion for at least stretches.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

I disagree. They still won't be able to beat 4 or 5 teams from the West. They have no bench either. Bring em on.

I don't know about that.
they will be one of the top teams in the league... how good... we will see.

I forgot , You LOOOOVEEEE the spurs, acknowledge no one.. bring on all comers!
fernando vargas' for everyone.... (until he loss)

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Cleveland still has no 7 footers on the roster. Varajeo is the center by default but has been injured for 4 years and blocks less shots than a guard. Thompson is a very nice backup. But I don't know if you could have Thompson and Love on the court at the same time. Even Bosh is more suited to play center than them.

I agree with this.. and B. Haywood do not, I repeat, do not count...
but as the trade is structured right now, they still have two 1st round picks in the upcoming draft. (we'll see if this is how it goes)
I'm also not sure if Tristen sticks around, since his contract is up soon, and they're not paying both him & love (although he's much cheaper).
Tristen & a 1st should get them more size and defense later in the season if needed (which it will be)

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Logically breaking down the Cavs and the 2014/15 season.

First let me state I think my track record is pretty strong in this forum for accurate BBall takes.
I am by no means infallible but I am well above the bell curve.
I had the Rox/Lakers as very overrated last year for instance and Dallas as underrated.
My projected champ was the Thunder who had a partial season from Westbrook then playoff loss of Ibaka
So an excusable miss there I think and probably a better overall choice than the 2 time defending Heat which was by far the popular pick.

I expect CLE starts off the season very well the first 20-25 games.
The fan excitement will make games feel like playoff contests to those Cavs who've not been aboard the LeBron train previously.
CLE will have an Xs and Os advantage as the Coach goes in with his system and teams take time to figure it out.
After that early hot stretch I think other teams will find which sets and defensive rotations work best.
I expect you see the Cavs hit a bit of a lull around the trade deadline time and make a move or two to correct issues they find.
The team will take another 20-25 games to tinker with things but should maintain high playoff seeding if not very top of the East.
I expect you see a lot of guys try to cement roles in a 9 man rotation. They may try 12-14 guys throughout the regular season but will settle in that last month plus on a playoff rotation.
I expect once in the playoffs the East provides a little tougher challenge than last year but still not a great threat barring it all going right for Chicago.
Whomever wins the West will be a very real test but that team may well be quite tired.
The Clippers won't have the Sterling thing pop up wrecking a historic season.
The Thunder are unlikely to lose their only decent big.
It should be a war every night in the West both regular season and playoffs.
Because of this odds on favorite to win it all has to be CLE.

Where CLE struggles: I think the biggest issue for them will be offensive efficiency in half court. Irving, Waiters, LeBron, Love all score plenty. But scoring on minimal shots and scoring in the last 4 minutes of games is a different thing. I expect some close losses as Kyrie grows up and Love finds his sweet spot. How the guards balance not getting LeBron mad enough to behead them via trade with being aggressive is anyone's guess. The Miami guards other than Wade were mostly scared to death to shoot the ball. The Cavs have to learn to pass up good shots for great shots while also always remaining an offensive threat. --this is Pop basketball.

Where CLE excels: Miami was 5th last year in points allowed at 95.5. This CLE team will be as good on defense. They are younger, more athletic and in general better defenders. It will be very hard to out-rebound CLE. With James, Love and Varajao or Thompson closing out games teams will have a hard time getting more than one shot per possession. They can go small with Marion, James and Love versus teams that go small and basically cause nightmares for those teams. James and Marion can both guard 3 or 4 different positions per team and do so in shut down fashion for at least stretches.

I don't think we will be watching the same team in the beginning of the season that we will in by the end of the season.
everyone will be adjusting to the Princeton package, players have to learn where they should be, & what's their role.
and personal will change a bit towards the end of the season. (we'll see how youngins like Tristen & Waiters fit, may be trade bait or breakouts)
I expect to see a better team later... despite record.... barring injury.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Not sure what point you are making but again what shot blocking has the last 3 Title winners had?
The last good shot blocking for a title winner was probably Tyson Chandler in 2011 with the Mavs.

The thought CLE will be bad on defense is pretty poor basketball IQ.
LeBron changes a lot about a defense and might be the games best overall defender between strength, size and quickness.
Varajao is a hustle and effort guy and Thompson is an elite athlete with really no offensive game that can certainly defend when he enters the game.
The Cavs are very likely to add Marion who is an elite defender with again a terrible offensive game.

IF CLE has an issue it will be offensive efficiency not defense.

I think Tristen has a solid, if not spactacular offensive game. He improved his free throw shooting as well..Offense will be inconsistent as you say, until they figure out who does what........... I think the the problem is length.... they need more length.
a rim protector would help them, allow them to gamble at the top a bit..... and hide love a bit... he can be taken advantage in the pick and roll......

 

[Manwiththeplan]

In before....

I disagree. They still won't be able to beat 4 or 5 teams from the West. They have no bench either. Bring em on.

nevermind, too late

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

In before....



nevermind, too late

lmao.

 

[pjtoadie]

No offense but you are not going to make anyone believe you are the rational Spurs fan with silliness like this.

The Cavs have a ton more talent than Heat did in year 1 and ton more trade assets to use to get better.
Kyrie and Love are babies. Thompson and Waiters are not even to baby status yet.

That is a team with a lot of youth and a lot of assets.

Miami was tapped out after the big 3 and Wade was hurt every other season BEFORE the big 3 era.

The Spurs are not even a lock as a top 4 team in the West to me. Too much depth in the West and too many injury concerns for the Spurs who start off one rotation player lighter than last year.

Vegas has the Cavs as the favorites to win the title.

As a huge Cavs fan I couldn't agree more! They're definitely the favorites in the East and I think if they can get a few more pieces then they can be the favorites to win it all.

 

[bounce]

No offense but you are not going to make anyone believe you are the rational Spurs fan with silliness like this.

The Cavs have a ton more talent than Heat did in year 1 and ton more trade assets to use to get better.
Kyrie and Love are babies. Thompson and Waiters are not even to baby status yet.

That is a team with a lot of youth and a lot of assets.

Miami was tapped out after the big 3 and Wade was hurt every other season BEFORE the big 3 era.

The Spurs are not even a lock as a top 4 team in the West to me. Too much depth in the West and too many injury concerns for the Spurs who start off one rotation player lighter than last year.

Vegas has the Cavs as the favorites to win the title.

I read and re-read my post, and I just can't seem to find anywhere I even mentioned the Spurs name. I'm not saying the Cavs won't be good, but I don't think that this is their year. First, as you stated, they're all really young - so probably a year away from being a real threat. It has nothing to do with San Antonio, and I'm not even talking about them.

Second, they are going to have some terrible defense. Kyrie Irving is atrocious. Flat-out atrocious. Almost intentionally bad. For NBA point guards, his RPM (Real +/-) is -3.38. Ranked 72nd out of 82 players. The only starter worse than him is Brandon Jennings. James Harden thinks Kyrie Irving plays bad defense.

Kevin Love is 22nd among PFs. Higher than Irving, but surrounded by such talents as Jason Thompson, Kyle O'Quinn and Elton Brand. (2014 Elton Brand, by the way). And he's been noted as a terrible defender. Yes, a good rebounder and an amazing passer, but a terrible defender.

Varejao, Thompson and Waiters are fine players and will be fine. Waiters is white-hot when he's on, but takes half the season to get into gear. If health isn't an issue for all teams, I think the Bulls are better in the East. In the West, I think the Cavs could lose to OKC, LAC, Dallas, SA and maybe Portland.

And how are they going to have a ton more assets? After this season, they're going to have Lebron making >20M a year, Kyrie has a 90M extension starting after this year, and Love is going to be on a 120M contract. Do the math and see how much money they'll have after this season. It's going to be the same problem Miami had, but with less players taking paycuts. Personally, I think they're too young this year, and next year they're going to have so much money tied up in three guys, they're going to fill out the rest with min contracts or vets chasing a ring.

So, back to exactly what I said in the first post - the Cavs are going to give up a ton of points on defense, because two of their 'big three' are very poor defenders. One of them is one of the absolute worst in the league. And you can't hide him against the Rose, Westbrook, Paul, Parker, Lillard's of the world. Lebron can't guard everyone.

And spare me the vegas lines. Those are based on bets, and the Cavs became the odds favorites the minute Lebron signed.

 

[burmafrd]

I read and re-read my post, and I just can't seem to find anywhere I even mentioned the Spurs name. I'm not saying the Cavs won't be good, but I don't think that this is their year. First, as you stated, they're all really young - so probably a year away from being a real threat. It has nothing to do with San Antonio, and I'm not even talking about them.

Second, they are going to have some terrible defense. Kyrie Irving is atrocious. Flat-out atrocious. Almost intentionally bad. For NBA point guards, his RPM (Real +/-) is -3.38. Ranked 72nd out of 82 players. The only starter worse than him is Brandon Jennings. James Harden thinks Kyrie Irving plays bad defense.

Kevin Love is 22nd among PFs. Higher than Irving, but surrounded by such talents as Jason Thompson, Kyle O'Quinn and Elton Brand. (2014 Elton Brand, by the way). And he's been noted as a terrible defender. Yes, a good rebounder and an amazing passer, but a terrible defender.

Varejao, Thompson and Waiters are fine players and will be fine. Waiters is white-hot when he's on, but takes half the season to get into gear. If health isn't an issue for all teams, I think the Bulls are better in the East. In the West, I think the Cavs could lose to OKC, LAC, Dallas, SA and maybe Portland.

And how are they going to have a ton more assets? After this season, they're going to have Lebron making >20M a year, Kyrie has a 90M extension starting after this year, and Love is going to be on a 120M contract. Do the math and see how much money they'll have after this season. It's going to be the same problem Miami had, but with less players taking paycuts. Personally, I think they're too young this year, and next year they're going to have so much money tied up in three guys, they're going to fill out the rest with min contracts or vets chasing a ring.

So, back to exactly what I said in the first post - the Cavs are going to give up a ton of points on defense, because two of their 'big three' are very poor defenders. One of them is one of the absolute worst in the league. And you can't hide him against the Rose, Westbrook, Paul, Parker, Lillard's of the world. Lebron can't guard everyone.

And spare me the vegas lines. Those are based on bets, and the Cavs became the odds favorites the minute Lebron signed.

spurs homers never see reality; just like any other homer

 

[bounce]

spurs homers never see reality; just like any other homer

Again - I didn't mention the Spurs. This has nothing to do with the Spurs. You contribute exactly nothing, you realize that, right? You're white noise.

 

[burmafrd]

Again - I didn't mention the Spurs. This has nothing to do with the Spurs. You contribute exactly nothing, you realize that, right? You're white noise.

you are a spurs homer right?

 

[bounce]

you are a spurs homer right?

I'm a fan of the Spurs, and they're my favorite team. I guarantee I've seen and been to more Spurs games than just about everyone here, save for probably a few, so if you want to call it that, then sure. It's ridiculous semantics, so call it what you want. We have names for you guys, too.

Look at your post history in NBA threads. You say nothing other than this. You offer up no viewpoints. You're the old guy in the balcony on the Muppets. So again, I reiterate...

You contribute exactly nothing, you realize that, right? You're white noise.

 

[zrinkill]

spurs homers never see reality; just like any other homer

I see the troll is still crying .......even after almost two months

 

[Manwiththeplan]

How is it Burm is the troll, when Spurs fans once again hijack a thread not about the Spurs, in order to talk about how great they are?

 

[bounce]

How is it Burm is the troll, when Spurs fans once again hijack a thread not about the Spurs, in order to talk about how great they are?

Translation: "I haven't read a word of this thread."