The 2015 Dallas Cowboys and the Myth of DeMarco Murray

[mattjames2010]

That's pretty funny. Yes, technically McFadden and Randle had a combined 129 snaps as pass blockers in 2014.

Snaps as pass blocker, 2014
McFadden 118
Randle 11

Yes, obviously it was combined, the tweet didn't hide that fact. But seeing as how backup RBs around the league, even with limited opportunities still struggle with blitz pickups and pass protection, it's still an indicator that Randle is a fairly decent/good blocker.

As I have stated, context does matter though, and I'd like a source that Randle only pass protected late in the fourth.

 

[Stash]

We don't know that Randle can't handle it. No evidence at all. The limited evidence we do have has been good.
We do know more about him than any rookie--though I would have liked to have drafted one anyway.

I'm willing to give Randle some benefit of the doubt. Unlike some, he hasn't shown himself to be a failure. But even if he does well, the team needs to have a reliable backup option too.

You're concerns about DMC's reliability are warranted though, given his history. Last year he made it through the year, but that could be an outlier.

Yeah, and last year he was also relegated to an afterthought as well.

I actually think if he'll run well behind this line and with this passing game if he can stay fairly healthy--big if though.

I can see why people would and I see some of that myself. But that confidence comes more from the offensive line than what the player has delivered in his NFL career.

In short it's:

Great run blocking + fast running back = home run running game

 

[jazzcat22]

Here's the sad facts about his injury history, for anyone not looking to bury their heads in the sand:



Full Injury History
Season League Injury Analysis
2015 NFL Leg McFadden pulled a hamstring in OTAs and missed the camp as a result
2015 NFL Leg DMC was placed on the active PUP list to open training camp with a pulled hamstring (different one to the one that kept him out of OTAs)
2013 NFL Leg The injury bug bit McFadden on the hamstring in week 5. He aggravated it in week 9 and missed 3 more games
2013 NFL Ankle McFadden sprained his ankle in the Thanksgiving game and missed the following 2 games
2012 NFL Ankle McFadden got pulled from the game vs the Broncos as he re-injured his bad right ankle
2012 NFL Ankle Mcfadden suffered a high ankle sprain that kept him out of 5 regular season games
2011 NFL Foot Suffered a lisfranc sprain, missed the next 9 games and was placed on IR
2011 NFL Head Fractured orbit bone in a freak accident at practice and missed 4 games
2010 NFL Ankl eMissed a game due to a sprained right ankle
2010 NFL Leg Pulled his hamstring and missed 3 games
2010 NFL Leg McFadden missed 2 games with a pulled hamstring
2009 NFL Knee Tore his meniscus vs the Texans and needed surgery. Resulted in a 4 game break
2008NFLShoulderMcFadden needed to undergo surgery after sustaining an injury during drills
2008NFLFootMcFadden suffered from turf toe that kept him out of 2 games
2008NFLFootMcFadden missed a game due to turf toe
2008NFLShoulderSprained his shoulder and missed 1 game

No one is burying their heads in the sand. I don't see it that way, the team is certainly not. Some nice research there. Apparently it bothers you more than most. How did Murray's injury history look going into last year. DMC was healthy the entire year last year, as was Murray, also finished his first complete season. He did have a broken hand, that normally he would have sat out in previous year. But had a contract year last year. And he was spelled more in that game than usual, as he really needed 2 weeks off.

I am not saying we are fine at RB, but it may not be as bleak as some and you think either. I am saying give it another week and see. If another RB needs to be brought in, then he has 4 weeks to prepare. But it does not mean he won't get a hammy problem either. Even if it's Jackson or Johnson, regardless of injury history.

 

[mattjames2010]

We don't know that Randle can't handle it. No evidence at all. The limited evidence we do have has been good.
We do know more about him than any rookie--though I would have liked to have drafted one anyway.

You're concerns about DMC's reliability are warranted though, given his history. Last year he made it through the year, but that could be an outlier.
I actually think if he'll run well behind this line and with this passing game if he can stay fairly healthy--big if though.
He's the backup anyway.

The issue here isn't our staff feeling confident in Randle, the issue is them not realizing just what you said: There is limited evidence on Randle to know if he can carry the load or be productive, but we still have yet to sign quality backup plan at RB. McFadden is not that, and there is already enough evidence pointing to why.

 

[TheSkaven]

I'm far more excited about this 2015 team than I was even about our team after it made it to the playoffs last year. I think this team isn't as reliant on any individual for success, which is a good thing, especially at the running back position.

Great post. I'm not sure if people have been following Murray's progress (or lack-thereof) in Eagles' camp so far. He has been limited in just about every practice with various ailments. When he has practiced, a few reporters have noted that he's been fumbling a lot in camp. It's still early, of course. Here is a blurb from this morning's Philadelphia Inquirer:

RB DeMarco Murray was practicing for the second straight day and did perhaps more than he has all camp. He missed Thursday’s practice with an unspecified illness and has been held out of various drills since the first day. But he seemed to move with more authority than previously. During one team drill, Murray hopped through a hole, but was met by DE Fletcher Cox and the ball popped out. A play later, he darted through a crevice, but ran into DE Cedric Thornton.

http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/...nner-irks-43000-fans.html#jIMUi2JGY12rbh8A.99

 

[Sydla]

The report out of Philly was he missed the first practice because his hydration "levels" were not up to par per Kelly's sports science program. It's being alleged the 2nd missed practice was tied to that as well.

 

[percyhoward]

It's still an indicator that Randle is a fairly decent/good blocker.

For those 11 snaps he was perfect. We'll get a good idea when that number is multiplied by 5 or 6 (or more), as it likely will be this season.

Chris Gronkowski had 45 plays as a pass blocker in his career, and only allowed one sack. On the other 44 plays, spread out over three years, he was evidently very good.

 

[Jstopper]

It happens much sooner and with better results if you try than if you don't. This team wasn't without opportunities and they still aren't. If they fail, it's because they failed, not because they had no opportunity.



No, we have "not proven" in Randle and proven unreliable in McFadden. And yeah, we have "5 weeks to game 1", but if we're going to bring in another option, is it better to give him 5 weeks to learn the offense and his role, or 4 weeks? or maybe 3 weeks? or two weeks? Maybe the week before the season starts?

2011 Murray was so unproven that he wasn't even the starter. He was on the bench behind freaking Felix Jones. And yet once he got his opportunities to shine (because Felix went down with injury) we saw that he could run. So if people keep calling Randle "not proven" neither was Murray, so at some point you have to let a person play to find out how "proven" they are. And watch McFadden is gonna come alive behind this line.

 

[xwalker]

It doesn't take film analysis to come up with Latavious's bloated YPC, you can simply look at the stats. Yeah, Demarco Murray wouldn't have had as much success in Oakland as he did here, our run blocking line did play a factor into his success, but McFadden has been struggling since 2011. It didn't just happen last year.

And for injuries being so unpredictable, it's been fairly predictable with McFadden.

McFadden has averaged playing 12 games per season. DeMarco has averaged playing 13 games per season.

 

[mattjames2010]

McFadden has averaged playing 12 games per season. DeMarco has averaged playing 13 games per season.

Again, the issue is not games started/missed, it's the lingering injuries that McFadden has had throughout his career. Not only does he miss games, when he returns, he's not 100%. He's known to be a slow healer from injuries.

 

[xwalker]

My eyes have at least watched his carries which is more than 90% of people do when they regurgitate what the media is saying. My analysis of the video that was posted on this site a couple of months ago was that Murray would have struggled to average 3.0 yards a carry with the same block Dmac got last season.

I also dispelled the myth that Latavious Murray (or any other back they had)was just so much better than Dmac behind the same line. Latavious's 5.1 ypc was bloated by the 90 yard run he had and would have been dropped to 4.0 with half of the carries of Dmac if you remove that one carry. Also, Murray had the disadvantage of taking most of the carries in the first half of the Raiders schedule which had much tougher defenses while Latavious didn't get a single carry.

Dmac still is explosive, still runs hard, still doesn't fumble and still pass protects very well. This was a schrewd aquisition by the Cowboys and it will show in the weeks and months to come.

Injury is unpredicatble, it could happen to anyone. I hate that label for players.

You're debating with people that don't have the ability to watch game footage and analyze players.

L. Murray's average dropped significantly in the 3 games at the end of the year when he was the starter.

McFadden's average jumped to 5.3 when he was the backup in those games.

Anybody, that tries to use the ypc for backup RBs to claim they were better than McFadden is misguided.

The bottom line is that McFadden is a good RB when healthy. The issue is obviously that he has problems staying healthy; although, I think him being on the PUP is just the team being extra careful with him. He said he was ready to go over a week ago.

 

[Carl23]

Murray may have left meat on the bone, but he was able to pick up the short yards when we needed him. Can the backs that we have on the roster now pick up a 3rd and 2 or pound it in near the goal line. That is my biggest concern.

 

[Stash]

No one is burying their heads in the sand. I don't see it that way, the team is certainly not. Some nice research there. Apparently it bothers you more than most. How did Murray's injury history look going into last year. DMC was healthy the entire year last year, as was Murray, also finished his first complete season. He did have a broken hand, that normally he would have sat out in previous year. But had a contract year last year. And he was spelled more in that game than usual, as he really needed 2 weeks off.

I am not saying we are fine at RB, but it may not be as bleak as some and you think either. I am saying give it another week and see.

And I'm just saying I'm losing my patience waiting for a guy who has a terrible history of injury and an awful track record here thus far. I just don't want to see a potentially championship season derailed because we mistakenly counted on the wrong guy.

If another RB needs to be brought in, then he has 4 weeks to prepare. But it does not mean he won't get a hammy problem either. Even if it's Jackson or Johnson, regardless of injury history.

We can compare the injury histories of Darren McFadden and Chris Johnson if you would like, but I'll tell you now, it won't help your case!

 

[Stash]

2011 Murray was so unproven that he wasn't even the starter. He was on the bench behind freaking Felix Jones. And yet once he got his opportunities to shine (because Felix went down with injury) we saw that he could run. So if people keep calling Randle "not proven" neither was Murray, so at some point you have to let a person play to find out how "proven" they are.

I'm actually very optimistic about Randle's chances to be the lead running back for this team. It's the complete lack of reliability behind that which scares me.

And watch McFadden is gonna come alive behind this line.

I'll settle for seeing him on the field at this point. Can't help the club in the tub!

 

[ElGatoGrande]

I'm actually very optimistic about Randle's chances to be the lead running back for this team. It's the complete lack of reliability behind that which scares me.

This is what scares me too,,, I think one of the big selling points for RBBC is that you don't tie up all your money into one player and have funds available to pay for decent backups. This team better have 3 good (and healthy) options when the season starts.

 

[percyhoward]

Murray may have left meat on the bone, but he was able to pick up the short yards when we needed him. Can the backs that we have on the roster now pick up a 3rd and 2 or pound it in near the goal line. That is my biggest concern.

It's definitely a concern, but at least you've got nothing to lose by putting your best short-yardage back in the game in those situations. The success of the play doesn't depend on fooling the defense. Pass protection is a different story. If you don't trust your best runner to pick up the blitz, then your best runner won't see the field much. If he does, it means you're having to do things that compromise your offense's abilities.

 

[Stash]

This is what scares me too,,, I think one of the big selling points for RBBC is that you don't tie up all your money into one player and have funds available to pay for decent backups. This team better have 3 good (and healthy) options when the season starts.

I have the feeling that if the Joneses win the battle to keep their vanity project on the roster, the team will be forced to keep 4 running backs to make up for the lack of reliability behind Randle.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Murray may have left meat on the bone, but he was able to pick up the short yards when we needed him. Can the backs that we have on the roster now pick up a 3rd and 2 or pound it in near the goal line. That is my biggest concern.

The Cowboys front office doesn't seem concerned.

 

[Stash]

You're debating with people that don't have the ability to watch game footage and analyze players.

L. Murray's average dropped significantly in the 3 games at the end of the year when he was the starter.

McFadden's average jumped to 5.3 when he was the backup in those games.

Anybody, that tries to use the ypc for backup RBs to claim they were better than McFadden is misguided.

And anyone who claims he's anything other than an NFL disappointment is even more "misguided".

The bottom line is that McFadden is a good RB when healthy.

That might be your "bottom line", but you're in the minority with your opinion. McFadden is considered an injury-prone draft bust by the majority of anyone who watches or covers the NFL. So when you try to make claims like that you should really preface it by saying 'in my opinion', because your opinion on this subject is not one that is widely shared.

The issue is obviously that he has problems staying healthy; although, I think him being on the PUP is just the team being extra careful with him. He said he was ready to go over a week ago.

Yeah, and he thought he was good to go over a month ago too. And I'm sure he'll tell the team he'll "be back soon" from his next injury too...

 

[jazzcat22]

And I'm just saying I'm losing my patience waiting for a guy who has a terrible history of injury and an awful track record here thus far. I just don't want to see a potentially championship season derailed because we mistakenly counted on the wrong guy.



We can compare the injury histories of Darren McFadden and Chris Johnson if you would like, but I'll tell you now, it won't help your case!

Not trying to make a case for DMC. Or I don't plan to make it seem like that. Just want to see where things are after the SD game, if he comes back. If not, then yes, get some other RB's in here.

And yes, understand the frustration with this RB situation too. I don't want to see a great season potential derailed because they didn't address the RB issue better. did they do enough, no not in the fans view. but I also trust them a bit that they know what they have going into TC. They could not for see any injury issues. Even if Murray was here, with his history, what id he had a hamstring issue. Would people be saying the same things. Though he never had hamstring issues before like DMC has, but he has had other injuries. Ankles sprains and such.