The 2015 Dallas Cowboys and the Myth of DeMarco Murray

[Stash]

I'm wouldn't be so sure about that. For 6 months some have been waiting for the Cowboys to make a move and they won't be satisified until we bring in the next Emmitt Smith.

And others have made excuse after excuse for him while clinging to Youtube highlights.

At this point, I'll settle for a running back actually capable of running!

 

[mattjames2010]

Which is why I said we were lucky last year.

I didn't say Murray was a great pass blocker, I said if his replacement is just as good, we'd have to rely on some luck. With 3.6 carries per game over his career, you can't call Randle a "proven" anything, and unfortunately, McFadden can't pass protect if he isn't in the game.

Actually, there's enough plays to show that Randle is in fact a good pass blocker. And obviously I'm not going to sit here and defend McFadden for missing time, I agree with that. But you were discussing missing Murray's pass protection, and he wasn't very good. I'd say he was average at best.

But again, his statistics seem to have just been glanced at when it comes to pass protection. I am still hoping for more research to be done with it (I'm admittedly too lazy to do it myself since it's not much of an importance now that he's gone).

 

[jazzcat22]

The Romo haters can certainly be loud, but they are also in small number (At least on this board). There is a loud Williams hater on this board as well, and not many take his extreme stance on the issue. They don't make up the majority.

I'm willing to bet that Oakland Raiders' fans aren't losing any sleep over the loss of McFadden.

Yes, this is true. I am pulling for McFadden, because he is on our team, but I can certainly understand this too.

 

[Ken]

I'm sorry, but the "I watched every snap" doesn't do anything for me unless you have some video analysis that proves to me your eyes are better than others. You think Oakland Raiders' fans miss McFadden? Most of them also saw every snap and will say the opposite of what you're saying.

And the issue with McFadden, and I'm surprised i have to explain this, is not just missing games due to injury, it's how his injuries linger.

As I've been asking for a while: I'm still waiting for a reasonable argument that we shouldn't be skeptical of our current group of RBs. Williams was our savior a month ago, he's not longer with the team. McFadden was going to "surprise us", but he's doing what he's been doing his entire career. We have been told that Randle will make us forget about Murray, though I haven't heard anything glowing about him (I understand he's still a relative unknown, but that's part of the issue).

So, what should make us skeptics feel confident in this group of RBs?

My eyes have at least watched his carries which is more than 90% of people do when they regurgitate what the media is saying. My analysis of the video that was posted on this site a couple of months ago was that Murray would have struggled to average 3.0 yards a carry with the same block Dmac got last season.

I also dispelled the myth that Latavious Murray (or any other back they had)was just so much better than Dmac behind the same line. Latavious's 5.1 ypc was bloated by the 90 yard run he had and would have been dropped to 4.0 with half of the carries of Dmac if you remove that one carry. Also, Murray had the disadvantage of taking most of the carries in the first half of the Raiders schedule which had much tougher defenses while Latavious didn't get a single carry.

Dmac still is explosive, still runs hard, still doesn't fumble and still pass protects very well. This was a schrewd aquisition by the Cowboys and it will show in the weeks and months to come.

Injury is unpredicatble, it could happen to anyone. I hate that label for players.

 

[jazzcat22]

Whereas others can't handle anything other than "Cowboys Yay!" or "Everyone's Great!"

Every team has it's weaknesses. We have strength in the OL. An excellent K. Strong at WR, but to some could be better. An improving D, but yet to be seen on the field. But last year almost the entire universe had our D being the worse ever. I think they improve this year, but still unknown as to strength and weakness yet. But on paper looks to be better than last year. We have one of the top 10 QB's easily, could use a better P, but is not horrible.

RB is an unknown, even though should be decent with the OL, but that doesn't mean much if the RB still does not do his part. This is the biggest concern and ? right now. I stated before I think we will be fine, not Murray production fine, but he would even have a hard time repeating last year. But more and more I am getting concerned with the RB situation. I will give it until after the SD game though. Be patient and see what unfolds first.

It will be a good 6 games or so before we see the D and any big improvements, as they go through adjustments until Hardy and McClain return. But they do not look horrible as not to survive 4 games without them.

 

[percyhoward]

Actually, there's enough plays to show that Randle is in fact a good pass blocker.

Don't know what you're basing that on. He's pass blocked on a total of 27 plays in his career, with a lot of that coming in garbage time when the defense was not expecting pass anyway.

Snaps as pass blocker, 2013-14
Murray 203
Randle 27

 

[Stash]

Every team has it's weaknesses. We have strength in the OL. An excellent K. Strong at WR, but to some could be better. An improving D, but yet to be seen on the field. But last year almost the entire universe had our D being the worse ever. I think they improve this year, but still unknown as to strength and weakness yet. But on paper looks to be better than last year. We have one of the top 10 QB's easily, could use a better P, but is not horrible.

RB is an unknown, even though should be decent with the OL, but that doesn't mean much if the RB still does not do his part. This is the biggest concern and ? right now. I stated before I think we will be fine, not Murray production fine, but he would even have a hard time repeating last year. But more and more I am getting concerned with the RB situation. I will give it until after the SD game though. Be patient and see what unfolds first.

It will be a good 6 games or so before we see the D and any big improvements, as they go through adjustments until Hardy and McClain return. But they do not look horrible as not to survive 4 games without them.

And nobody's dismissing the many strengths this team has. What they are doing is expressing legitimate concern over losing the NFL's leading rusher and trying to replace him with guys who can't stay healthy enough to even contribute in practice. And it's dismissive and inaccurate of anyone to describe that concern as 'whining', unless they're a happy fan who can't handle the truth or criticism of their favorite team.

 

[mattjames2010]

My eyes have at least watched his carries which is more than 90% of people do when they regurgitate what the media is saying. My analysis of the video that was posted on this site a couple of months ago was that Murray would have struggled to average 3.0 yards a carry with the same block Dmac got last season.

I also dispelled the myth that Latavious Murray (or any other back they had)was just so much better than Dmac behind the same line. Latavious's 5.1 ypc was bloated by the 90 yard run he had and would have been dropped to 4.0 with half of the carries of Dmac if you remove that one carry. Also, Murray had the disadvantage of taking most of the carries in the first half of the Raiders schedule which had much tougher defenses while Latavious didn't get a single carry.

Dmac still is explosive, still runs hard, still doesn't fumble and still pass protects very well. This was a schrewd aquisition by the Cowboys and it will show in the weeks and months to come.

Injury is unpredicatble, it could happen to anyone. I hate that label for players.

It doesn't take film analysis to come up with Latavious's bloated YPC, you can simply look at the stats. Yeah, Demarco Murray wouldn't have had as much success in Oakland as he did here, our run blocking line did play a factor into his success, but McFadden has been struggling since 2011. It didn't just happen last year.

And for injuries being so unpredictable, it's been fairly predictable with McFadden.

 

[jazzcat22]

Dmac still is explosive, still runs hard, still doesn't fumble and still pass protects very well. This was a schrewd aquisition by the Cowboys and it will show in the weeks and months to come.

Injury is unpredicatble, it could happen to anyone. I hate that label for players.

But in the "Cowboys 'twilight' Zone" injury prone players only live here, it does not happen in outside world [teams].........if NE signed McFadden and is sitting out of practice...Bellicheat is a genius for signing him to a cheap contract and is a genius giving him rest until he is 100%.
Here, a hangnail is bad enough to get the firing squad.

 

[Stash]

And for injuries being so unpredictable, it's been fairly predictable with McFadden.

Yeah, it doesn't take a crystal ball to see that he can't handle the physical requirements of being an FL running back.

 

[mattjames2010]

Don't know what you're basing that on. He's pass blocked on a total of 27 plays in his career, with a lot of that coming in garbage time when the defense was not expecting pass anyway.

Snaps as pass blocker, 2013-14
Murray 203
Randle 27

In 2014: DeMarco Murray: 71 pass block snaps, 3 sacks conceded. Darren McFadden & Joe Randle: 129 pass block snaps, 0 sacks conceded

Here's the thread where it was discussed: http://cowboyszone.com/threads/rb-pass-blocking-blurb.322069/

I'm actually wondering where you got your Murray stats.

 

[mattjames2010]

And again, I'll state: I still think Murray's pass protection needs further looking into. This is judging something on the surface, and I don't have every snap recorded to do this myself. But from those who have looked into Murray's pass protection a little deeper, they weren't glowing.

 

[Stash]

But in the "Cowboys 'twilight' Zone" injury prone players only live here, it does not happen in outside world [teams].........if NE signed McFadden and is sitting out of practice...Bellicheat is a genius for signing him to a cheap contract and is a genius giving him rest until he is 100%.
Here, a hangnail is bad enough to get the firing squad.

Here's the sad facts about his injury history, for anyone not looking to bury their heads in the sand:



Full Injury History
Season League Injury Analysis
2015 NFL Leg McFadden pulled a hamstring in OTAs and missed the camp as a result
2015 NFL Leg DMC was placed on the active PUP list to open training camp with a pulled hamstring (different one to the one that kept him out of OTAs)
2013 NFL Leg The injury bug bit McFadden on the hamstring in week 5. He aggravated it in week 9 and missed 3 more games
2013 NFL Ankle McFadden sprained his ankle in the Thanksgiving game and missed the following 2 games
2012 NFL Ankle McFadden got pulled from the game vs the Broncos as he re-injured his bad right ankle
2012 NFL Ankle Mcfadden suffered a high ankle sprain that kept him out of 5 regular season games
2011 NFL Foot Suffered a lisfranc sprain, missed the next 9 games and was placed on IR
2011 NFL Head Fractured orbit bone in a freak accident at practice and missed 4 games
2010 NFL Ankl eMissed a game due to a sprained right ankle
2010 NFL Leg Pulled his hamstring and missed 3 games
2010 NFL Leg McFadden missed 2 games with a pulled hamstring
2009 NFL Knee Tore his meniscus vs the Texans and needed surgery. Resulted in a 4 game break
2008NFLShoulderMcFadden needed to undergo surgery after sustaining an injury during drills
2008NFLFootMcFadden suffered from turf toe that kept him out of 2 games
2008NFLFootMcFadden missed a game due to turf toe
2008NFLShoulderSprained his shoulder and missed 1 game

 

[jazzcat22]

And nobody's dismissing the many strengths this team has. What they are doing is expressing legitimate concern over losing the NFL's leading rusher and trying to replace him with guys who can't stay healthy enough to even contribute in practice. And it's dismissive and inaccurate of anyone to describe that concern as 'whining', unless they're a happy fan who can't handle the truth or criticism of their favorite team.

It goes both ways...I think most fans can handle some constructive criticism. but when some posters never has anything good to say about anything or any player, that's where the whining tag comes from. sometimes a team just are not in a situation to improve everything in one year, or to the fans, or some fans likings. Just does not happen that way.

Look how long it took to get Romo in place of Aikman, heck the Raiders are still looking for any decent QB.

So we go 1 year without a top 10 RB, it's not like the RB's we have are horrible. Just not proven to what Murray accomplished last year. But that does not mean they can be a factor and productive for a game plan if executed well. As for health, we have what, 5 weeks to game 1. Patience is a virtue, give it a few more weeks, see where we are then. I am sure the team has a list ready for RB's.

 

[jrumann59]

And others have made excuse after excuse for him while clinging to Youtube highlights.

At this point, I'll settle for a running back actually capable of running!

So a barely walking back like DMC is out of the question.

 

[Stash]

It goes both ways...I think most fans can handle some constructive criticism. but when some posters never has anything good to say about anything or any player, that's where the whining tag comes from. sometimes a team just are not in a situation to improve everything in one year, or to the fans, or some fans likings. Just does not happen that way.

It happens much sooner and with better results if you try than if you don't. This team wasn't without opportunities and they still aren't. If they fail, it's because they failed, not because they had no opportunity.

So we go 1 year without a top 10 RB, it's not like the RB's we have are horrible. Just not proven to what Murray accomplished last year. But that does not mean they can be a factor and productive for a game plan if executed well. As for health, we have what, 5 weeks to game 1. Patience is a virtue, give it a few more weeks, see where we are then. I am sure the team has a list ready for RB's.

No, we have "not proven" in Randle and proven unreliable in McFadden. And yeah, we have "5 weeks to game 1", but if we're going to bring in another option, is it better to give him 5 weeks to learn the offense and his role, or 4 weeks? or maybe 3 weeks? or two weeks? Maybe the week before the season starts?

 

[Stash]

So a barely walking back like DMC is out of the question.

Yeah, unless you're talking strictly about youtube highlights.

 

[Sydla]

In theory, I completely understand and agree with not overpaying for a TB. So I can get behind letting Murray walk in one sense. But when there doesnt appear to be a capable backup plan, I think you then have to wonder about the strategy.

From what I can gather, Randle hasn't looked great thus far and McFadden is still showing to be a major injury concern. I think it is quite possible the front office grossly overestimated how much success last year was attributable to just the OL and not also having a talented RB back there.

 

[percyhoward]

In 2014: DeMarco Murray: 71 pass block snaps, 3 sacks conceded. Darren McFadden & Joe Randle: 129 pass block snaps, 0 sacks conceded

Here's the thread where it was discussed: http://cowboyszone.com/threads/rb-pass-blocking-blurb.322069/

That's pretty funny. Yes, technically McFadden and Randle had a combined 129 snaps as pass blockers in 2014.

Snaps as pass blocker, 2014
McFadden 118
Randle 11

 

[DFWJC]

And nobody's dismissing the many strengths this team has. What they are doing is expressing legitimate concern over losing the NFL's leading rusher and trying to replace him with guys who can't stay healthy enough to even contribute in practice. And it's dismissive and inaccurate of anyone to describe that concern as 'whining', unless they're a happy fan who can't handle the truth or criticism of their favorite team.

We don't know that Randle can't handle it. No evidence at all. The limited evidence we do have has been good.
We do know more about him than any rookie--though I would have liked to have drafted one anyway.

You're concerns about DMC's reliability are warranted though, given his history. Last year he made it through the year, but that could be an outlier.
I actually think if he'll run well behind this line and with this passing game if he can stay fairly healthy--big if though.
He's the backup anyway.