The case for Urban Meyer, a case for the fans

[cowboyec]

URBAN LEGEND
PLEASE AND THANK YOU

 

[gimmesix]

Do you believe everything public figures say?

I suppose you believe everything Jerry tells us too? Lol

And I’m not making up anything. My theories are based on recent history and trends. And conclusions others in the media, critics and fans have arrived at.

Public figures lie just like anyone else. However, until I see proof that something is a lie, I don't just believe what fits my agenda.

I see no reason right now to doubt Parcells ... and don't believe I should until someone provides evidence contrary to that.

Without evidence, you are totally making up your position on this. That's the way conspiracy theories work. They are unprovable but people believe them anyway. You might as well be saying that Jerry is an alien because there's just as much evidence for that.

 

[BleedinBlue]

these guys took a month to mull over a new kicker , new coach won't be announced until training camp

 

[Diehardblues]

Public figures lie just like anyone else. However, until I see proof that something is a lie, I don't just believe what fits my agenda.

I see no reason right now to doubt Parcells ... and don't believe I should until someone provides evidence contrary to that.

Without evidence, you are totally making up your position on this. That's the way conspiracy theories work. They are unprovable but people believe them anyway. You might as well be saying that Jerry is an alien because there's just as much evidence for that.

I didn’t say Parcells was lying. I said Jerry’s meddling ran Bill off early. Everyone knows how frustrated Bill was with TO and some of the other problem talents Jerry brought in undermined Bills authority.

Just because Bill was a class act and didn’t state Jerry ran him off early it was interpreted by many fans and media as well. If you don’t recall all of that when it transpired I don’t know what to tell you.

I’m not the only fan who interpreted as such. I’m not attempting to prove anything. You either recall as it unfolded and arrived at your interpretations or conclusions or didn’t. Believe what you will.

 

[gimmesix]

I didn’t say Parcells was lying. I said Jerry’s meddling ran Bill off early. Everyone knows how frustrated Bill was with TO and some of the other problem talents Jerry brought in undermining Bills authority.

Just because Bill was a class act and didn’t state Jerry ran him off early it was interpreted by many fans and media as well. If you don’t recall all of that when it transpired I don’t know what to tell you.

I’m not the only fan who interpreted as such.

And you're not the only fan who read into it more than has been revealed anywhere.

If Parcells said he left because he couldn't stand the losses and the toll they took on him. If Parcells said Jerry is a great owner and he liked working for him. Then how are you not calling him a liar? He either left for the reason he stated or he lied about it.

 

[Diehardblues]

And you're not the only fan who read into it more than has been revealed anywhere.

If Parcells said he left because he couldn't stand the losses and the toll they took on him. If Parcells said Jerry is a great owner and he liked working for him. Then how are you not calling him a liar? He either left for the reason he stated or he lied about it.

I’m not saying those weren't reasons as well. The loss in Seattle took a toll on him. But saying Jerry’s meddling wasn’t a contributing factor is short sighted IMO.

And it’s not something you’d mention. But it was something that was widely discussed in local media that Jerry’s meddling including TO and others frustrated Bill.

 

[gimmesix]

I’m not saying those weren't reasons as well. The loss in Seattle took a toll on him. But saying Jerry’s meddling wasn’t a contributing factor is short sighted IMO.

And it’s not something you’d mention. But it was something that was widely discussed in local media that Jerry’s meddling including TO and others frustrated Bill.

Talking heads speculate as well. In fact, some like the ones on ESPN shows do more speculating than actual reporting.

It's possible that Jerry's meddling was a contributing factor, but there's simply no evidence out there that supports it. No player or ex-player that I know of has said that Parcells was frustrated with Jones. Parcells has had nothing but nice things to say, and I don't consider Parcells to be one of those guys who holds back his opinion to be polite.

These are from 2013, years removed from his time coaching the Cowboys concerning the perception of Jerry Jones:

"Oh yeah, definitely. I think it’s distorted," Parcells said. "I think there’s a definite misperception. I just think everyone thinks things are a certain way. I didn’t see it to be that way. I think Jerry is a good businessmen and a good listener. What you have to do is make sense to him. You’ve got to make sense to him. If he thinks you’re making sense, he’ll alter his opinion. I enjoyed him. I like him. I like him a lot."

"I liked my experience there," Parcells said. "It didn’t turn out perfect from a record-standpoint. I understand all of that. But I learned a lot and I enjoyed working there.

"Jerry and I are pretty good friends. I don’t know whether or not people know that. We talk a little bit. I wouldn’t say frequently. We talk a little bit. We talked recently. It’s good. And I’m close with Stephen [Jones], too. I enjoyed working there with the Joneses. They were supportive and tried to help."

“I have a high regard for him,” Bill Parcells said during a conference call for his induction into the Pro Football Hall of Fame. “He has a tremendous amount of passion for the franchise and I think the people are lucky to have him, lucky to have him as an owner, because they’re not all the same. I can tell you that. Having a guy like that and what he tries to do on a yearly basis there is great.”

Instead of taking that at face value, we have many on here that have to say Parcells was being disingenuous or out and out lying because that's not how they see Jones so they can't believe Parcells would actually feel that way about him.

The closest he gets to what you believe is this:

“He’s a straightforward, honest guy,” Parcells said. “He really is. That’s all I look for. He was very supportive of me as a coach. Now were there things going on that occasionally I didn’t like? Yeah, there were, but that didn’t inhibit me from going to him, talking things out. He’s really great about that.”

If you want to conclude from that that those things contributed to him leaving, that's your prerogative. I believe Parcells is the type who would have said it if he felt it, like his famous quote about New England: “If they want you to cook the dinner, at least they ought to let you shop for some of the groceries.”

He later came back and said both he and Kraft were too stubborn at that time. Contrast that with anything he has said about Jones and leaving the Cowboys and you don't find anything that indicates that Jones played a role in him leaving.

“We had some mutual friends. I was very close with Al Davis and I know Jerry was, too,” Parcells says. “I had a little background information from Al – not about working for the Cowboys, just about what they were trying to do. I knew Jerry had a lot of passion for his work and his job and his organization. I could name a few organizations I don’t feel that about – the owner is just blasé about ‘if we win, we win, good; if we don’t, that’s all right.’

“But Jerry isn’t like that. You want to be somewhere where it’s important to the people and certainly it’s a high-profile franchise without question. I just felt like those are the kind of things I look forward to. I was trying to do something at a place like that. I like them. I think they’re a good group. I think they’re passionate. I think they’re trying to be successful in the business. Hey, that’s all a coach can ask for.”

“That Seattle game … that had a real mental affect on me,” Parcells says, referring to the Cowboys’ 21-20 loss to the Seahawks in the 2006 NFC Wild Card round. “I really thought we had a chance to do something. And not only with Seattle, but Chicago the next week. I just thought we had a chance. That one beat me up a little bit.

“I was just really upset and saddened by that last game. I just didn’t want to try to do it again. I know from coaching all these years, if you’re not mentally geared up for it – it’s hard enough to do it anyway, but if you don’t get really into it, it’s impossible. I just thought enough was enough.”

 

[sean10mm]

After all this arguing over which big name they get, watch the Cowboys get some kind of Norv Turner tier guy in 2020. Or a third string McVay assistant now that his system has been exposed.

 

[Diehardblues]

Talking heads speculate as well. In fact, some like the ones on ESPN shows do more speculating than actual reporting.

It's possible that Jerry's meddling was a contributing factor, but there's simply no evidence out there that supports it. No player or ex-player that I know of has said that Parcells was frustrated with Jones. Parcells has had nothing but nice things to say, and I don't consider Parcells to be one of those guys who holds back his opinion to be polite.

These are from 2013, years removed from his time coaching the Cowboys concerning the perception of Jerry Jones:





Instead of taking that at face value, we have many on here that have to say Parcells was being disingenuous or out and out lying because that's not how they see Jones so they can't believe Parcells would actually feel that way about him.

The closest he gets to what you believe is this:



If you want to conclude from that that those things contributed to him leaving, that's your prerogative. I believe Parcells is the type who would have said it if he felt it, like his famous quote about New England: “If they want you to cook the dinner, at least they ought to let you shop for some of the groceries.”

He later came back and said both he and Kraft were too stubborn at that time. Contrast that with anything he has said about Jones and leaving the Cowboys and you don't find anything that indicates that Jones played a role in him leaving.

Yea, Ive read all of those and excerpts from his new book as well.

I really don’t recall what ESPN discussed. I follow and am more aligned with the local sports writers and media critics.

 

[glimmerman]

I don’t watch college so I have no idea about either. But they have to be better than JG. Just make sure and give me Defense and ST coaches.

 

[Dalmations202]

Here is my problem with most peoples ideas on what makes a great head coach (which is totally different than what makes a great cooridinator).
Great Head coaches -- Bill Billicheck, Jimmy Johnson, Bill Parcels, Tom Landry........(these are the ones I have paid attention to for many years) -- what made them Great?
1) Discipline -- they disciplined their teams and inspired the team to have discipline in all they did.
2) Motivation -- even though the players may have disliked the coach, they still respected them and played above the normal level of play
3) Responsibility -- each player was required to be responsible for his assignments, and his work.
4) Accountability -- All players were accountable to the coaches and their teammates and ALL (players coaches etc) held all accountable for their actions.
5) Teamwork -- none of the individual stuff -- the team either won or lost -- you are a chain, not a link

And then we had several coaches who were close, but missed on one or more of these. Wade Phillips was excellent at most of these except the discipline part which destroyed his ability to be a head coach. He is a very good coordinator though as long as he is tied to a head coach who instills discipline.

Lincoln Riley -- very good offensive mind -- can he do the discipline and accountability?
Urban Meyer -- awesome recruiter. Not sure about any of the other traits needed?
Nick Saban -- awesome recruiter. Failed in NFL though due to the traits needed to win in the NFL.

Lets grade Garrett. Discipline -- 70, Motivation -- 90, Responsibility -- 60, Accountability -- 40, Teamwork -- 60 So way too many individuals with very little accountability.

Barry Switzer came in a took over a team that had lots of discipline, was a great motivator and won a Superbowl. He didn't instill discipline and accountability though, and watched the team drop like a rock.

If Dallas wants to win consistently........they need to find a coach that has the above 5 characteristics and then make sure he gets great coordinators to build the systems needed to compete. They also need great assistants who can teach. Great teachers aren't necessarily great coordinators, and great coordinators aren't necessarily great Head Coaches.