There is only ONE condition where trading J.Jones makes sense.

[dbair1967]

Sweeet. Its the OL's fault now.

OL

Gotcha.

.

well Inman, it WAS for the most part

anyone that thinks our OL was "good" or dominant" as a unit last yr is kidding themselves

we couldnt even open holes consistently against the worst run defenses in the league when we played them (Indy, New Orleans & Philly)

David

 

[dbair1967]

Ugh, maybe because its going to be broken up anyway when Julius walks in free agency next year.

Why so many have failed to get that through their heads is beyond me.

then again if he rushes for 1100-1200+ he probably wouldnt walk next yr would he?

David

 

[dbair1967]

The run blocking this year was not very good.

end of story

David

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

He certainly didn't suck early in the Saints game ... yet received only 10 carries ... and Barber had only 2 carries for -1 yard. The defense forcing the offense to become one dimensional to play catch up in a few games hurt the running game ... Barber included towards the end. Jones also didn't start the playoff game vs. Seattle on fire ... but got better as the game progressed, particularly after he got into the altercation.

Your like talking to a wall. You can babble about a Saints game where he never got more carries because we were getting blown out and you can talk about a Seattle game in which my stats subsume but your whole point is that he gets better with more carries. However when you look at the stats there is one thing that becoimes very clear even when you include that Seattle game:

HIS YPC FOR CARRIES 15+ IN A GAME IS 3.5 WHICH IS ABSOLUTELY GODAWFUL

If he needed more carries to get production than that stat would be good because he would depend on those later carries to get his yardage up. This is not the case and you ignoring this point and babbling about the Seattle game or wholistic stats or fatigue or whatever nonsense changes nothing. Could you imagine how awful that stat would be if it wasnt for the Seattle game?

Hes not a closer nor a workhorse. Hes a guy that you want to give the ball to about 10 times a game between the twenties.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

then again if he rushes for 1100-1200+ he probably wouldnt walk next yr would he?

David

fantasy land is nice but the fact of the matter is that runningbacks become less durable over time not moreso. His first two years he was getting hurt and last year he went into the toilet after 150 carries.

You can stick your head in the sand but that was the same offensive line and coaching staff were with him when he was putting up 122 yards against the Titan in week 4 as it was when he was putting up 26 yards against Atlanta in week 15.

He is what he is and that is not a starting tailback in the NFL.

 

[Woods]

So, exactly who in the Draft/FA would you guys upgrade with J Jones?

Peterson? Well, I don't think we're getting him.

Lynch? Maybe he drops to us, but teams like GB will have serious interest. Also, are we all sure that Lynch is an upgrade over JJ?

After that, there's no one else in the Draft who I'd consider having a HIGH probability outperforming JJ.


O.K., what about FA?

I can't think of any back available right now who would be a definite upgrade over JJ. Anyone else with serious suggestions?

The only way I can see possibly upgrading JJ would be to trade up in the Draft and try to get Lynch. Lynch would be the most doable target, IMO. I don't think we have sufficent fire power to get Peterson (unless we just give up a boat load of picks, which I wouldn't want to do).

So, that begs the question, do you guys think Lynch is a definite upgrade over JJ? And do you want to possibly trade up to get him?

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

So, exactly who in the Draft/FA would you guys upgrade with J Jones?

Peterson? Well, I don't think we're getting him.

Lynch? Maybe he drops to us, but teams like GB will have serious interest. Also, are we all sure that Lynch is an upgrade over JJ?

After that, there's no one else in the Draft who I'd consider having a HIGH probability outperforming JJ.


O.K., what about FA?

I can't think of any back available right now who would be a definite upgrade over JJ. Anyone else with serious suggestions?

The only way I can see possibly upgrading JJ would be to trade up in the Draft and try to get Lynch. Lynch would be the most doable target, IMO. I don't think we have sufficent fire power to get Peterson (unless we just give up a boat load of picks, which I wouldn't want to do).

So, that begs the question, do you guys think Lynch is a definite upgrade over JJ? And do you want to possibly trade up to get him?

Why not pick up a Lynch or Bush and keep Jones and use him as a change of pace back? Its what he is perfect for.

 

[Woods]

Why not pick up a Lynch or Bush and keep Jones and use him as a change of pace back? Its what he is perfect for.

The stuff I'm reading on Bush states, for example, "Would be best playing closer to 230 pounds, but his inability to control his weight and durability issues - perhaps closely related - have kept him from realizing his potential. Needs to adhere to a strict nutrition regimen, show more discipline and get healthy." That's from Profootball Weekly 2007 Draft Guide. I'm not sure if Bush is a HIGH probability of being better (or as good as) JJ.

Lynch seems interesting. But I'll just add, that according to PFW, " .... Lynch has never shown he can be a featured back, and much like the Cowboys 2004 second-rounder Julius Jones, he could struggle staying healthy, even in a two-back system. A highlight tape could be deceiving."

That said, Lynch does appear to be a 3-down back, has had good production in college, etc. I guess if the coaching staff was definitely looking to upgrade JJ, the best realistic bet would be Lynch - though not a sure thing as an upgrade.

My preference is unless I get a 2nd rounder for JJ and I thought that Lynch was a clear upgrade (meaning I'll have to possibly use that 2nd rounder to trade up for Lynch), I'd rather just keep JJ this year.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The stuff I'm reading on Bush states, for example, "Would be best playing closer to 230 pounds, but his inability to control his weight and durability issues - perhaps closely related - have kept him from realizing his potential. Needs to adhere to a strict nutrition regimen, show more discipline and get healthy." That's from Profootball Weekly 2007 Draft Guide. I'm not sure if Bush is a HIGH probability of being better (or as good as) JJ.

Lynch seems interesting. But I'll just add, that according to PFW, " .... Lynch has never shown he can be a featured back, and much like the Cowboys 2004 second-rounder Julius Jones, he could struggle staying healthy, even in a two-back system. A highlight tape could be deceiving."

That said, Lynch does appear to be a 3-down back, has had good production in college, etc. I guess if the coaching staff was definitely looking to upgrade JJ, the best realistic bet would be Lynch - though not a sure thing as an upgrade.

My preference is unless I get a 2nd rounder for JJ and I thought that Lynch was a clear upgrade (meaning I'll have to possibly use that 2nd rounder to trade up for Lynch), I'd rather just keep JJ this year.

ILynch may fall to us you never know. Or Bush in the second. If we could have our cake and eat it too that would be really nice.

 

[Clove]

This is what we know about JJ. He doesn't break tackles very well - you can usually get him down on 1st contact.

Don't know if he can catch or not, because it seems like they never really threw him the ball.
He doesn't look for the secondary hole, or run to daylight, and this may be because of how BP wanted him to run.

POINT:
Give him a year under WP oline and philosophy, and then I will know for a fact if he's worth keeping or not. On the other hand, I wouldn't shed a tear if they traded him.

 

[burmafrd]

Its always instructive to see who has the most posts in any thread like this. Then you can track the agenda's.

 

[the kid 05]

Why are you getting all bent out of shape about me calling J.Jones a Journeyman, as if that's a bad label to have? It's not, and I never said Jones was bad; I said he is upgradable, and he IS - because he IS a journeyman until he proves otherwise. Why? Because aside from being injured too often, he went out and claimed that he would get over 1,000 yards two seasons ago, only to fall short. And on top of that, when he was offered for trade in last year's draft there were no takers. Why? Because teams don't value RBs that can't manage at least 1,000 yards. But now that J.Jones finally got his 1,000 yards, perhaps Dallas can now find someone to trade with, provide the trade would be a smart business move.

**

season and then failed ot reach that mark, only to

everyone is upgradable. Its not how you deal the cards with you were dealt in life, but how you play your hands.

 

[Doomsday101]

This is what we know about JJ. He doesn't break tackles very well - you can usually get him down on 1st contact.

Don't know if he can catch or not, because it seems like they never really threw him the ball.
He doesn't look for the secondary hole, or run to daylight, and this may be because of how BP wanted him to run.

POINT:
Give him a year under WP oline and philosophy, and then I will know for a fact if he's worth keeping or not. On the other hand, I wouldn't shed a tear if they traded him.

I agree with except for the part Parcells wanted him to run that way. Parcells got after him early on about holding on to the ball but I have seen many former running backs of Parcells who seem to do just fine finding the hold and running to daylight including Barber. In my opinion this is on Jones he is getting the same holes that Barber get but is not getting the consistent production

 

[flashback]

None of the backs on our roster is a lock for a 5 yard average or a 1500 yard season. I was waiting all year last year for the light to come on for JJ last year, but he kept running right into Colombo's *** instead of bouncing it outside or cutting upfield. Sure, some of that is on the OL, but there are lots of other backs who don't run into their own offensive lineman all day long, even when their offensive lineman aren't that good.

I don't think there's very much drop off from a Jones/Barber rotation to a Barber/Thompson rotation. Thompson hasn't proven he can be a 3rd down back yet, but you could give him every 3rd series, or bring him in as a change of pace late in games to spell Barber. The Cowboys had 1969 rushing yards last year, and I just don't see that total as special. They should be able to hit that again whether Jones is on the squad or not.

The problem with keeping him is that we invested a 2nd in him, and if he hits FA after this season, I don't think the Cowboys will be able to afford him. The problem with trading him is who's going to give you what he's worth? I would take a 3rd round pick in 2007 or a 2nd rounder in 2008 for him right now. Pick up a Michael Wiley/Aveion Cason type guy in the draft and see if he can play some 3rd downs. And let Barber and Thompson duke it out for the starting job.

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

I believe that the best scenario for Dallas is for Jones to be traded for LaDanian Tomlinson.

 

[conner01]

i think jones is a decent rb. not a super star but with mb3 they make a good combo.the problem is he is a f.a. next year.but if you trade him you would need to use the pick you got for him to replace him or you will miss the chance to get some good oline help in the 2nd. we ain't trading up for ap, thats a pipe dream.i think the smart move would be see if you can extend him now for a reasonable deal. if not then trading him might make since as opposed to loosing him.
what will he bring is a big question. a 3rd? i don't know if you could get a 2nd for him but that would be a good deal if you could as opposed to getting nothing next year.
but before i did all that i would get a feel for what it would take to extend him. it might not be a high as you think to get a short term deal that works for him and us. he gets a shot a f.a. in a couple of years and a chance in a new system to show he is worth big money on the market

 

[DBoys]

I think JJ is playing to heavy right now. He should slim down get closer to his rookie season weight. BP turned him into a bulky pound it back and that is not what he is. He is a speed guy with shifty moves kind like LT just not as good.

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

Its always instructive to see who has the most posts in any thread like this. Then you can track the agenda's.

Get a life!!!

 

[GimmeTheBall!]

This is what we know about JJ. He doesn't break tackles very well - you can usually get him down on 1st contact.

Don't know if he can catch or not, because it seems like they never really threw him the ball.
He doesn't look for the secondary hole, or run to daylight, and this may be because of how BP wanted him to run.

POINT:
Give him a year under WP oline and philosophy, and then I will know for a fact if he's worth keeping or not. On the other hand, I wouldn't shed a tear if they traded him.

Let me make a coupla points:
Some really are pining for Lynch. Even if Lynch falls that far or if we trade up . . . why????

I am thinking we have more pressing needs in the draft, i.e. O line, safety, corners, a QB (yeah, Johnson is like a hundred years old), etc.

But let's say we, in some strange scenario, land Lynch. And whadda we have? A project who may or may not turn out as good as JJ in a couple of years.
Are we so smitten with Barber and so dissatisfied with JJ that we'd turn out a talent like JJ for next to nothing?

Yeah, let's see how well JJ does under WP's scheme.
Let's see how Barber and JJ and Thompson do during the camps.
Most important, let's see how JJ does during the season before hyperventilating and getting rid of him for a 4th.

 

[mmillman]

deal him and some picks to move up in the draft to get the RB they want. It would take a mega deal to get Peterson, but he is the best back this year and would be the homerun threat Dallas needs in the backfield.

Fast forward to next year if Jones is not traded. Owens will be 35 and Glenn 36 and Barber will be the number 1 back as Jones will be a free agent. Glenn retires and Owens is let go and there is no speed left on the team.