Tom Brady suspension nullified

[Manwiththeplan]

In the actual Court ruling the Judge Admits that Brady "probably" had a part in it, however it doesn't warrant a 4 game suspension?

Anyone capable of independent thought should come to the conclusion that Brady had something to do with it. But, was there sufficient evidence to say he definitely did it? And does it warrant a 4 game suspension? If any other QB did this, I don't think they get 4 games. Past incidents by the Patriots organization, that Tom Brady wasn't a part of (benefited, but no reason to say he was a part of) played a role in his punishment.

 

[khiladi]

I think that's quite a stretch because the end result here is the NFL and Goodell is totally embarrassed again. This after being dealt blows in the Peterson and Rice cases.

What you are saying is they basically sabotaged their own case by holding back damning evidence and were willing to risk looking incompetent, yet again.

Unless it implicated the Patriots as a whole, including Bellichek.. It's not as if the league wanted the scandal out in the open anyways. The problem is the public became aware of it right after the game, because of tweets of reporters that said something was up during half-time.

Everybody on offense holds the football, not just Brady. And Bellichek supposedly even muddies balls in practice so the players would emphasize ball protection.

 

[LandryFan]

The drive of this and similar threads for this entire year is those that believe the Patriots are systematic cheaters.

Long ago, the commissioner should have investigated this to settle that question....frankly I think many of you DO NOT WANT such a proposed investigation, as deep down inside many of the Hatriots fear the conclusion would give them the credibility of Flat Earth proponents. Back to my suggested investigation.

Hundreds of players, coaches, other staff have worked for the New England Patriots since 2000. Someone is going to be disgruntled. Get someone to talk and spill the beans. The way some of you talk, some should have already written a book and be on a circuit disclosing things like Patriots:

• Film opponents during games (that's documented, but it's this only one on this list)
• Footballs are tampered with.
• Locker rooms are bugged.
• Visiting teams phones are bugged.
• The lighting at Gillette Stadium is altered for advantage
• The surface at Gillette Stadium is tampered for advantage
• Visiting teams get an abnormal amount of distractions
  • (phone calls,
  • messages,
  • prostitutes knocking,....)
• Hidden cams at Gillette Stadium.
• etc
• etc

For eight months, many talk as if my list above is fact.

Why has nobody come forward and come up with such a list? Not even Eric Mancini?

Many of you swear it's true so reveal it. Do better than childishly repeat grade school hate or give a lame "The Mafia is keeping this silent"


If I get this boatload of facts against the Patriots, I'll believe you - just like when Lance Armstrong was outed.

Don't know about all of that, but I am curious as to why no one has questioned the two equipment guys involved in deflategate. The problem NE has is they were caught cheating before so now people are hesitant to give them benefit of the doubt...right or wrong, they have kind of brought this on themselves. As for you questioning the credibility of some posters on here ("Hatriots"), the credibility of certain Pats/Brady apologists is just as much in question...

 

[khiladi]

Or how the NFLPA as allowed them to do so. The NFLPA has had many opportunities to fight to change the system and refuse to do so.

That to me is the kicker. Look at how they handled Bounty-gate...

 

[TwentyOne]

Heard it in NFL Radio just now. They got it per the AP.

Cheats never prosper.


Or, wait .......


Ring, Ring, Ring, Ring.

That wasn't the phone, was it ?

SHOW ME THE MONEY!!!!!!

 

[Tabascocat]

 

[BringBackThatOleTimeBoys]

Don't know about all of that, but I am curious as to why no one has questioned the two equipment guys involved in deflategate. The problem NE has is they were caught cheating before so now people are hesitant to give them benefit of the doubt...right or wrong, they have kind of brought this on themselves. As for you questioning the credibility of some posters on here ("Hatriots"), the credibility of certain Pats/Brady apologists is just as much in question...

I just want this mysterious cheating operation exposed that some have wasted a large amount of this year swearing goes on in Foxboro.

 

[casmith07]

Quite honestly, after the beatings that Goodell/the NFL have taken in court of late (not to mention the PR beatings), I have a difficult time believing that the league will care to keep the current system. I don't know much about much, but to me, the smartest thing the league could do would be to "bargain away" the current punishment/appeals process. At least they could save a little face that way and maybe get something in return.

I've been working on a project concerning how I think the system should work. It's really not that hard, and pretty similar to what they have in place now. They just need help that they aren't getting from their current legal advisors.

 

[slick325]

true and Roger Robespierre doesn't care about process. I am glad that he took another hit but it is also clear to me that Brady is guilty as charged.

I do believe that Brady had knowledge of the footballs being deflated. However, notice of discipline; the arbitrator not dispensing his/her own brand of industrial justice; and impartiality of the arbitrator far outweigh the players guilt or innocence.

 

[LandryFan]

I just want this mysterious cheating operation exposed that some have wasted a large amount of this year swearing goes on in Foxboro.

My point was and is that the truth likely lies somewhere in the middle. Have the Pats cheated in the past? Yes. Did they purposely deflate footballs? Very likely. Did they do all the other stuff some have claimed? I doubt it. Honestly, I'd just like for the truth to be told regardless of what it is. My opinion is that the two equipment guys are the holders of the truth but for some reason, outside of one very brief stint with Wells, have never been made available.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I've been working on a project concerning how I think the system should work. It's really not that hard, and pretty similar to what they have in place now. They just need help that they aren't getting from their current legal advisors.

it's actually really simple. have an independent arbitrator that is not hired by the league or nflpa, but by both of them. have 3 and make it a panel if you want, make it so they can not be fired or replaced because of the decisions they make.

 

[LandryFan]

I've been working on a project concerning how I think the system should work. It's really not that hard, and pretty similar to what they have in place now. They just need help that they aren't getting from their current legal advisors.

Ya think??? lol

 

[Nightman]

The judge sounds like he partly retried the case and partly decided on past precedence and partly decided on prior notice or as I can read.....................just made it all up

The CBA is ususally a very strong instrument. It appears the judge just threw that aside. If I am Hardy I am flying to NY and appealing in Judge Berman's court.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

The CBA is ususally a very strong instrument. It appears the judge just threw that aside. If I am Hardy I am flying to NY and appealing in Judge Berman's court.

No, he just took the CBA at face value. Unless I'm mistake, there is no clause in the CBA that gives the commissioner complete control over any and everything that is not specifically mentioned in the CBA. Which is basically what Goodell does, CBA doesn't say I can't, so **** it I will or CBA says I have to do this, but **** it, I'll call domestic violence conduct detrimental to the league....GOT EM!

 

[Nightman]

No, he just took the CBA at face value. Unless I'm mistake, there is no clause in the CBA that gives the commissioner complete control over any and everything that is not specifically mentioned in the CBA. Which is basically what Goodell does, CBA doesn't say I can't, so **** it I will or CBA says I have to do this, but **** it, I'll call domestic violence conduct detrimental to the league....GOT EM!

A 4 games suspension isn't outrageous for cheating. That is what was lost in all this.

Oscan got 4 games for popping a Molly while on vacation in Mexico in March.

What is the commissioner's job if it isn't over seeing punishment and rules violations?

 

[Manwiththeplan]

A 4 games suspension isn't outrageous for cheating. That is what was lost in all this.

Oscan got 4 games for popping a Molly while on vacation in Mexico in March.

What is the commissioner's job if it isn't over seeing punishment and rules violations?

Reduced to 2 games btw.

But fwiw, I don't think 4 games is outrageous, what I think is outrageous is the burden of proof Goodell needed in order reach this decision.

The NFLPA may have waived the right to an independent arbitrator, but they did not waive the right to a fair process.

 

[slick325]

The judge sounds like he partly retried the case and partly decided on past precedence and partly decided on prior notice or as I can read.....................just made it all up

The CBA is ususally a very strong instrument. It appears the judge just threw that aside. If I am Hardy I am flying to NY and appealing in Judge Berman's court.

I respectfully disagree bkight13. The Judge's decision states clearly in reference to notice: "When it is clear that the arbitrator 'must have based his award on some body of thought, or feeling, or policy, or law that is outside the contract and not incorporated in it by reference...the arbitrator has failed to draw the award from the essence of the collective bargaining agreement." In re Marine Pollution Serv., Inc. 857 F.2d 91, 94 (2d Cir. 1988). The Judge's decision is based on the CBA and is based on the premise that "it is the 'law of the shop' to provide professional football players with advance notice of prohibited conduct and potential discipline." In re Matter of Reggie Langhorne

The Judge cited several pieces of pertinent case law as it related to the CBA and arbitration.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I really don't understand the melodramatic "this is not good for football" posts.

Why?

In the end, we are talking about such a minor infraction in ball deflating.

Well, It's not minor. It makes a difference, with regards to air pressure in a Football. There is no question about this. I know this first hand. Secondly, he and the Pats are guilty and I don't think anybody really questions that. That's not a good thing and I don't see it as melodramatic.

 

[KJJ]

Another loss for the NFL. Hardy should've appealed weeks ago.

Hardy's suspension has to do with domestic violence not deflating footballs he was lucky to have his suspension reduced.

 

[Sydla]

Well, It's not minor. It makes a difference, with regards to air pressure in a Football. There is no question about this. I know this first hand. Secondly, he and the Pats are guilty and I don't think anybody really questions that. That's not a good thing and I don't see it as melodramatic.

It actually is quite minor. So he likes lower deflated balls. Rodgers likes overinflated balls. Teams have tampered with balls in the past.

There are no studies that shown conclusive evidence that the inflation levels of balls has a significant effect on the outcome of a game. It's just a matter of preference or feel, like how one guy might like a shorter spike than another guy. Or one guy likes a slick ball and one likes a scuffed ball.

Plain and simple, this is because it's Brady and the Pats. That's what stirs this drink. If Alex Smith in KC was accused of this, this thing would have blown over 3 months ago.

I don't see how a guy playing with the deflation levels of the balls is somehow now bad for football, like it's going to hurt the product or level of interest or hurt the image of the sport. If all the women beaters, and thieves, and rapists and whatever haven't hurt the NFL in the grand scheme of things, a guy deflating a football certainly won't.

This is like Spygate, another incident that was supposed to be really bad for football. Somehow, the league and sport survived.