Top 10 NBA PGs of all time

[Biggems]

PG IMHO
1980 on.

1.) Magic Johnson -- Size changed the way the game has been played. Ability to pass over people led to fast break. Father of position-less basketball.
2.) Isiah Thomas -- Toughest, meanest little dude on list. Pressured ball relentlessly and scored. Competed 100% all the time.
3.) John Stockton -- Insane IQ and passing acumen plus dead eye shooter from range. Better defender than credited.
4.) Steph Curry -- Most skilled player in history of the league. Has to work on that defensive end.
5.) Jason Kidd -- Best Magic clone. Fast break specialist who would rebound and defend. Great post up PG.
6.) Russell Westbrook -- Best pure athlete on this list. Still getting better. Can score, defend, rebound, post up, fly and shoot it.
7.) Steve Nash -- Was Curry before Curry. Defense was worst on this list but Nash did everything else very, very well.
8.) Gary Payton -- Created more pressure than anyone ever had on ball handlers. Game changer with defense and intensity.
9.) Tony Parker -- Simply wins. Scores when needed to win, pushes pace when needed to win, passes when needed to win.
10.) Kevin Johnson -- Tough hard-nosed hybrid PG that scored and defended well.

notable omissions
Chris Paul. Arguably as high as 6 or 7 on this list but I am so over his over-rating that I have to grade him versus his peers in wins and he lacks there. Small. quick player whose ever only really excelled in the 2 man game.
Stevie Franchise. Great scorer but efficiency was up and down then just down.
Gilbert Arenas. Agent 0 was white hot with scoring but his flame burned out too quickly.
AI. Arguably most fun to watch of anyone but he was a 1 man show and not a PG.

 

[Biggems]

PG IMHO
1980 on.

1.) Magic Johnson -- Size changed the way the game has been played. Ability to pass over people led to fast break. Father of position-less basketball.
2.) Isiah Thomas -- Toughest, meanest little dude on list. Pressured ball relentlessly and scored. Competed 100% all the time.
3.) John Stockton -- Insane IQ and passing acumen plus dead eye shooter from range. Better defender than credited.
4.) Steph Curry -- Most skilled player in history of the league. Has to work on that defensive end.
5.) Jason Kidd -- Best Magic clone. Fast break specialist who would rebound and defend. Great post up PG.
6.) Russell Westbrook -- Best pure athlete on this list. Still getting better. Can score, defend, rebound, post up, fly and shoot it.
7.) Steve Nash -- Was Curry before Curry. Defense was worst on this list but Nash did everything else very, very well.
8.) Gary Payton -- Created more pressure than anyone ever had on ball handlers. Game changer with defense and intensity.
9.) Tony Parker -- Simply wins. Scores when needed to win, pushes pace when needed to win, passes when needed to win.
10.) Kevin Johnson -- Tough hard-nosed hybrid PG that scored and defended well.

notable omissions
Chris Paul. Arguably as high as 6 or 7 on this list but I am so over his over-rating that I have to grade him versus his peers in wins and he lacks there. Small. quick player whose ever only really excelled in the 2 man game.
Stevie Franchise. Great scorer but efficiency was up and down then just down.
Gilbert Arenas. Agent 0 was white hot with scoring but his flame burned out too quickly.
AI. Arguably most fun to watch of anyone but he was a 1 man show and not a PG.

As a Spurs homer, I tried to be subjective, and so I didn't put Tony on the list, although, he definitely deserves to be there, and I am talking about the all-time list. I will not put him in the top 5, but he is definitely somewhere between 6-10.

My top 5 in no particular order

Magic Johnson
Isiah Thomas
John Stockton
Oscar Robertson
Bob Cousy

That means in the next 5

Tony Parker
Jason Kidd
Steve Nash
Gary Payton
Russell Westbrook

 

[Biggems]

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/nbarankPFs/ranking-greatest-power-forwards-nba-history

Pretty much the only list remaining is center. PF will be done today at 2:30pm, but they have released 10-3 and 1-2 are obvious.

10.) Dennis Rodmon
9.) Pau Gasol
8.) Elvin Hayes
7.) Bob Petit
6.) Kevin McHale
5.) Kevin Garnett
4.) Charles Barkley
3.) Dirk Nowitzki
2.) Karl Malone
1.) Tim Duncan

Not a bad list, I don't put too much thought into guys that long before my time, so Hayes and Petit are where they are, but I would say I disagree with #3, #4 and #5. Kevin Garnett imo, has a better argument for #2 than Dirk or Barkley have for #3. He was just too good offensively and defensively for me to rank Dirk or Barkley ahead. I'd likely stick with Dirk ahead of Barkley even though Barkley was a much stronger rebounder and presented problems for opposing defenses in a different yet also unique way, but I can't put either over KG.

IMO, McHale has to be ahead of Garnett. I am cool with the top 4. McHale is 5. As great as Garnett was, he never took the role as THE MAN in crunch time. For 3 quarters, he would do his thing, but come the 4th q, he would shrivel. McHale, never shriveled.

Also, I consider Gasol a C. If he is a PF, I still put Rodman above him. Rodman is the best defensive PF of all-time.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

IMO, McHale has to be ahead of Garnett. I am cool with the top 4. McHale is 5. As great as Garnett was, he never took the role as THE MAN in crunch time. For 3 quarters, he would do his thing, but come the 4th q, he would shrivel. McHale, never shriveled.

Also, I consider Gasol a C. If he is a PF, I still put Rodman above him. Rodman is the best defensive PF of all-time.

McHale played second fiddle to Bird, and for several years wasn't a starter

 

[Manwiththeplan]

As a Spurs homer, I tried to be subjective, and so I didn't put Tony on the list, although, he definitely deserves to be there, and I am talking about the all-time list. I will not put him in the top 5, but he is definitely somewhere between 6-10.

My top 5 in no particular order

Magic Johnson
Isiah Thomas
John Stockton
Oscar Robertson
Bob Cousy

That means in the next 5

Tony Parker
Jason Kidd
Steve Nash
Gary Payton
Russell Westbrook

If you want to say Curry doesn't belong on the list because he's too early in his career, that's fine. But I would love to hear your rationale behind putting Westbrook over Curry

 

[Manwiththeplan]

My quick stab at the top centers, I may forget/leave off a few pre 1980s centers, but I'm guessing only 2 maybe 3 make the list.

1.) Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
2.) Hakeem Olajuwon (I'd rank 1, but Kareem will be #1)
3.) Shaquille O'Neal
4.) Bill Russell
5.) Wilt Chamberlain
6.) Mosses Malone
7.) David Robinson
8.) Patrick Ewing
9.) George Mikan (career too short and played in an era without much competition)
10.) Bill Walton (spend too much time injured to be on list)

 

[Biggems]

If you want to say Curry doesn't belong on the list because he's too early in his career, that's fine. But I would love to hear your rationale behind putting Westbrook over Curry

Westbrook is a complete player. He does it on both ends and is practically a walking triple double. I can't stand the guy, but he is damn good. Curry is the best pure shooter in the league, and a good passer, but defensively he cannot hold a candle to Westbrook.

BTW, I forgot all about Frazier. I would remove Westbrook and put Frazier on the list.

Other PGs just outside the top 10........Kevin Johnson, Mark Jackson, Terry Porter, Mo Cheeks, Doc Rivers, Dennis Johnson, Chris Paul, Steph Curry, and Westbrook.

3 players who could have made a run at the top 10, but injuries or illness.......Johnny Moore, Mark Price, and Derrick Rose

 

[Manwiththeplan]

Westbrook is a complete player. He does it on both ends and is practically a walking triple double. I can't stand the guy, but he is damn good. Curry is the best pure shooter in the league, and a good passer, but defensively he cannot hold a candle to Westbrook.

BTW, I forgot all about Frazier. I would remove Westbrook and put Frazier on the list.

Other PGs just outside the top 10........Kevin Johnson, Mark Jackson, Terry Porter, Mo Cheeks, Doc Rivers, Dennis Johnson, Chris Paul, Steph Curry, and Westbrook.

3 players who could have made a run at the top 10, but injuries or illness.......Johnny Moore, Mark Price, and Derrick Rose

Westbrook is certainly better defensively, but Curry is in another league offensively due to his efficiency as a shooter, not to mention winning a league MVP and an NBA title carries enough weight to bump him past Westbrook. Not even going to get into Tony Parker, but I'll just say you failed at not being a Spurs homer.

 

[Biggems]

My quick stab at the top centers, I may forget/leave off a few pre 1980s centers, but I'm guessing only 2 maybe 3 make the list.

1.) Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
2.) Hakeem Olajuwon (I'd rank 1, but Kareem will be #1)
3.) Shaquille O'Neal
4.) Bill Russell
5.) Wilt Chamberlain
6.) Mosses Malone
7.) David Robinson
8.) Patrick Ewing
9.) George Mikan (career too short and played in an era without much competition)
10.) Bill Walton (spend too much time injured to be on list)

As g

Westbrook is certainly better defensively, but Curry is in another league offensively due to his efficiency as a shooter, not to mention winning a league MVP and an NBA title carries enough weight to bump him past Westbrook. Not even going to get into Tony Parker, but I'll just say you failed at not being a Spurs homer.

Parker has 4 NBA titles and a Finals MVP. He is the Spurs all time assist leader. He was their leading scorer for a few years. Head to head, Parker usually wins or offsets the other PGs. He has the greatest winning % of any PG in NBA history.

Parker deserves to be in the top 10.

Also, Curry got lucky last year. His two biggest threats for the title, were either eliminated or severely wounded. The Spurs and the healthy Cavs team would have abused the Warriors.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

Parker has 4 NBA titles and a Finals MVP. He is the Spurs all time assist leader. He was their leading scorer for a few years. Head to head, Parker usually wins or offsets the other PGs. He has the greatest winning % of any PG in NBA history.

Also played his entire career with a top 5-10 all time great in Tim Duncan and a guy most would say is a top 5 or even top 2-3 coach of all time in Popovich. Add on to that other guys like Manu Ginobili and Kawhi Leonard. Hard to make a rational argument that the Spurs would have any less success with Kevin Johnson, Chris Paul, Jason Kidd, Gary Payton, Russell Westbrook, Steph Curry or any other PG who you rank behind Parker.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Westbrook is not a good defender.

 

[Bay10]

Magic Johnson is by far the best pg in nba history.

 

[Bay10]

John Stockton was the **** but Magic is the best pg ever. To me, Magic is the best best pound for pound player I have ever watched.

 

[Bay10]

Magic vs Bird in the 80's was unreal.

 

[Biggems]

Westbrook is not a good defender.

when compared to Curry, he most definitely is.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

when compared to Curry, he most definitely is.

still doesn't make him a good defender

he has the tools to be a good defender.

the guard position is the most poorly guarded position in the nba imo.

 

[jterrell]

For starters, it's one series, three games. Second, KG avereged 24 ppg, 18.7 rpg 5 apg 1.7 bpg and 1.7 spg vs Dirk's 33.3 ppg, 15.7, 0.6 apg, 1.3 bpg and 2 spg, looks to me like both played great, and Dirk just had a better team. Unless you're suggesting switching the two players would have resulted in a different outcome.

Dirk and KG guarded each other and KG was supposed to be the best defender in the league. Dirk roasted him for 33 PER GAME. 24 per game is nice... 33 per game is insane.
If you think those lines are similar you are simply wrong. Combined Steals and blocks were a dead heat and Dirk scored just under 10 more per game.

... and Yes switching the players would have seriously altered the outcome.
Again, it's cool to chat but I actually WATCHED that series. It wasn't even close as to was the dominant player.
Dirk oculd score every time down in late 4th quarters insuring the Mavs won.
He did the same versus the Thunder and Heat in 2011. That was KD and LeBron if you are scoring at home.

Dirk was easily the better player and is ranked as such here.
The only better PF IMHO in history is Tim Duncan abd Dirk played him a stalemate a lot of their careers.
Malone schooled Dirk but Dirk was all of 19 then. Malone never own a title much less won a title and NBA finals MVP award the same season.

 

[jterrell]

Westbrook is not a good defender.

Westbrook is a great defender and also a terrible one... his issue is consistency.
He leads the league in steals and points off steals by a fair margin.
He is plus defender even with his lapses.

Curry is not athletic enough to be a great defender and simpyl won't be. Westbrook is not focused enough so is at times and could develop into one.

Curry is the better player because his offensive efficency is Dirk-like but Westbrook has one of the highest upsides in the history of the game. Kept Harden on the bench for years and repalced all of KDs scoring when he was out injured.

 

[RonSpringsdaman20]

Westbrook is a great defender and also a terrible one... his issue is consistency.
He leads the league in steals and points off steals by a fair margin.
He is plus defender even with his lapses.

Curry is not athletic enough to be a great defender and simpyl won't be. Westbrook is not focused enough so is at times and could develop into one.

Curry is the better player because his offensive efficency is Dirk-like but Westbrook has one of the highest upsides in the history of the game. Kept Harden on the bench for years and repalced all of KDs scoring when he was out injured.

you can't be both... he's not a sound defender... he's athletic, and quick, can cause problems in the passing lanes... (AI did that)... but sticking to his man, forcing him to the help, pressuring him... westbrook falls asleep at the wheel sometimes...

he's an average defender in my eyes... too many opposing guards put up numbers to call him a great defender.

 

[jimmy40]

not enough love for Walt Frazier