Trading up (early) has few success stories

[Galian Beast]

Doing a little bit of research (certainly not exhaustive), I've yet to see a team have a true success story where a franchise player that they traded up into the top 5 or 10 has catapulted them into the super bowl. The results are almost always the opposite.

The 2012 trade up for Morris Claiborne certainly set this team back. With our original pick we could have drafted Michael Brockers, Bruce Irvin, Quinton Coples, Dre Kirkpatrick and with the 45th pick in the draft we could have gotten Alshon Jeffery, Bobby Wagner, Peter Konz, Vinny Curry. The names aren't so important as this isn't an exercise in hindsight, rather a general lesson about value.

We're going to have a late first round draft pick, but we can get a valuable player there. It might not be in the position we most have a need for (Defensive End), but it could be a very valuable player at any position on this team. By not reaching we can make the best of this player.

It's okay to move up a couple spots to get a guy that you want and another team is likely to draft, but trading up into the top 5 and top 10 looks like a history of disaster.

We put all our eggs into Morris Claiborne thinking he was the next Revis, and he didn't even turn out to be a starting quality cornerback. Trading up is entirely too dangerous (more so at some positions than others).

When Romo's time is done, we might have ourselves a roster that would afford us to make a trade up for a QB early in the draft. On that point also let me reiterate that drafting a QB at all at this point would take away from this team's ability to win a super bowl.

 

[Risen Star]

I don't care who you are, you're going to miss on draft picks. It's like hitting a baseball. You need as many at bats as you can get. When you start packaging picks, particularly early picks, it's very high risk.

But the thing with the Claiborne trade that some still don't get is that it couldn't have succeeded. Even if he was one of the best cornerbacks in the league he wasn't worth that price. He wouldn't be an impact player.

It was destined to fail from the start. The Cowboys will either understand this or risk living it once again.

 

[yimyammer]

I heard they never even interviewed the guy and just jumped on it because the "value" the Rams were willing to give them

If true, thats the worst kind of laziness and incompetence.

I hope this lesson resonates within the organization for 100 years

 

[Galian Beast]

I don't care who you are, you're going to miss on draft picks. It's like hitting a baseball. You need as many at bats as you can get. When you start packaging picks, particularly early picks, it's very high risk.

But the thing with the Claiborne trade that some still don't get is that it couldn't have succeeded. Even if he was one of the best cornerbacks in the league he wasn't worth that price. He wouldn't be an impact player.

It was destined to fail from the start. The Cowboys will either understand this or risk living it once again.

I'm not sure that is true. If Claiborne was Revis or Asomugha quality, I think the trade would have been a success.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Why are we referencing the Claiborne trade when the Bryant and Jenkins trades are much more relevant to our draft position

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Using the Super Bowl as a barometer is silly. 32 teams. 1 champion.

 

[Risen Star]

I'm not sure that is true. If Claiborne was Revis or Asomugha quality, I think the trade would have been a success.

~opening up a window~

 

[Galian Beast]

~opening up a window~

?

 

[Jenky]

I'm not sure that is true. If Claiborne was Revis or Asomugha quality, I think the trade would have been a success.

He's saying a cornerback isn't worth a 1st and a 2nd no matter what. He's partially right. Revis didn't even yield that in his trade to the Bucs. It's also such a small chance for a prospect to match the caliber of a guy like Revis, it isn't even worth making the trade.

The odds are just against you.

 

[xwalker]

Doing a little bit of research (certainly not exhaustive), I've yet to see a team have a true success story where a franchise player that they traded up into the top 5 or 10 has catapulted them into the super bowl. The results are almost always the opposite.

The 2012 trade up for Morris Claiborne certainly set this team back. With our original pick we could have drafted Michael Brockers, Bruce Irvin, Quinton Coples, Dre Kirkpatrick and with the 45th pick in the draft we could have gotten Alshon Jeffery, Bobby Wagner, Peter Konz, Vinny Curry. The names aren't so important as this isn't an exercise in hindsight, rather a general lesson about value.

We're going to have a late first round draft pick, but we can get a valuable player there. It might not be in the position we most have a need for (Defensive End), but it could be a very valuable player at any position on this team. By not reaching we can make the best of this player.

It's okay to move up a couple spots to get a guy that you want and another team is likely to draft, but trading up into the top 5 and top 10 looks like a history of disaster.

We put all our eggs into Morris Claiborne thinking he was the next Revis, and he didn't even turn out to be a starting quality cornerback. Trading up is entirely too dangerous (more so at some positions than others).

When Romo's time is done, we might have ourselves a roster that would afford us to make a trade up for a QB early in the draft. On that point also let me reiterate that drafting a QB at all at this point would take away from this team's ability to win a super bowl.

I was expecting to see some research to prove your point, but you're just rehashing old news with no new insight.

 

[darthseinfeld]

There is no way we are trading up to top 5 or top 10

 

[Toruk_Makto]

He's saying a cornerback isn't worth a 1st and a 2nd no matter what. He's partially right. Revis didn't even yield that in his trade to the Bucs. It's also such a small chance for a prospect to match the caliber of a guy like Revis, it isn't even worth making the trade.

The odds are just against you.

Revis didn't yield that in a trade because you also have to turn around and pay him big money.

Corners are worth first rounders. Virtually every organization has e taken one high.

Somehow I don't believe every organization is wrong and just Risen is right.

 

[Blackspider214]

The Claiborne trade up was brutal. He's been so bad to where we have to make up something just to get him off this roster. Jerry was the one who made that move. And less than 3 seasons later, even after you made a pick to seal the Rams game, he's still saying how bad you are in public, you are pretty dang bad. That whole No Fly Zone was a disaster. I'll be so glad when we can wipe our hands clean of both of them. Worthless players.

 

[darthseinfeld]

I would say if the OP is arguing that we dont trade into the Top 10 the Julio Jones trade is a much better example

 

[Jenky]

Revis didn't yield that in a trade because you also have to turn around and pay him big money.

Corners are worth first rounders. Virtually every organization has e taken one high.

Somehow I don't believe every organization is wrong and just Risen is right.

I agree that corners are worth taking in the first round, but when you start packaging multiple picks for one, it often turns out to be a bad idea.

The position isn't as impactful as it once was. Sure, you have a few elite ones. But the rest are just good to average.

And I said partially right because it pertains to corners more than anything. If it was WR, QB, DE, it would be a different story.

 

[yimyammer]

I would say if the OP is arguing that we dont trade into the Top 10 the Julio Jones trade is a much better example

thats been a pretty good trade hasn't it? Seems this would contradict the ops point

 

[Risen Star]

He's saying a cornerback isn't worth a 1st and a 2nd no matter what. He's partially right. Revis didn't even yield that in his trade to the Bucs. It's also such a small chance for a prospect to match the caliber of a guy like Revis, it isn't even worth making the trade.

The odds are just against you.

Partially as in right as rain. No cornerback is worth that. They are secondary players. They impact nothing. The Cowboys could add the three best cornerbacks available this offseason and their defense won't improve. Use those three moves on front seven pieces of the same quality and you'll get instant improvement on all three levels of the defense.

It was a fatally flawed philosophy that should have gotten the father of this idea fired. I can only hope the Cowboys recognize this now, instead of assuming they just picked the wrong cornerbacks.

Quite possibly the worst offseason in the Jerry era that didn't involve losing Jimmy Johnson.

 

[Jenky]

Partially as in right as rain. No cornerback is worth that. They are secondary players. They impact nothing. The Cowboys could add the three best cornerbacks available this offseason and their defense won't improve. Use those three moves on front seven pieces of the same quality and you'll get instant improvement on all three levels of the defense.

It was a fatally flawed philosophy that should have gotten the father of this idea fired. I can only hope the Cowboys recognize this now, instead of assuming they just picked the wrong cornerbacks.

Quite possibly the worst offseason in the Jerry era that didn't involve losing Jimmy Johnson.

Yes, I said partially because I knew you were probably referring to ONLY corner. But if it was QB, WR, or DE, it would have been worth it.

 

[darthseinfeld]

thats been a pretty good trade hasn't it? Seems this would contradict the ops point

Yes and no. The player has been excellent but that was a 13 win team drafting him and look at what they became since

 

[Staubacher]

Easy to list a bunch of guys who are now good pros who were available.

Claiborne appears to be a miss. At the time few people thought that and if you did good for you.

The draft moves the last couple years or so have been pretty darn good. I prefer to dwell on that.