Turning from tanking

[starfan1]

Thats may take. If you cant root for a loss then you arent devoted enough. Fans that still want to win seem to want it for their own ego even if it hurts the team. To me that signals a lack devotion. True devotion includes personal sacrifice. Tolerating the losses is that personal sacrifice. Nothing more than a simple change of mind frame. If certain fans cant do that, then it also shows something else as well.

and others have a different take. And Im quite certain the players and coaches and owner agree with the others and not you. Sorry your on the wrong side of the thought process. Now it may very well be you end up with a top 5 pick but it wont be because of a lack of effort or on purpose. Fanantic is short for fan and just because they see things different don't make them any less of a a fan. Carry on with your tankdom!

 

[CowboyRoy]

Win or lose, it's still the same owners, losing will NOT result in change on the Cowboys, hasn't in 25 years...

Now that sounds like a real loser mentality. I read an article yesterday about quality draft capital in a direct correlation to the success of Cowboys drafts over the last 20 years.

Its pretty simply stuff and common sense. The more draft capital, higher the picks the Cowboys have had, the better drafts they have. If there is one things that the Cowboys have showed in the McClay era is that they can draft well.

 

[shabazz]

I don't know if the team ever thinks they're going to lose, before the start of the game. If they did, why would they try to win?

Agree. Most of the epic tanking performances were not done by the players; they were done by the FO

The NBA has gone to the lengths of trading away starters to field lesser players and in the NFL in can be done merely by starting Dinucci, and starting rookies for “evaluation purposes “ every game and let the chips fall where they may.

 

[CowboyRoy]

I understand both sides' view, I think you do too, understanding and agreeing aren't the same thing, don't be so hard on yourself

Winning hurts the team. Why would anyone root for that?

 

[CouchCoach]

So you don't have the mental ability to understand or see how a top 3 or 5 draft pick isnt "the best thing this season can deliver"?

Tell me, does being an awesome person come naturally or do you have to work at it?

 

[LACowboysFan1]

Now that sounds like a real loser mentality. I read an article yesterday about quality draft capital in a direct correlation to the success of Cowboys drafts over the last 20 years.

Its pretty simply stuff and common sense. The more draft capital, higher the picks the Cowboys have had, the better drafts they have. If there is one things that the Cowboys have showed in the McClay era is that they can draft well.

Hit and miss, like all teams, that's just the facts. No SBs in 25 years, and the same owner all those years. Not a mentality, it's a fact, results speak for themselves...

 

[LACowboysFan1]

Winning hurts the team. Why would anyone root for that?

It's not a black/white or either/or discussion. There's reasons for both views...

 

[BrAinPaiNt]

Stop the personal insults.

 

[LACowboysFan1]

and others have a different take. And Im quite certain the players and coaches and owner agree with the others and not you. Sorry your on the wrong side of the thought process. Now it may very well be you end up with a top 5 pick but it wont be because of a lack of effort or on purpose. Fanantic is short for fan and just because they see things different don't make them any less of a a fan. Carry on with your tankdom!

Agreed, and you know what they say "The best laid plans of mice and men...". What would be the reaction if the Cowboys do lose out, get the no. 1 pick and the the drafted player turns out to be another bust because of poor performance and doesn't even make it out of camp or past the first year?

Then all the tanking was for nought.

Of course it could work out great, not saying there's only one scenario. Just noting that it's not guaranteed 100% that it's a good thing to do....

 

[CouchCoach]

Agreed, and you know what they say "The best laid plans of mice and men...". What would be the reaction if the Cowboys do lose out, get the no. 1 pick and the the drafted player turns out to be another bust because of poor performance and doesn't even make it out of camp or past the first year?

Then all the tanking was for nought.

Of course it could work out great, not saying there's only one scenario. Just noting that it's not guaranteed 100% that it's a good thing to do....

Add to this there's no clear plan as to what they'd do. Some feel QB but if they really are all about Prescott, what do they do with that top 5 pick?

It's not like they have this great track record in the 1st round. Claiborne, Charleton, Elliott and the jury is still out on Vander Esch.

There seems to be this thought that they'd be able to trade it for oodles when this isn't a great or deep draft.

 

[kskboys]

Agreed, and you know what they say "The best laid plans of mice and men...". What would be the reaction if the Cowboys do lose out, get the no. 1 pick and the the drafted player turns out to be another bust because of poor performance and doesn't even make it out of camp or past the first year?

Then all the tanking was for nought.

Of course it could work out great, not saying there's only one scenario. Just noting that it's not guaranteed 100% that it's a good thing to do....

Yeah, but looking at one worst case scenario doesn't prove anything. Bad drafting is bad drafting no matter where you pick.

Look at last year's draft, for example. Chase Young. 2nd pick in the draft. Ultra stud. Soooooooo, who's the next best DE? Chaisson? Epensa? There is a chasm of difference. So, in saying draft position isn't that important, you'd have to agree that Chaisson/Epensa are just as good as Chase Young.

 

[Diehardblues]

Not if NOT getting to first base means you get to draft the next Babe Ruth. Im actually shocked that so many of you cant see the overwhelming benefits of losing.

We see it , we just don’t agree that trying to lose out is what’s best for the mindset of the team and coaching staff.

Regardless , gaining a higher pick from the result of losing is a benefit from losing and shouldn’t be an objective to lose.

Losing breeds more losing. Fighting hard attempting to win is a much better culture. One pick , potentially a couple slots ahead probably isn’t going to turn next season on a dime as much as returning all of our injured stars.

And we probably won’t win another game anyway. One or two wins max IMO which won’t effect our draft slot much anyway, if at all. It’d be different if we had a shot at the #1 pick and we really wanted Trevor.

 

[Diehardblues]

Add to this there's no clear plan as to what they'd do. Some feel QB but if they really are all about Prescott, what do they do with that top 5 pick?

It's not like they have this great track record in the 1st round. Claiborne, Charleton, Elliott and the jury is still out on Vander Esch.

There seems to be this thought that they'd be able to trade it for oodles when this isn't a great or deep draft.

Right

Our top 5 picks in draft this era . Williams, Clairborne and Elliott. Not a good track record .

And if we aren’t going QB will probably be another dicey pick on defense. We’ll prob go with a safer pick on OL.

 

[kskboys]

We see it , we just don’t agree that trying to lose out is what’s best for the mindset of the team and coaching staff.

Regardless , gaining a higher pick from the result of losing is a benefit from losing and shouldn’t be an objective to lose.

Losing breeds more losing. Fighting hard attempting to win is a much better culture. One pick , potentially a couple slots ahead probably isn’t going to turn next season on a dime as much as returning all of our injured stars.

And we probably won’t win another game anyway. One or two wins max IMO which won’t effect our draft slot much anyway, if at all. It’d be different if we had a shot at the #1 pick and we really wanted Trevor.

Unless you're referring to perennial losers such as the Browns/Lions/Jags, etc..... I can't think of one case where what you're saying has been the case. And I've see the opposite be true several times. This "creating a losing culture" thingie is more of a fan creation, IMO.

 

[kskboys]

Right

Our top 5 picks in draft this era . Williams, Clairborne and Elliott. Not a good track record .

And if we aren’t going QB will probably be another dicey pick on defense. We’ll prob go with a safer pick on OL.

Elliot has been good.
Mo was a reach. Yes, I said so at the time.
Williams was a good player.

Looks to me as if 2 out of 3 are good. What's the issue?

 

[Diehardblues]

Thats may take. If you cant root for a loss then you arent devoted enough. Fans that still want to win seem to want it for their own ego even if it hurts the team. To me that signals a lack devotion. True devotion includes personal sacrifice. Tolerating the losses is that personal sacrifice. Nothing more than a simple change of mind frame. If certain fans cant do that, then it also shows something else as well.

It doesn’t really matter . We’re prob going to lose them all anyway. Rooting to lose just helps mend the pain of losing.

There’s much to be said for a coaching staff or team trying to play hard and pull off an upset in a spoilers role.

The NFL is designed to benefit the lesser teams in the draft. We will be one of those teams. I’d like to see us play hard staying in the game much like we did with Steelers, regardless if we don’t win another one. Which is unlikely we will. But 3-13 or 2-14 probably isn’t going to matter that much unless we have our eye on one of the QB’s. Which all reports from our Football Idiots says we don’t.

We get the benefits from drafting higher. We just aren’t sure if the benefits from tanking all the games especially if you don’t have to and still end up in about the same slot.

 

[Londonboy]

Losing is never a good goal. It only breeds more losing .

And if we are going to watch all of these games which I assume most of us are ( it’s not an option for me) then we want our team to play hard and attempt to win. Regardless if it means anything or not, winning always feel better and more fun.

Earning a higher draft pick for losing is simply the silver lining , it shouldn’t become a goal. I think some fans justify the losing in a positive spin selling the higher pick. Which again is just the consolation prize from losing.

I agree with everything You said.

Can this year possibly get any weirder?

 

[Diehardblues]

Unless you're referring to perennial losers such as the Browns/Lions/Jags, etc..... I can't think of one case where what you're saying has been the case. And I've see the opposite be true several times. This "creating a losing culture" thingie is more of a fan creation, IMO.

I might put us in that category this era but that’s arguable . I really don’t think it’s going to matter anyway as regardless whether we’re tanking or not can’t see us winning many if any.

But I’d prefer more games like the last than the previous two. In the end it didn’t matter except for the 60 minutes each week we are tuned in and hopefully to the staff and players knowing they did all they could.

Like Coached referenced, it’s an entertainment value as well. I want to see competitive games where we are fighting to win despite the odds.Again, in the end it probably won’t matter. But I get the consolation from losing. And ok with that. For 60 minutes each week though I’m not going to root for it .

 

[Diehardblues]

Elliot has been good.
Mo was a reach. Yes, I said so at the time.
Williams was a good player.

Looks to me as if 2 out of 3 are good. What's the issue?

Williams wasn’t considered worthy of his slot as we traded him. He was good initially but fizzled out.

And Elliott is beginning to fizzle too although I’d give us 1out of 3.

Mo was a complete bust. You’re coming off as apologetic for our front office.

 

[kskboys]

I agree with everything You said.

Can this year possibly get any weirder?

That is the fan take, but it doesn't appear to be the case. You're talking about a hangover that continues even w/ major talent added. Fans love to say this, but it doesn't appear to be the case. Too many poor teams have risen up to win for that to be the case. MIA is the lastest example. They tanked, and tanked hard. This season, they're looking like a playoff team. No hangover. Same HC as last year.