Tyson

[HoleInTheRoof]

I watched the Tyson movie this weekend and I have to say . . . it really enjoyed it. Of course, I've always been a Mike Tyson fan.

It was a tragic story. He was blessed to have been introduced to Cus, and I really wish he could have spent more time with Cus and not gotten involved with all the leeches.

For my money, I'd take a 20 year old Mike Tyson against any fighter in any generation.

 

[Maikeru-sama]

I watched it a few weeks ago and I thought it was well done.

I think Cus was great for Mike Tyson, but I felt he should have exposed Mike to the business side a little more and not shelter him as much from the unseemly part of boxing. After Cus died, Mike just didn't have the tools to succeed and guys like Don King just abused him.

It was very interesting to see that he still fiercely denies raping Desiree Washington and that he never physically assaulted Robin Givens.

I'm not sure whether he was guilty of wife battery but I always had some doubt as to accusations that he raped Desiree Washington.

 

[Doomsday101]

I agree Tyson is a tragic story (however I have not seen the movie) I think after D'Amato died Tyson was lead in the wrong direction by those interest in their own wealth than what was best for Tyson. As for greatest Boxer I stick with Ali not many could move like a middle weight and hit with the power of a heavy weight. Ali was a smart guy who knew how to change tactics in mid fight

 

[YosemiteSam]

I agree Tyson is a tragic story (however I have not seen the movie) I think after D'Amato died Tyson was lead in the wrong direction by those interest in their own wealth than what was best for Tyson. As for greatest Boxer I stick with Ali not many could move like a middle weight and hit with the power of a heavy weight. Ali was a smart guy who knew how to change tactics in mid fight

Just say his name. Don King.

Tyson's problem was always his intelligence. He doesn't have any.

As for Ali and Tyson comparison. Ali is easily the greatest boxer of all time. (due to his power on top of his immense boxing skills) Now, that doesn't mean Tyson couldn't have knocked him out. If Tyson got a hold of Ali (in his prime of course) Ali would have been in real trouble. Tyson just hit was to freaking hard and he was fast on top of it.

 

[Doomsday101]

Just say his name. Don King.

Tyson's problem was always his intelligence. He doesn't have any.

As for Ali and Tyson comparison. Ali is easily the greatest boxer of all time. (due to his power on top of his immense boxing skills) Now, that doesn't mean Tyson couldn't have knocked him out. If Tyson got a hold of Ali (in his prime of course) Ali would have been in real trouble. Tyson just hit was to freaking hard and he was fast on top of it.

I agree. I just see Ali as a boxer and Tyson as a fighter. Tyson has a bad habit of lunging forward as he threw a punch which got him in big trouble with Buster Douglas as Douglas would side step Tyson and lower the boom on him each time Tyson did that. Ali with his quickness I think would ate Tyson up.

 

[Maikeru-sama]

I wouldn't say Mike Tyson was stupid.

I think if you look at the environment he came from, the lack of 'father' figures early his life and the loss of Cus D'amato, who brought 'stability' to his life all contributed to his downfall.

Almost as devastating, is the fact that he didn't have any 'real' friends around him as he rose to fame.

Also, Muhammad Ali was not known for his punching power. He was known for his stamia, smarts and quickness.

Mike Tyson in his prime wouldn't have a chance against Ali in his prime. Mike Tyson would have had trouble with Ali's quickness and most importantly, Ali's patience and reach.

Mike Tyson was a brawler and got very discouraged when he couldn't knock a fighter out within the first 2-3 rounds. Ali could've easily employed tactics he used against George Foreman (one of the hardest punchers ever) and just got Tyson tired.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

A couple of things . . .

- You tend to remember Tyson as a power puncher, but when you watch him training, and his early fights, his accuracy and speed are underestimated. I'd take him over Ali. In the interest of full disclosure, I've been a Tyson fan my whole life. I was even in denial in 2002 when he fought Lewis, refusing to believe that Tyson just didn't have that fire anymore.

- What ever happened to Desire Washington? Did she just disapear into obscurity?

- I agree that Tyson was not/is not a smart person. He obviously did not place a lot of focus on education as a child, and about the only time anyone tried to teach him anything about life was his brief exposure to Cus.

- Damn, I wish boxing was still great. I wish we had worthy competition in the heavyweight ranks. Football will forever be my #1 sport, but there was always something electric about a great fight night heavyweight bout on PPV.

 

[CATCH17]

A couple of things . . .

- You tend to remember Tyson as a power puncher, but when you watch him training, and his early fights, his accuracy and speed are underestimated. I'd take him over Ali. In the interest of full disclosure, I've been a Tyson fan my whole life. I was even in denial in 2002 when he fought Lewis, refusing to believe that Tyson just didn't have that fire anymore.

- What ever happened to Desire Washington? Did she just disapear into obscurity?

- I agree that Tyson was not/is not a smart person. He obviously did not place a lot of focus on education as a child, and about the only time anyone tried to teach him anything about life was his brief exposure to Cus.

- Damn, I wish boxing was still great. I wish we had worthy competition in the heavyweight ranks. Football will forever be my #1 sport, but there was always something electric about a great fight night heavyweight bout on PPV.

Lesnar vs Shane Carwin will be electric.

 

[Maikeru-sama]

To me, the Lennox Lewis fight serves as a prime example as to why Tyson wouldn't be able to defeat Muhammad Ali.

Yes, Tyson was accustomed to fighting taller fighters, but Ali's reach along with his quickness would have been too much for Tyson.

I remember watching Jim Brown's 'ESPN 100 Greatest Athletes' profile. One person who was close to Jim Brown said he and Ali were walking down a street. Jim Brown was telling Ali that they should schedule a boxing match against each other, kind of just for the sake of it. I forget the story in its entirety but Ali turned towards Jim Brown and Ali told him to try to punch him.

The guy telling the story said that Jim Brown tried as hard as he could but he couldn't hit Ali a single time because Ali was just too quick.

 

[Doomsday101]

To me, the Lennox Lewis fight serves as a prime example as to why Tyson wouldn't be able to defeat Muhammad Ali.

Yes, Tyson was accustomed to fighting taller fighters, but Ali's reach along with his quickness would have been too much for Tyson.

I remember watching Jim Brown's 'ESPN 100 Greatest Athletes' profile. One person who was close to Jim Brown said he and Ali were walking down a street. Jim Brown was telling Ali that they should schedule a boxing match against each other, kind of just for the sake of it. I forget the story in its entirety but Ali turned towards Jim Brown and Ali told him to try to punch him.

The guy telling the story said that Jim Brown tried as hard as he could but he couldn't hit Ali a single time because Ali was just too quick.

I saw one Ali fight where he stood in the corner with his hands to his sides and just moving his head as the other fighter was trying to hit him and never laid a glove on him.

 

[Maikeru-sama]

I saw one Ali fight where he stood in the corner with his hands to his sides and just moving his head as the other fighter was trying to hit him and never laid a glove on him.

Yeah, the guy just had amazing quickness.

I was watching 'When we were kings', which is a documentary on Ali/Foreman. It was widely known that even people in Ali's corner felt he had no chance because he was aging fighter and with athletes, the first thing to go is your 'quickness' and Ali wasn't as quick as you use to be.

Here are heavyweight fights I would like to see:

Tyson vs Ali
Ali vs Marciano
Joe Lewis vs Ali

 

[Yeagermeister]

If it was Ali in his prime vs Tyson in his prime......Ali wins hands down. He would have had Tyson frustrated and confused by the third round. Then Ali would have went to work on him.

 

[Maikeru-sama]

I've always wondered what was considered the bigger upset, Douglas/Tyson or Ali/Foreman.

 

[YosemiteSam]

I wouldn't say Mike Tyson was stupid.

I think if you look at the environment he came from, the lack of 'father' figures early his life and the loss of Cus D'amato, who brought 'stability' to his life all contributed to his downfall.

Almost as devastating, is the fact that he didn't have any 'real' friends around him as he rose to fame.

Also, Muhammad Ali was not known for his punching power. He was known for his stamia, smarts and quickness.

Mike Tyson in his prime wouldn't have a chance against Ali in his prime. Mike Tyson would have had trouble with Ali's quickness and most importantly, Ali's patience and reach.

Mike Tyson was a brawler and got very discouraged when he couldn't knock a fighter out within the first 2-3 rounds. Ali could've easily employed tactics he used against George Foreman (one of the hardest punchers ever) and just got Tyson tired.

Everything that came out of his mouth and all his actions scream something different. Don King blatantly abused him and he couldn't see it. Even when the entire world was telling him. He would just defend Don King.

 

[Yeagermeister]

I've always wondered what was considered the bigger upset, Douglas/Tyson or Ali/Foreman.

Douglas

He came out of nowhere.

 

[YosemiteSam]

Douglas

He came out of nowhere.

IMO it wasn't Douglas beating Tyson. It was Tyson beating himself. The man didn't even really train for that fight. He though he could beat anyone without training. Ego and stupid = embarrassing loss.

 

[Yeagermeister]

Everything that came out of his mouth and all his actions scream something different. Don King blatantly abused him and he couldn't see it. Even when the entire world was telling him. He would just defend Don King.

King and Robin messed his life up. There is no telling how much money they screwed him out of.

 

[Yeagermeister]

IMO it wasn't Douglas beating Tyson. It was Tyson beating himself. The man didn't even really train for that fight. He though he could beat anyone without training. Ego and stupid = embarrassing loss.

That is very true but Buster took him apart.

 

[Maikeru-sama]

Everything that came out of his mouth and all his actions scream something different. Don King blatantly abused him and he couldn't see it. Even when the entire world was telling him. He would just defend Don King.

Don King took advantage of a ton of fighters, including Muhammad Ali, Larry Holmes and Lennox Lewis to name a few.

There is a difference between having a 'low IQ' and 'being uneducated'. I don't know what Tyson's IQ is but he is definitely 'uneducated'.

I don't even think he finished Highschool and guys like that are a lot more vulnerable than those who are more educated.

 

[Maikeru-sama]

King and Robin messed his life up. There is no telling how much money they screwed him out of.

He was warned by many people that Robin Givens was all about the money. I remember Arsenio Halls talked about it on his show.

But Tyson's main problem is that he didn't have any 'good' people around him.

Most of the people who are successful and are able to handle fame, had google people around them that knew them before they were famous.