Umpire was out of position

[tyke1doe]

In your mind I should project what I would do or did do into what other people do? That’s childlike thinking. I’d never see a bank and think taking a gun in and demanding money would be a good way of getting money from them, but many people do.

Well, HECK! That's why people train others. Because they know that by TRAINING them, they'll get certain responses. Basically, what you're saying is that you're childlike if you train someone then expect them to do what they're trained to do.

Second, your analogy with the bank is awkward and irrelevant. We're talking about OFFICIATING a game. We're not talking about robbing a bank. Stay on topic, please.

Refs are people and many people have bias and some aren’t able to control that bias. It’s very simple.
if you don’t think the ref that was defensive holding the defender turned blocker for Tom Brady was biased then you don’t understand the concept. When refs joke around with Rodgers and the team never gets called for holding it’s a bad look at least. There’s likely bias there imo.

Yawn! I asked you a simple question: as a referee, did you have time to entertain bias while making a split-second decision? Please share your response and what insight you can give on BIAS AND OFFICIATING FROM YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE!

Thank you.

Live in your pollyannaish world in which refs are beyond partiality if you like. I don’t like.

https://nypost.com/2021/10/15/did-an-official-protect-tom-brady-in-bucs-win-over-eagles/

https://www.sportscasting.com/nfl-r...making-huge-mistake-gifted-packers-touchdown/

Thanks for the links. But they are OPINIONS of those not refs. They're like you - writers ASSUMING that the refs are bias.
Did they interview the refs? Did the refs say, "I was trying to help Brady or Rodgers win the game"?
You have NO PROOF of bias. Only what you PERCEIVE. And perceptions are like opinions that are like pucker holes. Everyone has one.

Meanwhile the ref in our game can’t even be in postition to not spot the ball correctly. Morons. They are wannabe idiots, kiss *****, and jerks in the NFL.

Do you even understand what we're talking about?
I didn't say refs were perfect. I even said refs are human, and humans make mistakes just like refs make mistakes.
Heck, I've called strikes that are balls and balls that are strikes and players who were tagged out who actually made it to the base.
I can ADMIT those mistakes.
But what I'm telling you FROM EXPERIENCE is that I'm so involved in calling the game that when split-second decisions are made, I'm not thinking, "I don't like this kid, this coach, this team so I'm going to call him out when he's safe."
The human mind doesn't work that way because if you're thinking of anything other than the play, you're going to miss it. And that has happened to me too.

But you've officiated basketball games. Surely, this isn't foreign to you if what you've said is true.

It has nothing to do with being naive. It has everything to do with trying to do your job the best you can and make the best call you can. And that's hard enough without entertaining the thought, "The Cowboys have a few seconds left. Let me screw them by waiting until the last minute to set the ball in play."

 

[boysbeyond4ever]

you don’t hand it to the center and think the ref doesn’t have to spot it. You can toss it to him to hurry the process. But what happened was a mess on Daks part and the refs. A cluster *****. I don’t think it’s required of the ref to go quicker than the usual pace in that situation.

z

They may or may not have to but they will.in thise situations, which again raises the question did the Umpire choose not to? Did the referee hold him in place andwhy?

Not suggesting anything untoward but again the lack of consistency from the on-field officials and a similar lack of clarity in the NFL Rules on these matters leads to yet another problem the NFL could have avoided in advance by professionalizing its officials on a full-time basis and reviewing rules that are clearly not administered consistently.

 

[boysbeyond4ever]

Mr. C,. Tyke1doe isn't pollyannish - he's arrogant. He can't honestly answer simple questions and thinks not doing so proves his position is superior. He's way more cynical than pollyannish, really or he'd honestly answer questions about things we all can see and discuss on a forum instead of pretending were in a court of law bring felony charges against them.to avoid admitting what he probably knows to be true with his own eyes too..

And the fact that he's lobbing questions at you also shows he's hypocrite to such an extent that I don't blame anyone who would worry about his honest calling of balls and strikes.because demanding answers from people after refusing to honestly answer a question and falsely going to legalistic lengths to avoid answering a simple questions raises questions about this fella's character.

Demanidng you answer a question after refusing to answer one honestly himself is text book hyopocrisy and inconsistency and the kind of character that makes for an incompetent inconsistent maybe even biased official.

 

[boysbeyond4ever]

I'll only add this, I only asked Tyke1doeto answer a question I am sure he has asked himself of pro sports officials who are different from high school officials, in that they officiate the same players game after game year after and on a much smaller scale than local sports officials do now. They also do so in the most intense period of media coverage of sports on a day-to-day basis than ever. They are basically unsequestored jurors who can easily be subtly influenced by what they have seen themselves or on TV or read in print or online media.before they go out to try the teams in the game they are working.

I said earlier officiating a sport is a very tough job at any level and as someone who has coached on the high school level I can sympathize with him having seen how parents students and some coaches and players behave. But the professional level is a completely different anima for more reasons than I can detail in a short time, that lends itself to subconcious biases developing ahead of time. That's why his split-second argument is flawed here. If you go in believing something about a player or team positively or negatively you're already inclined to decide the call on that basis - like say as I originally noted give the Cy Young Winner that slightly bigger slighlly wider strike zone against that rookie the other team just called up.
It's not evil nor sinister nor corrupt , it just has to go or at least the rules have to try to minimize its impact. Same in pro football only we're dealing with far more rules which often are far more complex. The first step is making a consistency a major priority in officating by revisiting the rules to re-write them to be more consistently administered and enforced. I have to run But I'll have more later.

 

[Creeper]

Funny, No one has really talked about the facts the the Cowboys got called for two defensive holding penalties in this game, holding by the DL. To me this is the same as them getting called for two tripping penalties in one game both on the OL. You rarely see defensive holding on running plays and Dallas got called twice. Sure they were guilty, especially the second one but you see that all the time and it rarely gets called.

 

[boysbeyond4ever]

Funny, No one has really talked about the facts the the Cowboys got called for two defensive holding penalties in this game, holding by the DL. To me this is the same as them getting called for two tripping penalties in one game both on the OL. You rarely see defensive holding on running plays and Dallas got called twice. Sure they were guilty, especially the second one but you see that all the time and it rarely gets called.

Agreed. Defensive holding on a run play can probably called on almost every play just as offensive holding can. To see them call this twice in one game is remarkable at the very least..

 

[Big_D]

z

They may or may not have to but they will.in thise situations, which again raises the question did the Umpire choose not to? Did the referee hold him in place andwhy?

Not suggesting anything untoward but again the lack of consistency from the on-field officials and a similar lack of clarity in the NFL Rules on these matters leads to yet another problem the NFL could have avoided in advance by professionalizing its officials on a full-time basis and reviewing rules that are clearly not administered consistently.

I agree but the league doesn’t seem too worried about it. Officiating has been a mess for a long time!

 

[DogFace]

Well, HECK! That's why people train others. Because they know that by TRAINING them, they'll get certain responses. Basically, what you're saying is that you're childlike if you train someone then expect them to do what they're trained to do.

Second, your analogy with the bank is awkward and irrelevant. We're talking about OFFICIATING a game. We're not talking about robbing a bank. Stay on topic, please.



Yawn! I asked you a simple question: as a referee, did you have time to entertain bias while making a split-second decision? Please share your response and what insight you can give on BIAS AND OFFICIATING FROM YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE!

Thank you.




Thanks for the links. But they are OPINIONS of those not refs. They're like you - writers ASSUMING that the refs are bias.
Did they interview the refs? Did the refs say, "I was trying to help Brady or Rodgers win the game"?
You have NO PROOF of bias. Only what you PERCEIVE. And perceptions are like opinions that are like pucker holes. Everyone has one.



Do you even understand what we're talking about?
I didn't say refs were perfect. I even said refs are human, and humans make mistakes just like refs make mistakes.
Heck, I've called strikes that are balls and balls that are strikes and players who were tagged out who actually made it to the base.
I can ADMIT those mistakes.
But what I'm telling you FROM EXPERIENCE is that I'm so involved in calling the game that when split-second decisions are made, I'm not thinking, "I don't like this kid, this coach, this team so I'm going to call him out when he's safe."
The human mind doesn't work that way because if you're thinking of anything other than the play, you're going to miss it. And that has happened to me too.

But you've officiated basketball games. Surely, this isn't foreign to you if what you've said is true.

It has nothing to do with being naive. It has everything to do with trying to do your job the best you can and make the best call you can. And that's hard enough without entertaining the thought, "The Cowboys have a few seconds left. Let me screw them by waiting until the last minute to set the ball in play."

Believe what makes you happy. That’s important.

 

[tyke1doe]

Believe what makes you happy. That’s important.

Has little to do with what I believe and more to do with what I've EXPERIENCED, which puts me in a better position to comment on what is going through the minds of officials compared to someone who has not experienced officiating.

But you know what I'm talking about if you've had personal experience officiating.

If not, well, again my limited experience and insights into officiating beat NO EXPERIENCE any day.

Good day, sir.

 

[G2]

There were other examples of the weird positioning and actions by the refs, spotting the ball pre-snap. At the beginning of the 4th quarter Dallas got penalized for delay of game.
The ref literally hovers over the ball and them moves out of the way when the clock expires.

 

[Steve007]

There were other examples of the weird positioning and actions by the refs, spotting the ball pre-snap. At the beginning of the 4th quarter Dallas got penalized for delay of game.
The ref literally hovers over the ball and them moves out of the way when the clock expires.

Thats because the cowboys made late substitutions and by rule the ref holds the play until the other team gets to put in thier subs. It's a rule. Dallas screwed that play up.

 

[Ranching]

Has little to do with what I believe and more to do with what I've EXPERIENCED, which puts me in a better position to comment on what is going through the minds of officials compared to someone who has not experienced officiating.

But you know what I'm talking about if you've had personal experience officiating.

If not, well, again my limited experience and insights into officiating beat NO EXPERIENCE any day.

Good day, sir.

All officials are the same...I know pee wee refs and on up to refs that worked NCAA championships and SB.....they all make mistakes....it's part of the game. I remember losing a game in October of 2012 because of a blown call.....still hurts. Even the opposing coach apologized after the game.

 

[G2]

Thats because the cowboys made late substitutions and by rule the ref holds the play until the other team gets to put in thier subs. It's a rule. Dallas screwed that play up.

The defense was set, substitutions happened before that.

 

[Steve007]

The defense was set, substitutions happened before that.

The Umpire will stand over the ball until the Referee deems that the defense has had a reasonable time to complete its substitutions. That's the rule.

 

[Dak_Attack_09]

Ill keep it G. Even if we spike it there we arent scoring a td. Would be 2007 all over again

Passing interface would put you on the goal line.

 

[MarcusRock]

Has little to do with what I believe and more to do with what I've EXPERIENCED, which puts me in a better position to comment on what is going through the minds of officials compared to someone who has not experienced officiating.

But you know what I'm talking about if you've had personal experience officiating.

If not, well, again my limited experience and insights into officiating beat NO EXPERIENCE any day.

Good day, sir.

Now THAT'S how you make another poster stand down. He's a try-hard that's used to that though, lol. Brings a tear to my eye as I recollect old times.

 

[Gangsta Spanksta]

Passing interface would put you on the goal line.

Geez the shoulda, coulda, woulda crowd really are whining about this. And what would've been next, the cowboys would play like a playoff game the next game and not embarrass us and win?

 

[G2]

The Umpire will stand over the ball until the Referee deems that the defense has had a reasonable time to complete its substitutions. That's the rule.

He was staring at Prescott. That a pretty stupid rule!

 

[Playmaker3128]

I think I’m this instance both schools of thought can be correct. Was the ref in bad position? Probably.

Bur we shoulda have even let it get to that point in needing a miracle.Still woulda loved to see that last play. Just for the suspense (and probable inevitable missed xp if we tied the game)

 

[TNCowboy]

Him being way out of position is 100% true, he's not even in the screen before or during the play.

But the fact remains, Dak getting down, getting the ball spotted, and spiking it all in 14 seconds is touch and go. It was a foolish play call no matter what that ref was doing.