Video: Vintage Romo

[Aviano90]

I’m not sure why anyone would say Romo never had a chance. He was a starting QB for 10 seasons in the NFL and they made the playoffs 3 out his first 4 years starting. Every year you have a chance, however small. The “never had a chance” stuff should be reserved for the majority of the back half of his career on the teams with the horrible defenses.

Well, they say it. Not always necessarily in those exact terms, but that is essentially what it boils down to. There are different things such as "he never won because he never had a defense" or "his career was wasted" are things that are also said.

But even with the horrible defenses he still had a chance. That's what the week 17 play in games prove. The defense may have sucked but if we give our top 10 offense the ball late in the 4th quarter to win the game and keep the season alive, that is a chance. I could understand that claim IF we were losing 38-35 type of games where the defense was too horrible to overcome, but that's not how our seasons were actually ending.

 

[Aviano90]

And this isn't just about Romo. I make the exact same points when it comes to discussing Garrett, and I was a Garrett supporter for many years too. These games were winnable and, while we may not have won Super Bowls, we should have damn sure had more playoff appearances and wins. Not being able to win the Super Bowl should not be an acceptable excuse for under performing and missing the playoffs entirely.

 

[Hennessy_King]

Well, they say it. Not always necessarily in those exact terms, but that is essentially what it boils down to. There are different things such as "he never won because he never had a defense" or "his career was wasted" are things that are also said.

But even with the horrible defenses he still had a chance. That's what the week 17 play in games prove. The defense may have sucked but if we give our top 10 offense the ball late in the 4th quarter to win the game and keep the season alive, that is a chance. I could understand that claim IF we were losing 38-35 type of games where the defense was too horrible to overcome, but that's not how our seasons were actually ending.

They don't want to believe that in the playoffs or those week 17 games the most points romo ever put up in a loss was 23 points and I believe only put up over 20 points 3 times.

 

[Aviano90]

They don't want to believe that in the playoffs or those week 17 games the most points romo ever put up in a loss was 23 points and I believe only put up over 20 points 3 times.

The most the offense put up in a loss with Romo was 21 against GB in 2014. He had one other game with 20 points (Seattle 2006). All other losses were below 20. We had 2 wins by scoring 24 and 34 points.

 

[G2]

The most the offense put up in a loss with Romo was 21 against GB in 2014. He had one other game with 20 points (Seattle 2006). All other losses were below 20. We had 2 wins by scoring 24 and 34 points.

Yeah but the O line sucked.

 

[SultanOfSix]

But even with the horrible defenses he still had a chance.

 

[Aviano90]

LOL. Or maybe I thought more highly of Romo's ability to lead the team than most??? I mean QB is the most important position and we were instantly in the "haves" vs. the "have nots". Supposedly.

 

[TheDuke]

Vintage romo hahahahahahahahaha. Yep it was vintage alright.

That and the 3 yard scramble vs the rams.

vintage

 

[Super_Kazuya]

Well, they say it. Not always necessarily in those exact terms, but that is essentially what it boils down to. There are different things such as "he never won because he never had a defense" or "his career was wasted" are things that are also said.

But even with the horrible defenses he still had a chance. That's what the week 17 play in games prove. The defense may have sucked but if we give our top 10 offense the ball late in the 4th quarter to win the game and keep the season alive, that is a chance. I could understand that claim IF we were losing 38-35 type of games where the defense was too horrible to overcome, but that's not how our seasons were actually ending.

No he did not have a chance with the horrible defense teams. You continue to boil the season down to one regular season game and have no awareness that the order of these games is irrelevant and that they all count the same. You also continue to ignore that if the defense didn’t regularly blow games in the previous 15 by regularly giving up 40+ points, the last game would be unnecessary and you might actually have a bye instead of being a .500 team sneaking into the playoffs needing to win multiple road games to advance. The average NFL defensive rank for the Super Bowl champion is 7th. So no Kyle Orton/Romo did not have a chance to win the Super Bowl with the 3rd worst defense in NFL history.

 

[Aviano90]

No he did not have a chance with the horrible defense teams. You continue to boil the season down to one regular season game and have no awareness that the order of these games is irrelevant and that they all count the same. You also continue to ignore that if the defense didn’t regularly blow games in the previous 15 by regularly giving up 40+ points, the last game would be unnecessary and you might actually have a bye instead of being a .500 team sneaking into the playoffs needing to win multiple road games to advance. The average NFL defensive rank for the Super Bowl champion is 7th. So no Kyle Orton/Romo did not have a chance to win the Super Bowl with the 3rd worst defense in NFL history.

Let's just take 2013. That was the worst defense in our history. The defense was pitiful. Let's look at other games that still could have pushed us over the top.

Week 2 against KC - The team abandoned the running game in the 2nd half and the pass rush teed off on Romo. Romo's performance dropped considerably but even still hit a wide open Dez on a deep ball down the field that Dez dropped. That wasn't on the defense.

Week 8 against Detroit - the game was in the bag. Fox had already put up a win the standing for us and Tyron Smith had to have a holding penalty which stopped the clock allowing Detroit an opportunity to win game they shouldn't have had. The defense stunk but that was a game thrown away that was in the bag.

Week 15 against GB - defense played horrible in the 2nd half but we passed way too often in the 2nd half when Murray was gutting the Packers on the ground. Ended up throwing 2 late game interceptions. All we needed to do was keep running the ball and the game would have been easily won.

So the team still had an opportunity in week 17 with the ball in our offenses hand with a playoff berth 1 field goal drive away. That is a chance. No chance would be that the team was eliminated prior to that point. Not believing the team could win the SB does not make it OK to miss the playoffs entirely.

 

[DFWJC]

• I don't believe the team would have won the Super Bowl. I don't judge the team on Super Bowl or bust.
  
  Do you think the team was good enough to beat the following?
  
  Seattle in 2006
  NY Giants in 2007
  Philadelphia in 2008
  Minnesota in 2009
  NY Giants in 2011
  Washington in 2012
  Philadelphia in 2013 (with Orton)
  Green Bay in 2014
  
  The only 2 games I did not believe the Cowboys would win out of that list is the last 2. That leaves 6 other games that I believed were winnable. I don't expect a perfect 6-0 record there, but is wanting something like 3-3 unreasonable?
  
  That's why I discuss this so much. I had all kinds of confidence in Romo. I believed the team could win with him. We just needed to line back up the next year and give it another go. But I refuse to now look back with hindsight and claim he didn't have a chance to try and save him from criticism. Romo fans were confident the team was going to win with him, they weren't setting the bar low. They were pumping up expectations while the Romo haters were trying to lower them during his career. That's a big about face in confidence level now that his career is over.

  I feel dirty (and kind of dumb) for even falling into this big game conversation...especially in a feel good thread. But to speak to it honestly, you really do need to include games they won.
• 
  
• 2006___Playoff loss at Sea..loss…after leading faltering team to playoffs. As QB, led team to possible go ahead points on final drive. His muffed special teams hold was not a QB play.
• 2007___Playoff loss vs NYG, after earning a bye... 1st full season starting..led team to home field advantage and a bye. Lost to eventual Super Bowl champ. Led team on possible game-winning drive and made game-winning pass on third down with time running out…but Crayton pulled up. 3-4 huge drops that game, but Romo certainly not perfect either.
• 2008___Week 17..loss at Philly..Romo missed 3 games…at Philly demolished Dallas ..similar to at Minnesota in 2009, the whole team sucked..including Romo.
• 2009___Week 17 win vs Philly. for division title and home field…returned the favor and blew Philly out. Team and Romo great
• 2009___Playoff win vs Philly... playoff game..Romo outstanding
• 2009___Playoff loss at Minn…they kicked crap out of dallas…no contrest and no chance with road, indoor pass rush, injured LT, and Favre/Minny doing what they did all year
• 2011___Week 17 loss at Giants..…"football hand" game. Team not so good..about 300 yds and QB rtg of 106…but never quite right…Giants pass rush way too good….went on to win Super Bowl
• 2012___Week 17 loss at Wash...horrible team. 32nd ranked defense drug kicking and screaming to 8-8 by very good QB. Still somehow had chance in week 17. Romo had a terrible game and dealing with blitz and injuries. almost the whole offense was injured by late game….last drive..no Dez, no Murray, no Austin, no Harris,
• 2013 ___Week 16 win at Wash..another crap team..but like week 16 in a must win game..Romo lead game-winning 4th qtr drive for won…revenge at Washington (similar to revenge vs Philly)…but did so with herniated disc…Dallas loses at home week 17 without Romo
• 2014___Week 17 win vs Wash…need win for home field and also any shot at 1st round bye….demolishes Washington…Dallas sweeps December and Romo sets December QB rating record
• 2014___Playoff win vs Det…win..leads Dallas to game-winning drive with time running out for win vs Detroit 2014___Playoff loss at GB…loss.. At Green Bay…Romo leads Dallas to apparent go-ahead TD drive…but Dez catch overturned. Romo led league in QB rating these playoffs and had 143 rating in this game.

 

[theebs]

I don't believe the team would have won the Super Bowl. I don't judge the team on Super Bowl or bust.

Do you think the team was good enough to beat the following?

Seattle in 2006
NY Giants in 2007
Philadelphia in 2008
Minnesota in 2009
NY Giants in 2011
Washington in 2012
Philadelphia in 2013 (with Orton)
Green Bay in 2014

The only 2 games I did not believe the Cowboys would win out of that list is the last 2. That leaves 6 other games that I believed were winnable. I don't expect a perfect 6-0 record there, but is wanting something like 3-3 unreasonable?

That's why I discuss this so much. I had all kinds of confidence in Romo. I believed the team could win with him. We just needed to line back up the next year and give it another go. But I refuse to now look back with hindsight and claim he didn't have a chance to try and save him from criticism. Romo fans were confident the team was going to win with him, they weren't setting the bar low. They were pumping up expectations while the Romo haters were trying to lower them during his career. That's a big about face in confidence level now that his career is over.

Good grief.

Seattle in 06. Yes they absolutely were good enough to beat them. The fg miscue is all that is remembered but there was a lot more to it, like glenn fumbling in the endzone for instance....

NY Giants 07- Yes...they had beat them 3 straight times going into the playoff game, Twice at NY. Romo to Crayton for the GW TD should have been all time NFL comeback Highlight. Oh well.
and to be clear here, the giants not only ended Romo's season but Gruden/Garcia, Favre/McCarthy's and Brady/Belichik's...

Philadelphia 08 - NO. They beat them earlier in the year but after the 2 games in 6 days vs NY and Baltimore two of the most physical teams in the league the cowboys were walking mash unit..including Romo's 1st serious back injury
after Fred Robbins hit romo in the back in the third quarter. It was an almost impossible situation for Dallas Mentally after the ending of the Ravens game.

Minnesota 09 - 50/50 I believe if this game is played in Dallas, Dallas wins. Nobody Beat Minnesota at the metrodome in 2009 they went 9-0. The offensive line had no chance against that front in that environment...Even still
Gerald Sensebaugh made one of the worst plays I have ever seen in any game giving up that first TD when Dallas was holding its own.

NY Giants 11 - No....Like the Minnesota game in 09 the environment was tough. The line could not hold up and manning always put big numbers up vs our defense. Dallas had to take chances in this game and they
were not equipped to do so. Tip your hat to the giants...they were surging and the cowboys blew it. Had bailey not had his kick blocked to go to OT in the first meeting ( Or missed the winning fg at Arizona the week before) this game would not have mattered. Dallas had a 34-22 lead with 5 minutes to go and the giants backed up on a 3rd and and scandrick got beat for 20 yards on a corner route...Uggh that game..the ball in the
lights....Tip your hat to the giants, they beat Dallas, then Matt Ryan's Falcons, Rodgers Packers, Harbaughs 49ers and Brady/Belichick again.

Washington 12 - Yes. This is a fail on everyone's part. This game falls on Romo. That late interception was too risky of a play and the difference maker. Huge letdown.

Philly 13 - Yes I thought they could win because they were at home even though the defense was dreadful they played a very physical tough game and orton found himself in a situation Romo had put on him many times....

GB 14 - Yes I thought Dallas should have won. I thought they had a great gameplan and had the perfect chemistry and abilty to go in their and win. The biggest play of the game to me besides the dez caught it bad call was James Hanna
Not holding onto the fumbled punt he had recovered and let it slip away. If he Hangs onto that Dallas has a quick easy score really giving them the advantage.....Also if Dez's catch had not been overruled I believe Dallas
Would have got a stop and won the game. During the 2014 season Dallas had I believe 9 times got stops and won the game in that situation after the offense had given them the lead. THis 2014 team had the chemistry and
timely play making to go win the whole thing. Its forever going to suck.

 

[Hennessy_King]

Good grief.

Seattle in 06. Yes they absolutely were good enough to beat them. The fg miscue is all that is remembered but there was a lot more to it, like glenn fumbling in the endzone for instance....

NY Giants 11 - Had bailey not had his kick blocked to go to OT in the first meeting ( Or missed the winning fg at Arizona the week before) this game would not have mattered.

Just those 2 alone make me want to throw up. Romo was the field goal holder since 2004. So he had 3 years of experience being a holder so when people say that's not a QB's job that was HIS job for 3 years.

And the Arizona game you can blame Garrett for when he decided to be the first in history to ice his own kicker that lead us to missing the playoffs.

 

[khiladi]

Anybody that blames Romo is an idiot, when Jason Garrett was ENTIRELY in control of the offense until 2013 and didn't allow Romo in game-planning until Jerry forced it on top from 2013 and started giving him input in the draft. Teams like the Commanders simply had free-runners, because of the predictability of the offense and not enough blockers in a deep threat offense that required time for WRs to get downfield..

The first year they banished Jason Garrett from play-calling entirely, Romo was robbed in Lambeau. And Murray fumbling what would have been basically a60 yard TD on a wide-open hole via a run potion fake to the left called by Romo..

The people blaming Romo are Dak worshippers and guys who spent years defending Garrett while bashing Romo, saying things like he was checking out of the run plays Garrett was calling, but are now saying "I was a Garrett supporter for years, but.." because Dak frankly sucks and they got to look for excuses for his garbage play, as if Garrett is in charge of the offense anymore..

 

[Aviano90]

• 2009___Playoff loss at Minn…they kicked crap out of dallas…no contrest and no chance with road, indoor pass rush, injured LT, and Favre/Minny doing what they did all year

Thanks for responding. I'm just going to take this one game right here to make the point I am trying to make here.

The tone leading up to this game was the Cowboys had become Super Bowl favorites after just thoroughly beating Philly in back to back weeks (week 17 to secure home field for the Wild Card game and then beating them in the Wild Card game).

Are you claiming that you were thinking against the grain and Dallas didn't stand a chance of beating Minnesota, or are you simply using hindsight to describe the butt whopping they put on us?

Most people did not have foresight the Cowboys stood no chance. If you did, then kudos to you.

 

[DFWJC]

Thanks for responding. I'm just going to take this one game right here to make the point I am trying to make here.

The tone leading up to this game was the Cowboys had become Super Bowl favorites after just thoroughly beating Philly in back to back weeks (week 17 to secure home field for the Wild Card game and then beating them in the Wild Card game).

Are you claiming that you were thinking against the grain and Dallas didn't stand a chance to beating Minnesota, or are you simply using hindsight to describe the butt whopping they put on us?

Most people did not have foresight the Cowboys stood no chance. If you did, then kudos to you.

I will say I was hopeful, because I'm a fan.
But Minny was awfully tough at home that year. Unbeaten. And great pass rushes at home in domes are really tough to handle when the other team also scores at high rate.
You never know in a one game scenario though.
That applies to all games.
If that's your point, you win.

Anyway, I was just adding context to the discussion instead of only including games we lost.

I REALLY don't wish to dissect this any further and already regret falling into this rabbit hole.
You have made your point well enough.
There's others here that have the time and patience to go through this deeper, but I'd really like my participation trophy for actually replying to this at all...and wish to move on.

 

[Aviano90]

I will say I was hopeful, because I'm a fan.
But Minny was awfully tough at home that year. Unbeaten. And great pass rushes at home in domes are really tough to handle when the other team also scores at high rate.
You never know in a one game scenario though.
That applies to all games.
If that's your point, you win.

Anyway, I was just adding context to the discussion instead of only including games we lost.

I REALLY don't wish to dissect this any further and already regret falling into this rabbit hole.
You have made your point well enough.
There's others hear that have the time and patience to go through this deeper, but I'd really like my participation trophy for actually replying to this at all...and wish to move on.

Fair enough.

 

[erod]

How many times are you going to repeat the same thing? Your posts are some of the jokes!

Football IQ insult in 3...2...1...

The belly laugh is that you think you have a point. You sincerely believe that somewhere in your third-grade exposes in this thread, you've made a salient point.

What is this, you're 4th or 5th username here? It's easy to spot your type. They come and go around here all the time.

 

[G2]

The belly laugh is that you think you have a point. You sincerely believe that somewhere in your third-grade exposes in this thread, you've made a salient point.

What is this, you're 4th or 5th username here? It's easy to spot your type. They come and go around here all the time.

1st and only user name. Change the batteries in your magic 8-ball. You're getting slow. More BS.

 

[erod]

I agree, but I think we are seeing the same thing from different angles, but I think we are really an 8-8 fanbase. We will settle for that as long as our pet player/coach doesn't get blamed for it.

The blame I place within this franchise isn't on players or coaches. Jerry misevaluates areas of need and over-exaggerates strengths.

Head coaches are castrated the minute they walk in the door as Jerry constantly contradicts them and cuts them at the knees. He's P.T. Barnum in the flesh.

Romo was left to the wolves for years, and now Dak is being glorified as something he won't be for years, if ever.

Jerry can't put his pom-poms down long enough as owner to be objective as a supposed GM. And his personal misgivings cause him to gravitate to troubled players he relates with.

This team is mismanaged up top, and the trickle-down avalanche is impossible for the team to avoid.