We drafted a top OT in the draft and people want to sign an old OT free agent?

[phildadon86]

What I see with Josh Ball is a player with ability but one that needs reps to improve.
- I'm not certain practice reps would even be enough.
- Steele got those types of reps in 2020 and became a solid player in 2021.

I dont know if trotting him out there at LT and risking your QB is the smart play either though.

I wish football was more like soccer where you could loan players out to lesser teams to get game experience lol

 

[CWR]

So let me get this straight,
We drafted a top OT in the draft that most thought was really the 2nd best OT in the Draft and ppl here want us to sign some old and washed up OT Free agent, (Really) Wow.
McG had already beaten out Tyler for the LG spot so move Tyler to his Natural Position of LOT and ppl are complaining. Also we have two OT that we are developing Ball and Wojo, Ball has played better w every snap so whats the beef, let them play ball like they were drafted for

I've come around to the idea Tyler is our future and maybe it should start now. This is all based on the premise Tyron is done. I really hope he retires after this. His body can't do it anymore. It's time to move forward.

 

[Sydla]

It all honesty it is probably too soon to write a guy like Tyler Smith off or Josh Ball off (Waletzko is injured so he shouldn't even be in the discussion). But as this team is constructed, with the cap implications going forward, this team is in win now mode. You shouldn't take a season to let a kid learn at arguably the 2nd most important position on offense. xwalker pointed it out above when he said Steele got a lot of reps and wasn't good and it took him a year to become serviceable.

I think the prudent move from the start was to have brought in a decent vet. It gives you another option at LT. Gives you someone that could hold down the spot, even if just for 4-5 games, while you then try to get Tyler Smith up to speed. Or Josh Ball improves with more camp/practice time.

 

[Ken]

LOL at writing off all the guys who have pointed out Ball's poor play as "idiot media" people who don't pay attention to practices, etc.

Sturm probably pays attention more than you. And he has concerns about Ball.

Right and he posted the 3 run play misses that I already referenced.

2nd NFL game at LT. He has gotten progressively better since TC opened. That is what you want to see from a young OL.

The Cowboys, who know lineman better than most, see him progressing everyday and they like his level of talent. They likely, see him in another 6 weeks being better than anything they could sign right now.

Sorry, i watched these yahoos at TC practice. They were all not paying attention. The only ones who even watched the kickers (arguably the biggest hole on the team at the time) were Mickey and Broadus. Everyone else was on the other side of the field watching god knows what. Same during 11 on 11s. Some watched but I don't know what they are seeing.

 

[Ken]

The issue here is that it's too soon to write a guy like Tyler Smith off or Josh Ball off (Waletzko is injured so he shouldn't even be in the discussion). But as this team is constructed, with the cap implications going forward, this team is in win now mode. You shouldn't take a season to let a kid learn at arguably the 2nd most important position on offense. xwalker pointed it out above when he said Steele got a lot of reps and wasn't good and it took him a year to become serviceable.

I think the prudent move from the start was to have brought in a decent vet. It gives you another option at LT. Gives you someone that could hold down the spot, even if just for 4-5 games, while you then try to get Tyler Smith up to speed. Or Josh Ball improves with more camp/practice time.

Couple of things...

Waletzko is now playing, so we will see on him.

You bring a Vet (none of which solves the problem btw) and they immediately stop progress. I believe the cowboys have cracked the code on developing young players....let them play. They realized that when you lets these young guys play their development increases exponentially. This is why you don't see them bringing in the progress stoppers anymore.

 

[Ken]

What I see with Josh Ball is a player with ability but one that needs reps to improve.
- I'm not certain practice reps would even be enough.
- Steele got those types of reps in 2020 and became a solid player in 2021.

I agree and I think this is the exact thought process the Cowboys are using as well.

It isn't where he is right now (which is much better than he was 3 weeks ago) but where will he be a month from now.

 

[zrinkill]

 

[Sydla]

Right and he posted the 3 run play misses that I already referenced.

2nd NFL game at LT. He has gotten progressively better since TC opened. That is what you want to see from a young OL.

The Cowboys, who know lineman better than most, see him progressing everyday and they like his level of talent. They likely, see him in another 6 weeks being better than anything they could sign right now.

Sorry, i watched these yahoos at TC practice. They were all not paying attention. The only ones who even watched the kickers (arguably the biggest hole on the team at the time) were Mickey and Broadus. Everyone else was on the other side of the field watching god knows what. Same during 11 on 11s. Some watched but I don't know what they are seeing.

He was equally poor in both preseason games. So the idea that he's gotten "progressively" better is more myth than reality. He's not ready to be our starting LT at this point but because of how Jerry and Stephen handled the position in the offseason this year, what we are left with is trying to find the best option out of a lot of bad options. Ball has struggled in camp. He's been up and down and has had some real issues in preseason games. Waletzko is a late round rookie, who was a long shot to make an impact early anyway. And now he has a bum shoulder that they are hoping won't hinder him this year because they are desperate. And then there is Tyler Smith that by their own acknowledgement is raw and McCarthy admitted wasn't really ready to play OT in the NFL and needed to find his groove at LG first.

They botched OT. And now are in scramble mode trying to band aid a really big gash.

Sturm pays attention. Writing him off as some sort of media idiot is silly.

 

[Denim Chicken]

So let me get this straight,
We drafted a top OT in the draft that most thought was really the 2nd best OT in the Draft and ppl here want us to sign some old and washed up OT Free agent, (Really) Wow.
McG had already beaten out Tyler for the LG spot so move Tyler to his Natural Position of LOT and ppl are complaining. Also we have two OT that we are developing Ball and Wojo, Ball has played better w every snap so whats the beef, let them play ball like they were drafted for

You lost me at trying to sell Ball.

 

[Sydla]

Couple of things...

Waletzko is now playing, so we will see on him.

You bring a Vet (none of which solves the problem btw) and they immediately stop progress. I believe the cowboys have cracked the code on developing young players....let them play. They realized that when you lets these young guys play their development increases exponentially. This is why you don't see them bringing in the progress stoppers anymore.

Waletzko was a long shot to be able to make an impact anyway as a late round, raw OT. And he has a shoulder issue now. Any sane fan here that isn't trying to make excuses for the front office would admit it's a real long shot he can do much of anything that could help the team at this point. He's a long term project.

Put it another way. If their OT situation was fine, they would have shelved him for the season to let his shoulder get better. But with Ball's struggles in the two games, they knew they had an issue at backup OT so they figured give Waletzko a shot here even with a bad shoulder.

They are desperate, any normal non-homer fan, can see it.

 

[morasp]

Here’s some tape on Ball vs Chargers. Not great.

There is a more comprehensive video posted yesteday that showed that play, one other mental error on a line stunt, and many other good ones.

 

[J-man]

He was an OT with a very high ceiling, but was/is raw and needs coaching/time to develop those skills to reach that ceiling.

 

[Einstein]

Here is the NFL Draft rankings per NFL.com: https://www.nfl.com/draft/tracker/prospects/ot/all-colleges/all-statuses/2022?page=1

I think Smith should be moved to LT personally, but he wasn't the 2nd best in the draft, but there was 1 guy ranked ahead of him per this site...

 

[NotForLong]

Right and he posted the 3 run play misses that I already referenced.

2nd NFL game at LT. He has gotten progressively better since TC opened. That is what you want to see from a young OL.

The Cowboys, who know lineman better than most, see him progressing everyday and they like his level of talent. They likely, see him in another 6 weeks being better than anything they could sign right now.

Sorry, i watched these yahoos at TC practice. They were all not paying attention. The only ones who even watched the kickers (arguably the biggest hole on the team at the time) were Mickey and Broadus. Everyone else was on the other side of the field watching god knows what. Same during 11 on 11s. Some watched but I don't know what they are seeing.

Nice post

 

[DeaconMoss]

People aren’t saying Tyler Smith cannot play LT.
Peoples concerns are, he is A)hurt, B)taken minimal snaps there and C)his first game time snaps will come opening night at LT.

Live look from Shaq Barrett, Akiem Hicks and Vita Vea right now

 

[CowboyRoy]

So let me get this straight,
We drafted a top OT in the draft that most thought was really the 2nd best OT in the Draft and ppl here want us to sign some old and washed up OT Free agent, (Really) Wow.
McG had already beaten out Tyler for the LG spot so move Tyler to his Natural Position of LOT and ppl are complaining. Also we have two OT that we are developing Ball and Wojo, Ball has played better w every snap so whats the beef, let them play ball like they were drafted for

He was drafted to possibly eventually take over at LT down the road and to play guard this year. Most reps have been at guard.

What is it that you are having trouble understanding?

Ball SUCKS!!!!

 

[Pantone282C]

Good post; however, McGovern really hasn't won the LG job.
- McCarthy might say that to the media, but the way they played them in the preseason games says otherwise.

Tyler started the games at LG and McGovern played RG.
- They wouldn't have Zach Martin play LG or Tyron play RT if they did play starters in a preseason game.
- Tyler has not taken any snaps at OT in training camp or preseason games.

I agree that Ball or Waletzko are probably better options than last seasons backup Ty Nsekhe or past swing tackles like Cam Fleming.

They always have the option to move Steele to LT. He started 6 games at LT last season and 8 at RT.

Steele was better at RT than LT.

 

[Ken]

Waletzko was a long shot to be able to make an impact anyway as a late round, raw OT. And he has a shoulder issue now. Any sane fan here that isn't trying to make excuses for the front office would admit it's a real long shot he can do much of anything that could help the team at this point. He's a long term project.

Put it another way. If their OT situation was fine, they would have shelved him for the season to let his shoulder get better. But with Ball's struggles in the two games, they knew they had an issue at backup OT so they figured give Waletzko a shot here even with a bad shoulder.

They are desperate, any normal non-homer fan, can see it.

Not every late round pick is equal. Not every late round pick from every team is equal.

Shoulder issue.... it's overblown, IMO. The fact he is still out there tells me the Cowboys think he can play with this "issue". I know this because I had the same injury in both my shoulders. Only time you need surgery is when it starts falling out when you sleep or sneeze lol. It can absolutely be rehabbed by strengthening the muscles around it. So people stuck on "shoulder issue" only say so because they don't know.

If the Cowboys were "desperate" they would already be having try outs with Vets and/or made a trade for someone. They are not desperate....yet.

 

[phildadon86]

Right and he posted the 3 run play misses that I already referenced.

2nd NFL game at LT. He has gotten progressively better since TC opened. That is what you want to see from a young OL.

The Cowboys, who know lineman better than most, see him progressing everyday and they like his level of talent. They likely, see him in another 6 weeks being better than anything they could sign right now.

Sorry, i watched these yahoos at TC practice. They were all not paying attention. The only ones who even watched the kickers (arguably the biggest hole on the team at the time) were Mickey and Broadus. Everyone else was on the other side of the field watching god knows what. Same during 11 on 11s. Some watched but I don't know what they are seeing.

Im sorry.

The Cowboys who know lineman better than most? Do you hear yourself when you speak?

The Cowboys were willing to let a HOF guard go to draft Manziel, drafted Chaz Green, etc.

They drafted 3 lineman in the first round. Its not exactly like they have hit on any lineman after that round in what seems like forever. Again. Giving credit to this front office when it isnt warranted.

 

[FVSTONE]

So let me get this straight,
We drafted a top OT in the draft that most thought was really the 2nd best OT in the Draft and ppl here want us to sign some old and washed up OT Free agent, (Really) Wow.
McG had already beaten out Tyler for the LG spot so move Tyler to his Natural Position of LOT and ppl are complaining. Also we have two OT that we are developing Ball and Wojo, Ball has played better w every snap so whats the beef, let them play ball like they were drafted for

Don't think you can count on Tyler to plug and play, since he's ALREADY dealing with an injury.