Which Would You Want

[jem88]

I'd take Moss anyday over T.O. Moss has never been anything but dominant and with a number of QBs (Brad Johnson, Randall Cunningham, Jeff George and Dante Culpepper.) People point to Garcia being an inferior QB, but in his prime (a time when Owens put up huge numbers), he was better than Johnson, Cunningham and George (during their time with Moss of course, since Cunningham in his Eagle days was better than Garcia.) In 2003, Owens had a disappointing season and was hardly the consumate teammate (reaming out coaches, teammates and developing alligator arms.) As for his returning in time for the SuperBowl, anyone who thinks T.O. did that for the sake of the team, rather than say, personal glory or increased negotiation leverage, is sadly mistaken.

 

[dargonking999]

I'm sorry but when Moss becomse a complete receiver then you can say that, but right now i ahve never seen Moss go willingly over the middle unless there was a defender in sight, i havent seen Moss take a hit get up and go right back at the guy and catch the ball again, I havent seen Moss fight for a ball, i havent seen him do anything but run a fly route and wait for the ball to fall into his arms. TO is a more complete reciever thna moss, which is why he had 14 TD's in 14 games, which is why even as bad as Mcnabb played he still went for 100 yards in the SB, Owens always makesthe play when has moss ever done that for his team.

 

[Alexander]

People point to Garcia being an inferior QB, but in his prime (a time when Owens put up huge numbers), he was better than Johnson, Cunningham and George (during their time with Moss of course, since Cunningham in his Eagle days was better than Garcia.)

All of those QBs were gunslingers who simply catered to what Moss does best. They threw the ball long and deep and let Moss run under it. The next time Moss runs a precise route and makes a great catch of an errant ball in traffic will be the first time.

In 2003, Owens had a disappointing season and was hardly the consumate teammate (reaming out coaches, teammates and developing alligator arms.)

Moss has shown alligator arms every day he has been in the league. He is also no saint when it comes down to reaming out teammates in public. He ripped into Culpepper several times. I guess that is all forgotten because it is much more fashionable (and easy) to rip into Owens.

As for his returning in time for the SuperBowl, anyone who thinks T.O. did that for the sake of the team, rather than say, personal glory or increased negotiation leverage, is sadly mistaken.

Purely speculative, without a shread of tangible proof.

 

[jem88]

I'm sorry but when Moss becomse a complete receiver then you can say that, but right now i ahve never seen Moss go willingly over the middle unless there was a defender in sight, i havent seen Moss take a hit get up and go right back at the guy and catch the ball again, I havent seen Moss fight for a ball, i havent seen him do anything but run a fly route and wait for the ball to fall into his arms. TO is a more complete reciever thna moss, which is why he had 14 TD's in 14 games, which is why even as bad as Mcnabb played he still went for 100 yards in the SB, Owens always makesthe play when has moss ever done that for his team.

Dargon, if you're going to point to touchdowns, than perhaps we should mention that Moss had 13 tds in 12 games last year and for his career, has 90 tds to Owens' 95, despite playing 2 less seasons than T.O.

As far as Moss' style, who cares? If the guy is able to consistently get open long and make the catch then why go away from the bread and butter. It's like saying Eddie George is a more complete (which you seem to take as meaning 'better') rb than Barry Sanders, because he's able to grind out the short yardage.

Given that Moss and Owens are even when it comes to attitude and status as a teammate, the best barometer is stats, and here Moss has the advantage: Owens' Career avg- 74 catches, 1086 yds, 10.5 tds
Moss' Career avg- 82 catches, 1306 yds, 12.9 tds

 

[dargonking999]

Dargon, if you're going to point to touchdowns, than perhaps we should mention that Moss had 13 tds in 12 games last year and for his career, has 90 tds to Owens' 95, despite playing 2 less seasons than T.O.

As far as Moss' style, who cares? If the guy is able to consistently get open long and make the catch then why go away from the bread and butter. It's like saying Eddie George is a more complete (which you seem to take as meaning 'better') rb than Barry Sanders, because he's able to grind out the short yardage.

Given that Moss and Owens are even when it comes to attitude and status as a teammate, the best barometer is stats, and here Moss has the advantage: Owens' Career avg- 74 catches, 1086 yds, 10.5 tds
Moss' Career avg- 82 catches, 1306 yds, 12.9 tds

Wow thats so impressive, but uhh who's had more success the last time i checked Owens lead hsi team to a 13-3 record, and has played in the SB, what ever happened to the great Moss

 

[dargonking999]

and that wasjust with his brand new team the iggles.

 

[KDWilliams85]

[/font][/font]

Are you kidding?

The Pro Bowl?

And it was doubtful that he could play in the Super Bowl and yet he did. I would wager Moss would have sat that one out.

Moss hasn't been in that position so it'd be difficult to say.

So why did he even bother to leave if he was such a good teammate? If it served no purpose, why do it? He was disgusted by something, and that makes him a good teammate how?

I don't condone what he did.

How has Owens blamed anyone? He called out Garcia for being a system QB and a poor leader. Well, he is a backup in Detroit now. Like the fellow or not, he had a point. Garcia was not very good. He called out McNabb. From what I could see, McNabb choked in the Super Bowl, while Owens laid it out on the line.

You don't have to like him to acknowledge that on an elementary level, he is right.

Owens makes it sound like everyone but him is responsible. Owens did his part and so did McNabb and Garcia. Garcia & McNabb aren't solely responsible for the fate that befell them respectively. Hence, Owens is seen as a martyr when he isn't one. He's more like the goat and he deserves much worse. He may have played but he wasn't the only one who blew it. He can't blame any one specific person for a team effort that just wasn't enough.

Filing a grievance has nothing to do with being a teammate. He did not like the team he was traded for and wanted to be a free agent. He had no allegience to Baltimore.

I laugh at that. Terrell Owens wanted his way when he had no leverage or position to make it that way. So, he had to file a grievance with the NFLPA over a decision the GM made. Owens was the property of the Ravens and Owens had no place to go. So, he had the NFLPA revoke the trade and SF effectively released him. So, again... the NFLPA gave him a grievance that he wouldn't have had unless he complained. His paperwork wasn't filed on time. That's the fault of T.O and not of Baltimore or San Francisco.

And who was "right"? Keyshawn or Jon Gruden?

Keyshawn has been a great teammate in Dallas. That does not mean he was not in a bad situation under Gruden in Tampa any more than Glenn was in a bad situation in Green Bay and New England. We do not know what goes on behind the scenes. Perhaps Owens is a victim of circumstance and misunderstanding, as he and others have stated.

Owens isn't a victim of circumstance. If you want to place blame on Keyshawn or Gruden, you should get them both. They both contributed to the situation effectively.

Owens' holdout and his attitude is his own. He can't "afford" to blame himself. He does have a family to look after.

We get tidbits. And from the evidence that has been demonstrated by commentary from Viking teammates, Moss will not be missed. If your point is correct, you would see many more people upset. They aren't. In fact, most seem content. The only person who has a problem with Owens is McNabb and even he appears to be willing to put it aside.

Despite their vocal about Moss, he will indeed be missed. Troy Williamson has big shoes to fill and Randy Moss was a lynch pin to that offense.

McNabb is a teammate. He may lead that offense but he knows and is willing to admit if and when something he's done cost his team a win. McNabb has been a bigger man than T.O. will ever be because of it. Owens feels as if he's always right. McNabb can admit when he's wrong.

T.O. is wrong to strap his team like he is. He was wrong to place the blame solely on McNabb after the Super Bowl. He was wrong to hold out when he's getting paid. He was wrong to blow off Baltimore because he didn't like them. Furthermore, he had the NFLPA bail him out of a situation he put himself in.

I don't know about you... but Owens isn't a victim. He's just a windbag that is big enough to any team to bend over and take the shaft for him.

 

[jem88]

Wow thats so impressive, but uhh who's had more success the last time i checked Owens lead hsi team to a 13-3 record, and has played in the SB, what ever happened to the great Moss

He got injured and played on a team that was clearly inferior to the one on which Owens played.

 

[dargonking999]

He got injured and played on a team that was clearly inferior to the one on which Owens played.

Colepeppe>Mcnabb

Minn RB>iggles RB


Minn 2 3 WR> iggles 2 3 WR

Tell me where Minn Off is inferior to the iggles.

and second The eagles had a great defense so they never had to score as much as the Vikings did, which is why Moss had so many TD's,as did the rest of the WR crop.

 

[KDWilliams85]

He got injured and played on a team that was clearly inferior to the one on which Owens played.

Offensively, no. Minneosta and Philadelphia are on par with each other offensively. Philadelphia just had the better defense.

 

[dargonking999]

He got injured and played on a team that was clearly inferior to the one on which Owens played.

and ownes faced a season ending injury and stil played in the SB and got 100+ yards.

 

[jem88]

All of those QBs were gunslingers who simply catered to what Moss does best. They threw the ball long and deep and let Moss run under it. The next time Moss runs a precise route and makes a great catch of an errant ball in traffic will be the first time.



Moss has shown alligator arms every day he has been in the league. He is also no saint when it comes down to reaming out teammates in public. He ripped into Culpepper several times. I guess that is all forgotten because it is much more fashionable (and easy) to rip into Owens.



Purely speculative, without a shread of tangible proof.

So perhaps Moss deserves equal praise for soldiering on during the season and keeping his consecutive starts streak alive. Much of what goes on around here is speculation, even more so when it comes to individual motives. However, given Owens' past and present actions, I have a hard time swallowing the whole 'Willis Reed' thing. He couldn't stand the idea of not playing on the biggest stage. He played well, since he is a very good player and deserves credit for that, but he gets no bonus points from me for what he did.

 

[jem88]

and ownes faced a season ending injury and stil played in the SB and got 100+ yards.

And didn't play in the 2 postseason games that got them to the Superbowl.

 

[dargonking999]

And didn't play in the 2 postseason games that got them to the Superbowl.

really wow i didnt know you were suppose to play with screws in your leg, in all the games, he wasnt even suppose to play in the SB, dont hadn that to me

 

[dargonking999]

So perhaps Moss deserves equal praise for soldiering on during the season and keeping his consecutive starts streak alive. Much of what goes on around here is speculation, even more so when it comes to individual motives. However, given Owens' past and present actions, I have a hard time swallowing the whole 'Willis Reed' thing. He couldn't stand the idea of not playing on the biggest stage. He played well, since he is a very good player and deserves credit for that, but he gets no bonus points from me for what he did.

You cannot takl down on a player of motives you dont know, you dont know why he cameback, maybe just maybe he wanted to WIN the SB, not just play in it, the last time i checked thats what it was all about

 

[ravidubey]

Terrell Owens is the best in football and has been since about 1998.

 

[Sarge]

I'll take Keyshawn.

Over Moss?

Hmmm.

Uh, ......... no.

 

[LaTunaNostra]

When Tuna was asked last year in a pc what receiver he considered the best his answer was Tory Holt.

Okay, irrelevant...

Moss v Owens, both extremely unlikable, but I will take Owens for his willingness to improve his game and for being a more complete receiver.

 

[TwentyOne]

michael irvin says take TO. and irvin knows a little bit about receivers and receiving.

Moss. Far more dangerous, will force Defences to change their game planning completely. TO doesn't give you this but he is a good one too.

I don't care what MI says even tough he for sure knows what he is talking about

 

[dargonking999]

Moss. Far more dangerous, will force Defences to change their game planning completely. TO doesn't give you this but he is a good one too.

I don't care what MI says even tough he for sure knows what he is talking about

Moss only makes you back up your FS, TO takes controlof the ENTIRE field, not just the distance, as CB get faster they will keep up with Moss and his numbers will go down, meanwhile TO well continue to get his because he plays all overthe field, and thats why TO is a better chocie than Moss