Who is winning championships without a Franchise QB?

[Diehardblues]

Can’t say I see many franchise QBs that aren’t elite on this list.

Flacco, Eli Manning are two I’d argue. But you’re looking for specific arguments and I’m broad stroking the point.

 

[Diehardblues]

I will try to find the article where Troy Vincent, who is a vice president of the NFL was quoted as saying that every Super Bowl winning team for the last 30 years had a top 10 defense. BTW, you replied to that same comment where I started out by talking about Dilfer and then you didn't say you were referring to the defense part of it. Next time when replying to a comment that has multiple things in it you might want to say what thing you're disputing.
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Fair enough . But anyone who would t consider the Manning’s Franchise QB’s would be bizarre .

 

[blueblood70]

looks like you either need a top 10 aggressive defense and solid qb or an elite QB and decent defense

having both guarantees a trip there but you need one or the other..

daks not elite and our defense would need to climb from 32 to 10 in one offseason or two?

so looks like this post shows dak signing at over 35 would be mistakes as analytics show we are a way's away. Might as well roll with average bridge vet and work on the rest of the team while grooming draft pick at qb..

 

[blueblood70]

Flacco, Eli Manning are two I’d argue. But you’re looking for specific arguments and I’m broad stroking the point.

but they and the top defenses so ?? you have lost control of whatever point you were making because the DC have neither ..

 

[nightrain]

I would argue that many if not most teams have a "franchise" QB and a lot of them are mediocre lacking the ability to elevate the team. Some of those QBs have been jettisoned recently, but their former teams paid them mightily and in some cases took a huge hit to get rid of them.

I wouldn't consider Brady a franchise QB with Tampa. He is a year to year merc, IMO.

 

[blueblood70]

Ya the browns who for decades was so bad that they were in the top 5 drafting every year and they finally broke away from that. How quickly you forget that in 2018 the Cowboys went to the divisional round with Prescott only to see the defense give up not one but two 100+ yard rushers.
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tell that dude ALMOST dont count the fact browns couldnt beat KC after losing mahomes says it wasn't even close.. the browns D gave up some big 1st downs to a backup qb.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Yep
No doubt I’d rather have one of the more Elite QB’s. But the prospect of any success without a Franchise QB or Elite defense is bleak at best.

Which one in your opinion is more difficult to obtain?

 

[PJTHEDOORS]

looks like you either need a top 10 aggressive defense and solid qb or an elite QB and decent defense

having both guarantees a trip there but you need one or the other..

daks not elite and our defense would need to climb from 32 to 10 in one offseason or two?

so looks like this post shows dak signing at over 35 would be mistakes as analytics show we are a way's away. Might as well roll with average bridge vet and work on the rest of the team while grooming draft pick at qb..

Dak's elite. Hate has blinded judgement.

 

[gjkoeppen]

Fair enough . But anyone who would t consider the Manning’s Franchise QB’s would be bizarre .

Peyton Manning was more than a franchise QB he was an elite QB. He set NFL records that stood for several years.
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[CowboyRoy]

"Hater clowns".....interesting how the name calling needs to accompany any debate when it comes to re-signing Dak or not. I love the adult nature of this group.

Interesting how you always fall for the bait when I do it. I say hater clown and a hater clown comes running.

Why would you even care if you didnt feel slighted by the comment? Guilty conscience?

 

[eromeopolk]

It’s rare. And I’m not talking about Elite QB’s. Just Franchise QB’s.

The only exception is those Generational defenses but even they had closer to a Franchise QB.

Despite however you feel about our QB and or his value , he has us over a barrel. Mostly because we hadn’t caved in earlier seasons. 35 million a year for 4 years he was asking for last year looks pretty good now. We knew it was just going to cost us more by holding out.

Anyway, If the 3 year deal he’s demanding is too much for 41 million, etc which not many would argue , our chances of drafting and developing another franchise QB in the next couple years not very likely.

It’s basically a matter of lesser of two evils. Worse case scenarios.

I certainly see our top 10 offense with an over paid QB more likely to carry a rebuilding defense to a division title and playoffs than without a Franchise QB. And if the offense really gels and we hit in a couple draft picks on defense while a couple previous picks blossom we could have closer to an average defense .

If not then it basically becomes a total rebuild. Who has much hope this dysfunctional organization will get that right. And how many years are we away from being competitive again. I just don’t see how knowing what we know with this leadership we can be hopeful that’s a better alternative.

Every Team that invested in defense wins championships without "Franchise QBs".

Defense wins championships. Ask John Elway how many NFL Super Bowls he had to loss in a row because of inferior defense. Tom Brady had the luxury of a top 10 defense for every Super Bowl he won and lost to the team with the better DL losing multiple times the the Giants front four and Eli Manning who many argue is not a franchise QB (I disagree).

Defense wins championships, you run the ball to wins games, and you throw to score. If you have watched the REAL TRUE Dallas Cowboys for all the years I have, that formula would be ingrained in you by now. But now you have the Arlington Jonesboys with Jerry Dumbo GM Jones that believes offense sells tickets, any publicity makes you relevant, and the hell with the rest because the bank account is the scoreboard.

 

[CouchCoach]

First off, define a franchise QB v an elite one. Brees, Rodgers and Wilson are considered elite and each has one ring while E, Manning has two. Kelly, Marino and Tarkenton were considered elite and don't have a ring between them but I cannot make the argument that I will make about this team against the Bills and Vikings as they had complete teams.

The Cowboys could have/had Brady, Brees, Mahomes or Rodgers and still not have a trophy beyond 1995 or even a trip to the NFCCG because there is a fatal flaw, the inability to build a complete team. They cannot adequately identify even what they need, prioritize the positions.

Does it really matter what they do with Prescott or trade for Wilson or draft one? Is this QB the reason they haven't advanced in the playoffs?

There are 3 things necessary for any team to win the championship:

1. They must identify what will get them there and what is keeping them from getting there. This all about personnel, coaches and players, but begins with the owner hiring the GM.

2. They have to want it badly enough to do whatever is necessary to address and resolve issues with #1.

3. Luck. No team wins it all without some luck on their side.

I do not think the Cowboys can do #1 but I know for certain they are incapable of #2.

Doesn't matter who the Cowboys have at QB or how much they pay him as long as they continue to run the team as they do.

 

[JoeKing]

It’s rare. And I’m not talking about Elite QB’s. Just Franchise QB’s.

The only exception is those Generational defenses but even they had closer to a Franchise QB.

Despite however you feel about our QB and or his value , he has us over a barrel. Mostly because we hadn’t caved in earlier seasons. 35 million a year for 4 years he was asking for last year looks pretty good now. We knew it was just going to cost us more by holding out.

Anyway, If the 3 year deal he’s demanding is too much for 41 million, etc which not many would argue , our chances of drafting and developing another franchise QB in the next couple years not very likely.

It’s basically a matter of lesser of two evils. Worse case scenarios.

I certainly see our top 10 offense with an over paid QB more likely to carry a rebuilding defense to a division title and playoffs than without a Franchise QB. And if the offense really gels and we hit in a couple draft picks on defense while a couple previous picks blossom we could have closer to an average defense .

If not then it basically becomes a total rebuild. Who has much hope this dysfunctional organization will get that right. And how many years are we away from being competitive again. I just don’t see how knowing what we know with this leadership we can be hopeful that’s a better alternative.

Who's trying to win a championship without a franchise QB?

 

[Dre11]

I'm sorry but even a casual football fan thinks Brees and Manning were elite QB's so that must leave some other reason why you don't. Now if your feeling get hurt that easily for something that is said here by a lot of people here when someone says dumb things, then you need to toughen up your skin. If you think about it, that is an easy way out to explain why you said something that most consider foolish.
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Lol...i know you're not talking about feelings getting hurt, you're over in the other crying because people are talking about a player that was a free agent hopeful for the cowboys, that got tagged...lol

 

[CouchCoach]

This team hasn't wanted anything bad enough since 1995. If you remember, the team had to take it upon themselves to win super bowl 30 in spite of the terrible coaching they had with Switzer. t hasn't been the same since.

Winning takes sacrifice and this team is incapable of doing that.

It all comes down to the fact they do not have to win to be successful and there are no repercussions to losing.

 

[Diehardblues]

Who's trying to win a championship without a franchise QB?

We are if we let Dak go

 

[CouchCoach]

We are if we let Dak go

How do you know that?

 

[Diehardblues]

Every Team that invested in defense wins championships without "Franchise QBs".

Defense wins championships. Ask John Elway how many NFL Super Bowls he had to loss in a row because of inferior defense. Tom Brady had the luxury of a top 10 defense for every Super Bowl he won and lost to the team with the better DL losing multiple times the the Giants front four and Eli Manning who many argue is not a franchise QB (I disagree).

Defense wins championships, you run the ball to wins games, and you throw to score. If you have watched the REAL TRUE Dallas Cowboys for all the years I have, that formula would be ingrained in you by now. But now you have the Arlington Jonesboys with Jerry Dumbo GM Jones that believes offense sells tickets, any publicity makes you relevant, and the hell with the rest because the bank account is the scoreboard.

Good defense helps win championships but history shows that without Franchise QB’s unless on those rare occasions you have a Generational defense the percentages are greatly reduced .

 

[Diehardblues]

How do you know that?

Because the odds are nobody wins a championship with a Rookie qb. And few without a Franchise QB. That’s how we know. What exactly are you determining your thoughts on?

 

[Diehardblues]

Peyton Manning was more than a franchise QB he was an elite QB. He set NFL records that stood for several years.
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Possibly . That still to be determined. But I wasn’t arguing either of those comments . You really need to get that out of your head.

Did you ever find if there’s actually been any defenses not in top 10 winning championships? That’s what I was questioning.