Why I prefer Matt Jones over Bolden

[AsthmaField]

Can you name me any player heretofore mentioned that is better after the catch than TO or Witt?

Actually Witten has never impressed me that much with his run after the catch ability, his helmentless run not withstanding.

He lumbers around a little and then is brought down. There are a lot of guys who RAC better than Witten. He's just awesome at running routes, getting open and using his terrific hands to snag the ball... but RAC isn't his strong suit, IMO.

Now TO is terrific after the catch.

 

[McCordsville Cowboy]

Actually Witten has never impressed me that much with his run after the catch ability, his helmentless run not withstanding.

He lumbers around a little and then is brought down. There are a lot of guys who RAC better than Witten. He's just awesome at running routes, getting open and using his terrific hands to snag the ball... but RAC isn't his strong suit, IMO.

Now TO is terrific after the catch.

He might be the worst TE in the league after the catch. Everytime he catches it he will run where defenders are not and then get tackled by a CB.

I am not complaining though because he will prolong his career that way and save his knees. Smart move.

The only time I've ever seen him not do that is when he stiff armed Hawk.

 

[fortdick]

Actually Witten has never impressed me that much with his run after the catch ability, his helmentless run not withstanding.

He lumbers around a little and then is brought down. There are a lot of guys who RAC better than Witten. He's just awesome at running routes, getting open and using his terrific hands to snag the ball... but RAC isn't his strong suit, IMO.

Now TO is terrific after the catch.

He might be the worst TE in the league after the catch. Everytime he catches it he will run where defenders are not and then get tackled by a CB.

I am not complaining though because he will prolong his career that way and save his knees. Smart move.

The only time I've ever seen him not do that is when he stiff armed Hawk.

Now who is sniffing glue? Witt after the catch is outstanding. He isn't elusive, or fast, but it take a group of defenders to bring him down. A corner or a safety won't do it alone. Either they group tackle or a LB catches him from behind.

 

[McCordsville Cowboy]

Now who is sniffing glue? Witt after the catch is outstanding. He isn't elusive, or fast, but it take a group of defenders to bring him down. A corner or a safety won't do it alone. Either they group tackle or a LB catches him from behind.

You are not watching the same Jason Witten I am then... Rocky Top days dont count.

 

[khiladi]

wouldn't take 15-20 catches from either Witten or TO. Can you name me any player heretofore mentioned that is better after the catch than TO or Witt?

While Boldin may not be better than TO after the catch, he surely is better than Witten after the catch... Boldin is the Marion Barber of WRs...

 

[tomson75]

He might be the worst TE in the league after the catch. Everytime he catches it he will run where defenders are not and then get tackled by a CB.

I am not complaining though because he will prolong his career that way and save his knees. Smart move.

The only time I've ever seen him not do that is when he stiff armed Hawk.

Now who is sniffing glue? Witt after the catch is outstanding. He isn't elusive, or fast, but it take a group of defenders to bring him down. A corner or a safety won't do it alone. Either they group tackle or a LB catches him from behind.

The truth lies somewhere in between. While it certainly isn't his strong suit, he certainly isn't the worst in the league...not by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Big Country]

It's slow this time of year and everyone is speculating on how to add that final piece to win another Superbowl. My input is that we get Matt Jones and leave the Boldin's and R.Williams'es out of it. The latter won't help while Jones could really make the difference.

Now, before you think that I have been sniffing glue, think about what we have right now. Witten will get 90-100 receptions. TO will get 80-90. F. Jones and MBIII will get another 50 between them. Crayton might get 30-40. And a smattering of however will get another 20-30. If we throw in a Boldin or Williams, A. when are they going to get the ball? Who do you take catches from? TO? Witten? The RB's?

B. We need a guy who is a legitimate threat, not that they will get the ball, but to spread the defense and make them play honest. Crayton and Hurd are not fast enough. Austin is, but most folks know he doesn't run great routes and if he leaves his hands out overnight they will rust. C. Stanback is a possibility, but we aren't hearing anyone singing his praises, so I think that experiment is still in progress.

D. Matt Jones, or a Matt Jones like substance, would force free safeties to play honest. If they cheat over to TO's side, then they risk a big, fast guy taking it up the other sideline one on one with a corner. Even if you only throw the ball to him a couple times a game, he will impact the way defenses play.

E. Do you think Boldin or Williams would be happy in that role? Would you be willing to take the ball out of Witt's or TO's hands? We need a guy that is willing to take his one or two catches a game and not complain. Someone with a lot of speed and a small ego.

Signing TO to the extension said a lot about what the plans are for the next couple years at WR. I don't expect to see any big names in here until TO's game starts to slip. I wouldn't take a big name WR right now if he fell into our lap. Not enough balls to go around.

Now that I have spoken on the issue, it is a closed matter and we can move on and not discuss adding, Williams, Boldin, or even Johnson.

A. whenever the opposing defensive coordinator game plans to take one of the main threats away

B. are you saying that M Jones is more of a threat than R Williams or Bolden???

C. True but we're not even in training camp yet? I wouldn't make that assumption yet

D. are you kidding again... see B... his numbers don't even compare to the other two mentioned WRs

E. yes, the possibility of winning a super has that appeal to lots of players. ask the players in NE who were there the last 6 years.

 

[AsthmaField]

Now who is sniffing glue? Witt after the catch is outstanding. He isn't elusive, or fast, but it take a group of defenders to bring him down. A corner or a safety won't do it alone. Either they group tackle or a LB catches him from behind.

I never said you were sniffing glue... I just said that Witten isn't that impressive after the catch. It can take a lot of defenders to bring him down but to me, that isn't RAC. That is being strong and hard to get to the ground. After the catch and before he gets hit though, he's just average, IMO.

The truth lies somewhere in between. While it certainly isn't his strong suit, he certainly isn't the worst in the league...not by any stretch of the imagination.

Yeah, I don't think he's the worst, either... but he is just average in my opinion.

 

[fortdick]

The truth lies somewhere in between. While it certainly isn't his strong suit, he certainly isn't the worst in the league...not by any stretch of the imagination.

Boldin avg. 12 yac per reception

Witten 11.9 yac

Not a great big difference

 

[tomson75]

Boldin avg. 12 yac per reception

Witten 11.9 yac

Not a great big difference

Those aren't the YAC numbers. That's their avg. per catch total.

Boldin's YAC is 5.23, while Witten's is about 4.06.

Gates' is 4.16, FWIW.

 

[Cowboys2008]

Ok, now flip that around for a second.. Who increases the potency of TO and Witten simply by playing across from them, Boldin or Jones?

Is Jones a guy who will demand occasional double-teams, leaving TO in single ever?

Is Jones a guy, whom if/and or when, say TO were to get hurt, could step right up and be a substantial threat as the top guy getting the ball? Is he a guy we could see as the future top wideout for us after TO retires?

I can see the angle you're taking with this, but in reality a guy like Jones is no more proven than any of the other guys we have nesting down below TO.

I'll tell ya what though.. I'd take both of them in a heartbeat! Noway would I choose Jones over Boldin in that order however.

 

[cowboys2233]

Jones is faster than Crayton or Hurd.

quote]

And Randall Williams was faster than all of them, what is the point? Matt Jones is a big, dumb surfer-looking goofball who had a nice combine workout...that's it.

 

[dbair1967]

You're right, I think you've been sniffing glue.

:wink2:

I'll second that

would you also like Akili Smith over Payton Manning?

David

 

[DaBoys4Life]

It's slow this time of year and everyone is speculating on how to add that final piece to win another Superbowl. My input is that we get Matt Jones and leave the Boldin's and R.Williams'es out of it. The latter won't help while Jones could really make the difference.

Now, before you think that I have been sniffing glue, think about what we have right now. Witten will get 90-100 receptions. TO will get 80-90. F. Jones and MBIII will get another 50 between them. Crayton might get 30-40. And a smattering of however will get another 20-30. If we throw in a Boldin or Williams, when are they going to get the ball? Who do you take catches from? TO? Witten? The RB's?

We need a guy who is a legitimate threat, not that they will get the ball, but to spread the defense and make them play honest. Crayton and Hurd are not fast enough. Austin is, but most folks know he doesn't run great routes and if he leaves his hands out overnight they will rust. Stanback is a possibility, but we aren't hearing anyone singing his praises, so I think that experiment is still in progress.

Matt Jones, or a Matt Jones like substance, would force free safeties to play honest. If they cheat over to TO's side, then they risk a big, fast guy taking it up the other sideline one on one with a corner. Even if you only throw the ball to him a couple times a game, he will impact the way defenses play.

Do you think Boldin or Williams would be happy in that role? Would you be willing to take the ball out of Witt's or TO's hands? We need a guy that is willing to take his one or two catches a game and not complain. Someone with a lot of speed and a small ego.

Signing TO to the extension said a lot about what the plans are for the next couple years at WR. I don't expect to see any big names in here until TO's game starts to slip. I wouldn't take a big name WR right now if he fell into our lap. Not enough balls to go around.

Now that I have spoken on the issue, it is a closed matter and we can move on and not discuss adding, Williams, Boldin, or even Johnson.

:sarcasm:

 

[BehindEnemyLinez]

Is my premise that difficult to grasp?

Yes it is! What I'm seeing in your original post is that we would be a better (& happier?) team offensively w/ Owens, Crayton, Jones, and Hurd instead of Owens, Boldin, Crayton, and Hurd! Just reading it makes me want to :ralph: !! Who cares if Witten or Owens or Crayton ends up w/ a lesser amount of catches? If that's what most important to them then we're in trouble b/c they're obviously not focused on the one TRUE goal-A CHAMPIONSHIP!! That's the only "premise" I'm concerned with; the one that makes Dallas a better team. And adding Jones instead of Boldin (if both were available to Dallas) wouldn't accomplish that feat. But, hey, that's just one SANE man's opinion!

 

[Stash]

It's slow this time of year and everyone is speculating on how to add that final piece to win another Superbowl. My input is that we get Matt Jones and leave the Boldin's and R.Williams'es out of it. The latter won't help while Jones could really make the difference.

Now, before you think that I have been sniffing glue, think about what we have right now. Witten will get 90-100 receptions. TO will get 80-90. F. Jones and MBIII will get another 50 between them. Crayton might get 30-40. And a smattering of however will get another 20-30. If we throw in a Boldin or Williams, when are they going to get the ball? Who do you take catches from? TO? Witten? The RB's?

We need a guy who is a legitimate threat, not that they will get the ball, but to spread the defense and make them play honest. Crayton and Hurd are not fast enough. Austin is, but most folks know he doesn't run great routes and if he leaves his hands out overnight they will rust. Stanback is a possibility, but we aren't hearing anyone singing his praises, so I think that experiment is still in progress.

Matt Jones, or a Matt Jones like substance, would force free safeties to play honest. If they cheat over to TO's side, then they risk a big, fast guy taking it up the other sideline one on one with a corner. Even if you only throw the ball to him a couple times a game, he will impact the way defenses play.

Do you think Boldin or Williams would be happy in that role? Would you be willing to take the ball out of Witt's or TO's hands? We need a guy that is willing to take his one or two catches a game and not complain. Someone with a lot of speed and a small ego.

Signing TO to the extension said a lot about what the plans are for the next couple years at WR. I don't expect to see any big names in here until TO's game starts to slip. I wouldn't take a big name WR right now if he fell into our lap. Not enough balls to go around.

Now that I have spoken on the issue, it is a closed matter and we can move on and not discuss adding, Williams, Boldin, or even Johnson.

Being Matt Jones' official campaign manager I feel compelled to comment.

I see the point you're trying to make, but I think it needs to be fleshed out a bit more.

One thing you're doing is factoring in touches based on last season's numbers, which I don't think is accurate.

It's one thing to acquire a 'Matt Jones' and have him come in and fill a role. It's quite another to land a premier receiver and expect things to work the same way.

If the team were to acquire Roy Williams or Boldin (which I simply don't foresee happening), the offense would certainly be altered to fit the team's strengths.

You certainly wouldn't pay that cost to bring in a 'part-timer'.

I think you would certainly see an increase in the pass to run ratio, simply to utilize the offense's greatest strengths.

Another factor I'm surprised you didn't mention was cost.

The cost to acquire Matt Jones at this point is low. Most likely a late round draft choice and a salary of $625,000.00

Conversely, what is the cost for either Roy Williams or Anquan Boldin? 2009's first rounder and likely more. And then each would need a new contract, most likely at least $8 million per year.

From that point, you would have to look at return on investment. Could you conceivably get the production from either of them to justify what they cost?

One bonus would be that this team could survive an injury to Terrell Owens, which they otherwise couldn't. But that's a high price to pay for 'insurance'.

 

[joseephuss]

Dallas does not need Matt Jones. They really don't need Anquan Boldin, either, but Boldin would do so much more for Dallas than Jones. Boldin would be much more than a luxury if brought in.

Who would make other teams pay for doubling TO and Witten? Boldin.

Who would make other teams pay for doubling Boldin and Witten? TO

Would would make other teams pay for doubling Matt Jones and Witten? Trick question. No team is going to double Matt Jones.

Anquan Boldin would cost more to get, but he is a proven product. Matt Jones at this point is not worth trading a draft pick to acquire. Bring him in after he gets cut and if he helps the team that will be great. He is just not needed enough to trade a draft pick. Boldin is.

 

[joseephuss]

One bonus would be that this team could survive an injury to Terrell Owens, which they otherwise couldn't. But that's a high price to pay for 'insurance'.

Boldin would not be insurance. He would be the future. He has shown he can share the ball playing along side Larry Fitzgerald.

 

[Stash]

Boldin would not be insurance. He would be the future. He has shown he can share the ball playing along side Larry Fitzgerald.

Read the whole thing, you wouldn't get the production to justify the cost.

Until Owens retires, either he or Williams would be an expensive insurance policy, not the #1 guy.

Boldin might be 'worth it' at current salary, but that's the reason he'd be available, because he's looking for a big raise.

 

[jterrell]

No offense OP, but thats the worst logic and argument ever, of all time, in history, of all evers.

Matt Jones might be preferred because he could be had more cheaply and paid more cheaply but any other arguments are a colossal FAIL.

This team has 1 starting WR, period. Now Glenn can be that if healthy and Witten is a great receiving option at TE but we still need another legit starting WR and Matt Jones is not that.

He never should have been drafted as that and shouldn't be expected to do that now. If Jones is someone's 3rd or 4th WR he has a chance to succeed in this league for a while. If they expect him to play to his 40 time they will be sorely disappointed. Jones is not as fast in pads as he was in the 40. He doesn't get great separation, get great releases off the line or run even good routes. He is facing a cut because he just isn't really very good. At least by starting WR standards. Those who keep pushing him as that actually are hurting him not backing him.

He would come in here to complete with Crayton, Austin, Hurd, Stanbeck not to become our de facto #2 WR.