Why I think Montana was overrated

mmillman

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,153
Reaction score
35
I believe that Montana was helped by Walsh and the system more than any other quarterback except for maybe Graham. If you look back at the QB's that Walsh had: Kenny Anderson, Fouts, DeBerg, Garcia, Montana, Young, Dils at Stanford etc......... All of them had one thing in common. They all dramatically increased their accuracy and yards under Walsh. They all ran an offense that was new, thus harder to defend.

"Walsh made me," Anderson said

"Bill Walsh made all the difference in the world," said Fouts, who was inducted into the Hall of Fame, along with Walsh, in 1993.

"I learned more in two years from Bill about being a quarterback than I did in the rest of my 10 years in the NFL," said Dils, who now works in Atlanta for Grubb & Ellis, a commercial real estate advisory firm. "He taught me so much about the game."


In a March 2007 article in Sports Illustrated, columnist Michael Silver described Walsh as the "most influential football man of his era" and a "transcendent ringmaster." "With his meticulously crafted organization and cerebral practice regimens, to his daring personnel decisions and his visionary offensive schemes, he created an enduring model," Silver wrote. "Today, the West Coast, with its reliance on short passes, precisely timed routes and intricately planned progressions, is the NFL's preeminent scheme. But in the early 1980s it merely drove opposing coaches nuts."

Walsh's impact on the coaching industry is apparent by the rise of former assistants, players and people who have come under his influence, including Dennis Green, Mike Holmgren, Mike Shanahan, Ray Rhodes, Jeff Fisher, Sam Wyche, Rod Dowhower, Bruce Coslet, Sherman Lewis, Brian Billick, Gary Kubiak, George Seifert, Jon Gruden, Paul Hackett, Tom Holmoe, Dwaine Board, Bobb McKittrick, Bill McPherson, Steve Mariucci, Tom Rathman, Jim Mora, Greg Knapp, Harry Sydney and Tom Lovat.

Montana would not have been anywhere as good with most of the teams that the other listed quarterbacks played with IMO.
 

TheCount

Pixel Pusher
Messages
25,523
Reaction score
8,849
Not only are you just looking to start an argument, what does this have to do with the Cowboys?
 

Rampage

Benched
Messages
24,117
Reaction score
2
you could make a case for how every player was/is overrated. but with your way of thinking was aikman overrated cause of his o-line?
 

Skinsmaniac

Boycotting Snyder since 2009
Messages
1,447
Reaction score
0
Rampage;2001509 said:
you could make a case for how every player was/is overrated. but with your way of thinking was aikman overrated cause of his o-line?
Seriously. Or maybe he was overrated because he wouldn't have been very good had "the system" been different, like say he had to play in the single-wing. The idea that "the system" makes a QB is true for all QBs and isn't a good reason to distinguish one from another.
 

MichaelWinicki

"You want some?"
Staff member
Messages
47,997
Reaction score
27,917
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
Montana over-rated?


No way.


Now if you said, "Elway", then you might be on to something. :D
 

speedkilz88

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,952
Reaction score
23,100
The wco system certainly helped Montana and the others stats, but they still did what they did.
 

MichaelWinicki

"You want some?"
Staff member
Messages
47,997
Reaction score
27,917
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
speedkilz88;2001543 said:
The wco system certainly helped Montana and the others stats, but they still did what they did.



Exactly right.

There have been a whole lot of teams that tried going to that system and their QB's sure as heck didn't look like Joe Montana when it came to putting up the passing numbers or the wins.

I have to LOL, because Buffalo tried implementing the WCO with Bledsoe.

Talk about trying to put a shine on a turd.
 

jackrussell

Last of the Duke Street Kings
Messages
4,165
Reaction score
1
Yeah...I guess Troy can thank Norv for the timing system.:rolleyes:

Marino can thank whomever for the 'no running game' system.

Moon can thank Gilbride? for the run & shoot. (thanks also to Buddy Ryan:eek:: )

Emmitt can give thanks for the 'big offensive line' system.

Lawerance Taylor can give thanks for the 'do whatever you want' system.

When you get down to it...these HOFers just really suck.
 

CM Duck

I'm breaking the 4th wall...
Messages
1,012
Reaction score
8
I always felt steve young was over rated...not Montana so much
 

mmillman

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,153
Reaction score
35
Rampage;2001509 said:
you could make a case for how every player was/is overrated. but with your way of thinking was aikman overrated cause of his o-line?

That argument has been made by others but usually about Smith. Football is the ultimate team game. How do you explain so many qb's excelling in Walsh systems. If you check the stats players improved dramatically with Walsh at QB.

Even in the NFL qbs get downgraded no matter what numbers they put up, the run n shoot for example. It took some time before managers figured out that every qb out of BYU wasn't worth a first round pick.
 

mmillman

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,153
Reaction score
35
TheCount;2001507 said:
Not only are you just looking to start an argument, what does this have to do with the Cowboys?
The board is dead and this argument is going on in the QB game but is lost amongst the hundreds of posts.
 

mmillman

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,153
Reaction score
35
Staubach is my favorite all time player followed closely by Smith. Elway was the best QB ever IMO because he did the most with the least.
 

mmillman

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,153
Reaction score
35
ThreeSportStar80;2001592 said:
The QB makes the system, I always coach that to my guys...


Have to disagree there. Lots of good qbs went to bad teams or unfriendly systems and weren't productive and or got killed. Two of the best that I saw that happen to was Archie Manning and Jim Plunkett. Steve Bartkowski comes to mind in that era also.

There also is a reason that guys like Garcia only go to other west coast systems. They are accurate, quick decisions, but don't have live arms.
 

2much2soon

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,514
Reaction score
89
I will be fighting to get to the front of the line when it comes to bashing the '80/'90s whiners.
But I wouldn't bash Joe for being too overrated. He did get it done on the field.
How many other of Walsh's QBs have Joe's track record?
He's not the best ever, but he was pretty good for a guy that, verbally at least, gave the impression he might not of been able to beat a squirrel at checkers.

Now if you want to bash the whiners for practically anything else, I am all in.
Ownership and key management with organized crime ties?
Rumored "bribery" of the media with free trips on the team jet?
Years and years of questionable on-field calls, even while the franchise was on the decline in the late '90s?
Bandwagon fans that make all other bandwagon fans pale in comparison?
Chop-blocking?
How come everyone remembers Michael Irvin's criminal transgressions, but not that Jerry Rice was once caught in a bay area brothel? And that he wasn't charged? For being an obvious customer of an illegal enterprise?
 

LittleBoyBlue

Redvolution
Messages
35,766
Reaction score
8,411
ThreeSportStar80;2001592 said:
The QB makes the system, I always coach that to my guys...



A QB that makes good decisions will be successful. Its not ALL about the system.
 

BrAinPaiNt

Mike Smith aka Backwoods Sexy
Staff member
Messages
78,654
Reaction score
42,999
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
There are some players for teams you may hate that it is hard for you not to like or respect them.

They might be players that some call over rated or under rated.

Joe is someone that although I hated the 49ers I have always respected as a player and he seems to be a really good guy as well.

He is just one of those guys for me. Same with Darrell Green with the Skins...it is my duty as a cowboys fan to hate the skins, but I just could not hate Darrell Green. He was just a great player and human being.
 

burmafrd

Well-Known Member
Messages
43,820
Reaction score
3,379
That arguement about the system could have been made the first couple of years = but after that the Ds started to adjust and then it comes down to making the plays. Montana did that. Even late in his career with a mediocre Chiefs team he was still making plays.
 
Top