Why is the NFL committing suicide?

[Verdict]

Got it

Your arguments rest on the assumption that black folks deserve it.

You've also argued that they don't take advantage of all the opportunities the government supposedly provides.

Totally understand your arguments. Ungrateful folks get what they deserve.

Disgusting

He never said any of that. Why don't you make up stuff as you go along. Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story.

 

[Zordon]

Which is also what Trump said this past weekend. But he got hammered over 'wanting the game to be more violent.'

Ask yourself this...have we ever seen politics brought into ANY sport and it increase a fanbase?

The only thing I could think of is you might be able to argue Joe Louis vs. Max Schmeling. But even that is a stretch to think that Louis and Schmeling were bringing politics into it and that it actually increased the # of fans for boxing.




YR

I view this entire matter as a social issue, Trump is actually the one playing politics. Always the opportunist - he saw an opening to distract from his own issues and rally his base - country unity be damned.

Ask yourself this...why the hell is this even on his radar? Why has he tweeted nonstop about it today? Why do his supporters pick and choose when they want the gov't out of their private business?

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Which is also what Trump said this past weekend. But he got hammered over 'wanting the game to be more violent.'

Ask yourself this...have we ever seen politics brought into ANY sport and it increase a fanbase?

The only thing I could think of is you might be able to argue Joe Louis vs. Max Schmeling. But even that is a stretch to think that Louis and Schmeling were bringing politics into it and that it actually increased the # of fans for boxing.




YR

Ali vs Frazier when Ali was able to circumvent his blackballing; people such as yourself all rooted for Frazier much to his chagrin. Jackie Robinson has been used to promote baseball for 50 years. The Olympic protest in 1968 has been used for promotion. The Constantinople chariot clubs involvement in rebuilding the Theodosian Wall following an earthquake galvanized the city behind them. The national anthem is itself inherently political and is a staple at sporting events. The Olympics are inherently political considering the teams and they have been a smashing success for 1000s of years now.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I view this entire matter as a social issue, Trump is actually the one playing politics. Always the opportunist - he saw an opening to distract from his own issues and rally his base - country unity be damned.

Ask yourself this...why the hell is this even on his radar? Why has he tweeted nonstop about it today? Why do his supporters pick and choose when they want the gov't out of their private business?

Trump isn't getting involved in the NFL's business.

All Trump stated was 'wouldn't you like to see one of these owners fire one of these players after they sat out the anthem?' (paraphrased).

He's not trying to get in and force the NFL to do anything with regards to what the players do with the anthem. He's stating his opinion that he thinks the players sitting out the anthem are being disrespectful and he would like to see an owner fire a player for doing so. Just like Obama calling Kanye West a jack-arse.

As far as the social issue, I think the players are being political without actually discussing politics. They are clearly playing to one side of the political spectrum, especially with how they view law enforcement. They are just hedging their bets. Much of the claims of institutional racism are never backed by any specific facts pointing to specific institutional racism. When you asks for specific facts pointing to specific institutions there are no legitimate replies. Just stammering. And then it comes down to that I'm supposed to believe that institution X is 'racist' because somebody says so. Sorry, I just don't take somebody's word for it. Give me facts towards specific institutions practicing institutional racism and we'll fight against these institutions together because I detest racism as much as the next person.

All of this for a bum like Kaepernick who couldn't play, knew he couldn't play and took this stance so he could look like he was being blackballed by the league. All of these owners stick up for the players, yet the players will still claim that Kaepernick is being blackballed. All for a guy who praised Fidel Castro when Cuban-Americans were literally dancing in the streets at the news of Castro's death. The guy may have pulled the most brilliant sham of my lifetime.





YR

 

[AbeBeta]

Again, you're strawmanning.

More encounters with police mean more chances to get killed. It has nothing to do with deserving it.

Oh. More encounters with police. That's the issue.

An African American congressman was stopped by police seven times last year.

More contact with police because police seek them out.

You continue to make me sick with your crap. **** and get back to your Parnell is the best posts

 

[Nightman]

Everything Goodell has been trying to do for years.....cleaning up the image of the league with the arrests, drugs and activism was solved by one small part of a speech about something else entirely

Now the players are committed to showing they are upstanding, caring members of the community that only want to help out their sense of charity and standing as role models... maybe it was tough love or the father figure that was lacking but I for one am glad they are using this controversy to do try and do good for a change

Their cause has been confusing and lacking goals and misdirected at the flag IMO but now they can finally solve the issue of violent crime in the minority neighborhoods...... I am all ears as to Kap's plan to end the killings in Chicago, Baltimore and St Louis.... it is truly a tragedy to watch the endless murders of the young men in those areas

It has been 22 days without an arrest in the NFL ....... the average span is 7 days.......... so they are already ahead of the game...... good luck and maybe they can win back the fans that have turned away through their good works

 

[Yakuza Rich]

Ali vs Frazier when Ali was able to circumvent his blackballing; people such as yourself all rooted for Frazier much to his chagrin.

Hard to root for a boxer when you were not even born when this match occurred.

Ali's taunts of Frazier, who despised Ali until his death, did draw more detractors of Ali, including in the black community, thinking that Ali had gone too far.

Jackie Robinson has been used to promote baseball for 50 years.

That's politics?

I think that's a stretch to say the least.

Lemme guess...I protested that as well given my dad was 1 years old at the time and my mother wasn't even born at the time.

The Olympic protest in 1968 has been used for promotion.

Did it draw more people to the sport?

Nope.

The Constantinople chariot clubs involvement in rebuilding the Theodosian Wall following an earthquake galvanized the city behind them. The national anthem is itself inherently political and is a staple at sporting events. The Olympics are inherently political considering the teams and they have been a smashing success for 1000s of years now.

No, the Olympics are not inherently political. That's why Munich, the US boycott in 1980 and the Russian boycott in 1984 were so publicized...they brought politics into an event that for thousands of years countries were able to put aside their differences and allow athletes from all over the globe to compete against each other.






YR

 

[Kaiser]

All of this for a bum like Kaepernick who couldn't play, knew he couldn't play and took this stance so he could look like he was being blackballed by the league. All of these owners stick up for the players, yet the players will still claim that Kaepernick is being blackballed. All for a guy who praised Fidel Castro when Cuban-Americans were literally dancing in the streets at the news of Castro's death. The guy may have pulled the most brilliant sham of my lifetime.

Couldn’t agree more. If there was a protest by a player on the Walter Scott case or the Tamir Rice case - and it was even remotely articulate – it would be an entirely different matter.

But Kapernick saying “ALLCOPSBADSOALLAMERICABAD” is idiotic, it doesn’t help the issues or the discussion around them.

Trump is playing politics with this, quite obviously. But Trump is a politician and Football should never have been put into the political realm in the first place.

I actually respect what the Oakland A’s Catcher did, he knelt with his hand on his heart, then put out a statement that he supports the issues and opposes Trump. I get the sense its more about endorsement deals in the Bay Area than conviction, but it was done in a much smarter way than what Kapernick did.

 

[toto1939]

Goodell is letting the air out of NFL football faster than Tom Brady ever dreamed of

 

[Nightman]

Ali vs Frazier when Ali was able to circumvent his blackballing; people such as yourself all rooted for Frazier much to his chagrin

Everyone rooted for Frazier because he gave Ali the shot when no one else would and Ali went out of his way to disparage Frazier's looks "ugly as a gorilla cookie" and "blackness".....plus Ali was the draft dodger and loudmouth.......like YR said a large part of America and Smokin' Joe never forgave him for his betrayal........ it was Larry Holmes and not Ali that took care of Frazier until he died

 

[T-RO]

I'm going to have some time off soon. I specifically scheduled the time to calibrate some big life decisions.

One of the (lesser) decisions I'll be mulling is what I plan to do with football.

With corrupt stadium construction projects, predatorial gambling business alliances, the Zeke investigation process...and now this...I'm thinking I might say goodbye to the NFL. For good.

I took a year off once previously and really enjoyed myself. I haven't decided yet and want to be thoughtful about it.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Hard to root for a boxer when you were not even born when this match occurred.

Ali's taunts of Frazier, who despised Ali until his death, did draw more detractors of Ali, including in the black community, thinking that Ali had gone too far.



That's politics?

I think that's a stretch to say the least.

Lemme guess...I protested that as well given my dad was 1 years old at the time and my mother wasn't even born at the time.



Did it draw more people to the sport?

Nope.




No, the Olympics are not inherently political. That's why Munich, the US boycott in 1980 and the Russian boycott in 1984 were so publicized...they brought politics into an event that for thousands of years countries were able to put aside their differences and allow athletes from all over the globe to compete against each other.






YR

Who said the issue was reduced to your lifetime? You said it never happened. That is easily demonstrated to be wrong.

Frazier and Ali had an up and down relationship. He certainly was mad at Ali for what he said leading up to the fight after he helped him while he was blackballed. They reconciled later.

The youth who were being drafted and minorities were hugely for Ali. The white establishment was for Frazier. It was the largest sporting event in boxing history at that point. Good demonstration to the falsity of your claim.

Jackie Robinson was integrated when segregation was still in force and before racial discriminations was outlawed. If you cannot see how that was a big middle finger to Jim Crow states is baffling. There are all kinds of stories about athletes from that era dealing with institutional racism. Saying it was not political is just ignorant.

The 1968 protest has been used on promotional material for the Olympics for 50 years.

Nation states are inherently political given that they are political entities. The idea was to promote peace and cooperation between those political entities. Ending war is a political goal given how wars are started and ended.

You completely ignored the Byzantine chariot teams. That was a smashing success considering they rebuilt the wall in 61 days with a groundswell of support. Then there is the whole bread and circuses policies of the Patricians in Rome where the Colosseum was perpetually full.

The national anthem again is inherently political and played at most sporting events. The whole support the troops/police movement is political given that both are instruments of the state.

There is a long history of successful mergers of politics and sport from the beginning of history.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Everyone rooted for Frazier because he gave Ali the shot when no one else would and Ali went out of his way to disparage Frazier's looks "ugly as a gorilla cookie" and "blackness".....plus Ali was the draft dodger and loudmouth.......like YR said a large part of America and Smokin' Joe never forgave him for his betrayal........ it was Larry Holmes and not Ali that took care of Frazier until he died

you make it seem that Ali did not have his own legion of supporters. That is false.

 

[Nightman]

you make it seem that Ali did not have his own legion of supporters. That is false.

I never implied that and should not have inferred it

and Ali and Frazier never reconciled ........ I spent a whole day with Frazier in 2009 and he hated Ali with all his soul

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

But Kapernick saying “ALLCOPSBADSOALLAMERICABAD” is idiotic, it doesn’t help the issues or the discussion around them.

Kaepernick has been pretty consistent talking about systemic problems with police. I have seen nothing where he condemns America.

 

[Zordon]

Trump isn't getting involved in the NFL's business.

All Trump stated was 'wouldn't you like to see one of these owners fire one of these players after they sat out the anthem?' (paraphrased).

He's not trying to get in and force the NFL to do anything with regards to what the players do with the anthem. He's stating his opinion that he thinks the players sitting out the anthem are being disrespectful and he would like to see an owner fire a player for doing so. Just like Obama calling Kanye West a jack-arse.

As far as the social issue, I think the players are being political without actually discussing politics. They are clearly playing to one side of the political spectrum, especially with how they view law enforcement. They are just hedging their bets. Much of the claims of institutional racism are never backed by any specific facts pointing to specific institutional racism. When you asks for specific facts pointing to specific institutions there are no legitimate replies. Just stammering. And then it comes down to that I'm supposed to believe that institution X is 'racist' because somebody says so. Sorry, I just don't take somebody's word for it. Give me facts towards specific institutions practicing institutional racism and we'll fight against these institutions together because I detest racism as much as the next person.

All of this for a bum like Kaepernick who couldn't play, knew he couldn't play and took this stance so he could look like he was being blackballed by the league. All of these owners stick up for the players, yet the players will still claim that Kaepernick is being blackballed. All for a guy who praised Fidel Castro when Cuban-Americans were literally dancing in the streets at the news of Castro's death. The guy may have pulled the most brilliant sham of my lifetime.





YR

read up on "redlining"/segregated housing in places like chicago, the structural racism within banking institutions - wells fargo, the ferguson report, the countless inequalities in policing and sentencing for the same crimes...you come off as a fairly sophisticated guy on here, there's no way you believe institutional racism is some fairy tale. this country's history (old and modern) is littered with examples of it. it's a big reason why some start on 3rd base while others are born into a situation where they have to dig themselves out of a hole.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I never implied that and should not have inferred it

Everyone rooted for Frazier

 

[Kaiser]

Kaepernick has been pretty consistent talking about systemic problems with police. I have seen nothing where he condemns America.

So he took a knee for the National Anthem of the United States or the National Anthem of a percentage of Law Enforcement Officers?

I could have sworn it was the former, not the latter.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

So he took a knee for the National Anthem of the United States or the National Anthem of a percentage of Law Enforcement Officers?

I could have sworn it was the former, not the latter.

It's a song and symbols mean different things to different people. He did it to draw attention to what he terms systemic police brutality and misconduct which is an arm of various US governments.

Also since when does nonparticipation mean disrespect? You act like he burnt the flag or interfered with the rendition. He simply did not participate.

Do you stand when the national anthem is played?

 

[Kaiser]

Do you stand when the national anthem is played?

Yes I do, and the distinction you are trying to draw is silly. He refused to stand when every other NFL player did, and had for years. Then talked endlessly on national television about why he did it.

You are acting like it was an accident, when in reality standing for the Anthem is literally in the CBA.

"Hey, I'm not a tax cheat, I simply didn't participate in the IRS".