Why was Byron Jones rated so low before the combine?

[CyberB0b]

I clicked those links and it shows only the 1st round so either there is a link on there that goes on and we can read if there was a difference in reports, or you were basically saying that this guy that AdamJT brought up never considered Jones a 1st Rounder from the start. Former, or latter?

That guy, Daniel Jeremiah, had him ranked right at #50 immediately AFTER the combine, from what I can tell. I can't find anything from Daniel Jeremiah before the combine regarding Jones, which is why I posted his mock drafts. If he had him at number 50 after the combine, and posted no mocks with him in the 1st round, then yes, I would say "the guy Adam brought up" never considered Jones a 1st rounder until AFTER the combine. IF you look here:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/mock-drafts/daniel-jeremiah/230601

He magically jumps into the first round AFTER the combine.

Even @Risen Star and @xwalker were surprised about his rise after the combine.

Byron Jones leaps up to 33 on the board.

Imagine if he would have ran at the combine.

Overrated:
9 Arik Armstead* DE 6'7½"" 285 Oregon 93"
27 Devin Funchess* WR 6'4?"" 235 Michigan 89"
33 Byron Jones CB 6'0?"" 197 Connecticut 88"
36 Ameer Abdullah RB 5'8¼"" 198 Nebraska 87"

 

[viman96]

I'm up in the air on him and I'll explain why.

He really was an un-known player to me until closer to the draft and I started seeing him on Mocks and in different articles. I'm not a fan of guys that don't play against good competition week in and out at the college level... I like guys from Major conferences and big time programs more than guys like Jones. But that's just my personal preference.... nothing factual to base that off of... just the way I am. Anyway, that is one check against him in my book. Second, I don't care for anyone that "shows up" on draft boards after the combine... "Work out Warriors" don't have a great track record in the NFL. so that's another check against him in my book.

BUT

from the video I've seen of him, he looks alright. He sounds like a "worker" and a "studier" of the game which is a plus for a CB in the NFL. I think that the position is as much about film study as it is about measurable. (The greats have both!) I've heard comparisons to Devin McCourty and from what I've seen I'd say they are pretty fair. He will probably start out as a CB for us and move to FS in a few years.

Bottom line is, I actually trust the guys making the call now (I really don't think it's Jerrah and hasn't been for awhile now) and will give them the benefit of the doubt. Seems like a nice pick in the late first round.

With this narrow minded way of thinking a lot of good players would be missed

 

[TwoDeep3]

105.3 was talking about him today around lunch. Someone mentioned the Nike athletic rating.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SPARQ_Training
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SPARQ_Training
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SPARQ_Training
This rates the athleticism of players. One of the hosts said Jones rated around 95 or so. Out of 100. Nit dradft slot but athelticism.

They spoke about a guy in Carrollton, Texas who reverse engineered Nike's Sparq's rating since Nike will not reveal how they come up with the information. Evidently he also rated this guy very high.

 

[Corso]

That guy, Daniel Jeremiah, had him ranked right at #50 immediately AFTER the combine, from what I can tell. I can't find anything from Daniel Jeremiah before the combine regarding Jones, which is why I posted his mock drafts. If he had him at number 50 after the combine, and posted no mocks with him in the 1st round, then yes, I would say "the guy Adam brought up" never considered Jones a 1st rounder until AFTER the combine. IF you look here:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/mock-drafts/daniel-jeremiah/230601

He magically jumps into the first round AFTER the combine.

Even @Risen Star and @xwalker were surprised about his rise after the combine.

You bring up a lot of food for thought. Kudos.

 

[gmoney112]

You bring up a lot of food for thought. Kudos.

Freudian slip?

 

[ActualCowboysFan]

105.3 was talking about him today around lunch. Someone mentioned the Nike athletic rating.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SPARQ_Training
This rates the athleticism of players. One of the hosts said Jones rated around 95 or so. Out of 100. Nit dradft slot but athelticism.

They spoke about a guy in Carrollton, Texas who reverse engineered Nike's Sparq's rating since Nike will not reveal how they come up with the information. Evidently he also rated this guy very high.

He's actually rated a 99.9 on that measurement. He's called a 3 Sigma athlete. Only corner to merit that tag. He's one of five now in the league. The others are Calvin Johnson, JJ Watt, Evan Mathis and Lane Johnson. Calling him an athlete is like calling a Ferrari a car.

 

[ghst187]

Word is he lacks instincts. So, we have an athletic freak who lacks instincts. Think AOA, Jason Williams. Both athletic freaks who lacked football instincts.

Now, I'm not sure he is as inept as those two based on what I've seen, (which admittedly is very little) but I've said many times that the Byron Jones pick is the one that I'm most concerned with.

I'll be pissed if Malcolm brown goes beast mode and Jones turns out marginal or worse

 

[Corso]

With this narrow minded way of thinking a lot of good players would be missed

Yeah, I can see where you're coming from on the First Party of the First Part of his post, which shall be known from this point as the First Party of the First Part.
But the Second Part- being of the First Party of the Second Part, is what I would hope for in a player to go along with athleticism. Being a "worker" and someone that likes to study film (my major complaint on Clai) is someone that can bring his measurables into production on game day.

And two hard boiled eggs.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

This article was written in February:
http://www.theuconnblog.com/2015/2/...combine-nfl-draft-profile-2015-uconn-football



Does this concern anyone? His combine numbers jumped him from a late round CB to a 1st rounder. From what I have seen in his limited youtube video clips, he didn't seem that impressive to me. There are some choice quotes from that article.

Because Uconn football never made it to Disney networks.

 

[xwalker]

This article was written in February:
http://www.theuconnblog.com/2015/2/...combine-nfl-draft-profile-2015-uconn-football



Does this concern anyone? His combine numbers jumped him from a late round CB to a 1st rounder. From what I have seen in his limited youtube video clips, he didn't seem that impressive to me. There are some choice quotes from that article.

Think about the process. The rankings that we see are from the draft media, not from teams. There are a lot of prospects eligible for the draft. Every year the daft media ranking change drastically for some players. The media likes to say it's because of something like the combine, but in reality the rankings by NFL teams probably don't change much, it's the draft media rankings that are changing. The combine just triggers the media to go back and review players. The combine also is also a place where the draft media get to talk with teams and get a feel for which players are getting attention from teams.

A player like Trai Turner jumped from about 350 in the rankings at the end of the 2013 season to a 3rd/4th in the rankings by draft time and ended up as a 3rd round pick. He didn't do anything special at the combine to cause this jump. The draft media had just overlooked him initially. It was obvious that he was a good player in game footage, but they didn't have him on their radar until they found out NFL teams were looking at him in detail.

How do we as fans know which players to review? By the draft media. How do the draft media know which players to review initially? The initial ranking seem to stem from just a few sources and the other media, just like fans use that as their starting point.

 

[TonyRomo17]

 

[CyberB0b]

Think about the process. The rankings that we see are from the draft media, not from teams. There are a lot of prospects eligible for the draft. Every year the daft media ranking change drastically for some players. The media likes to say it's because of something like the combine, but in reality the rankings by NFL teams probably don't change much, it's the draft media rankings that are changing. The combine just triggers the media to go back and review players. The combine also is also a place where the draft media get to talk with teams and get a feel for which players are getting attention from teams.

A player like Trai Turner jumped from about 350 in the rankings at the end of the 2013 season to a 3rd/4th in the rankings by draft time and ended up as a 3rd round pick. He didn't do anything special at the combine to cause this jump. The draft media had just overlooked him initially. It was obvious that he was a good player in game footage, but they didn't have him on their radar until they found out NFL teams were looking at him in detail.

How do we as fans know which players to review? By the draft media. How do the draft media know which players to review initially? The initial ranking seem to stem from just a few sources and the other media, just like fans use that as their starting point.

So why did you say he was over rated in the Scouts Inc ranking of 33? This was right after the draft:

http://cowboyszone.com/threads/scouts-inc-top-200-overall-2-25-15.315999/#post-5991576

Convenient, that these were posted as early as a month after the combine.

 

[xwalker]

So why did you say he was over rated in the Scouts Inc ranking of 33? This was right after the draft:

http://cowboyszone.com/threads/scouts-inc-top-200-overall-2-25-15.315999/#post-5991576

Convenient, that these were posted as early as a month after the combine.

That was a cut/paste error. I had him as the #2 CB in my review:

http://cowboyszone.com/threads/cb-review.320395/

 

[AdamJT13]

That guy, Daniel Jeremiah, had him ranked right at #50 immediately AFTER the combine, from what I can tell.

No, the image he posted of Bryon Jones at #50 was his pre-Combine ranking. He posted that on Feb. 23, which was the last day of the Combine -- and the day that Jones blew everyone away with his 12-3 broad jump.

After the Combine, Jeremiah moved Jones up in his rankings, and even mocked him at #20 to the Eagles that week -- he still didn't rank him that high, but he thought he fit Chip Kelly's type of CB.

Here is the summary of Jeremiah's PRE-COMBINE rankings --

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...op-50-dj-humphries-among-11-newcomers-on-list


"Byron Jones, CB, Connecticut
Jeremiah ranking: 50th
The skinny: Jones -- who was listed at 6-foot-1 and 196 pounds at UConn -- was a four-year starter for the Huskies who missed the final five games of the season because of a shoulder injury that required surgery. Jeremiah says Jones "is at his best in press coverage" and that Jones "could be a real steal in this draft. He should start day one in a press-man scheme."

That was posted on Feb. 17, the day players began reporting to the Combine.


A few days after the Combine, Mel Kiper said this --

"I had a high grade on him before, that's why I still like him," Kiper said. "You can't like a guy after a workout if you didn't like him before. Fluid hips, real physical. He's a press corner. He had a shoulder injury in late October. He had 19 starts at cornerback the last two years and 20 starts at safety the first two years. He was a captain in high school, captain at UConn, team leader. I think he's an early- to mid-second-round pick. He's 6-1, 200, and can play cornerback or safety."

http://www.courant.com/sports/football/hc-byron-jones-nfl-draft-0301-20150228-story.html


Of course Jones' Combine helped him. He went from being a likely second- or third-round pick to the late first round. But anyone who ranked him as a third-day pick before the Combine just hadn't done their homework.

 

[perrykemp]

Most pretend scouts only scout the guys they've watched. I bet he hadn't seen many UConn games.

You'll never know his true rating because real scouts don't post on the interwebs for clicks.

Best we have is Bob McGinn's small writeup that is based on him talking to real scouts and looking at it it just doesn't seem like a very big sample size to me:

5. BYRON JONES, Connecticut (6-0 ½, 199. 4.42, 1-2): Started at FS in 2011-'12 before moving to CB in 2013-'14. "Blew up the combine," one scout said. "You see those things on the field. Really good movement skills. He played better in press." Finished with 223 tackles (3 ½ for loss), eight picks and 18 PBUs. His broad jump of 12-3 probably was longer than any player's in NFL annals. Also posted a vertical jump of 44½ and had 33 on the Wonderlic. "Doesn't play as well as he works out," said a second scout. "Doesn't have great instincts. Little stiff at the top. But all those big long guys are in vogue now because all the receivers are 6-8." Underwent shoulder surgery (labrum) near midseason. "No, he can't cover," a third scout said. "I don't think he's got the feel." From New Britain, Conn.

 

[Tabascocat]

Lord help us if he turns into another Claiborne...................

 

[AmericanCowboy]

These anonymous scouts seem like forum posters to me.

Scouts arent always great at evaluating. "Scouts" had a 7th round grade on Frederick.

And lol that one scout say he lacked athleticism? What was he on?

 

[Zekeats]

You answered your own question in your title.... it was before the combine

 

[ActualCowboysFan]

So why did you say he was over rated in the Scouts Inc ranking of 33? This was right after the draft:

http://cowboyszone.com/threads/scouts-inc-top-200-overall-2-25-15.315999/#post-5991576



Convenient, that these were posted as early as a month after the combine.

Now go and do the same thing in the other direction. These impeccable sources you're basing your argument on had Odiggy wrong by 40 picks. They got Grady Jarett and Michael Bennett wrong by more than that. Jaelen Strong had a wide divergence. TJ Clemmings and Jay Ajayi hit the tank as well. A few years ago the pundits had freaking Matt Barkley as the top prospect. A few of these guys really know what they're looking at, the rest are just following the crowd.

 

[visionary]

Let me put it this way

I'm as big a proponent of taking front 7 esp DL high but cb/fs are very difficult to come by

If he can become our starting cb (preferably FS) for the next decade, I will not complain about passing on brown

A true FS will take this defense to the next level

The concern is legitimate that he is a freak athlete, hard worker by all accounts and very smart so why did he not dominate against lesser competition at UConn?