"Win-or-go-home" from a team point of view

[KJJ]

I believe the OP was referencing defensive passer rating, not total defense (IMO, total defense is a useless stat). And no, I do not know the GB 2011 defensive passer rating. I assume with 38 takeaways it was pretty good.

I don't believe it was even though what Percy tries to convey isn't always crystal clear. He said "A common faulty assumption that I've seen in the discussions of this team is that, based on their record, this was an average team the last two years. To call the 2011-12 Cowboys an average team is only technically true. It can't be overstated: Take away the passing game in 2011 and 2012, and the teams that the Cowboys put on the field (especially after key injuries on defense) were bad football teams." He's saying if you take away the Cowboys passing game in 2011 and 2012 they would be a bad football team because the Cowboys can't run the football and the defense has played poorly especially after the key injuries last season.

The Cowboys strength is their passing game that's produced 9187 yards and 59 TD's the past 2 seasons. The Cowboys have been overly dependent on Romo and the passing game. Romo had a career high 648 attempts last season which put a lot of pressure on him which caused him to tie his career high with 19 int's. The team has been trying to take some pressure off him for years and they're hoping an improved running game and defense will do it.

 

[KJJ]

And no, I do not know the GB 2011 defensive passer rating. I assume with 38 takeaways it was pretty good.

The 38 takeaways and Rodgers having a 46-6 TD to turnover ratio during the 2011 regular season helps explain their 15-1 record. When your D is taking the ball away and your QB is suffering very few turnovers and throwing TD's that's a recipe for winning. Rodgers only multiple turnover game in 2011 happened at the worst time in the playoffs and it helped contribute to a one and done. The Packers D didn't get any turnovers off Eli and Rodgers coughed it up twice.

 

[5Stars]

38/46-6 +2011 *15-1 =2011.

 

[KJJ]

http://i465.***BLOCKED***/albums/rr16/KJJ100/yawn-emoticon-vector-799167-1_zps444d967d.jpg

 

[DanteEXT]

The Cowboys strength is their passing game that's produced 9187 yards and 59 TD's the past 2 seasons. The Cowboys have been overly dependent on Romo and the passing game. Romo had a career high 648 attempts last season which put a lot of pressure on him which caused him to tie his career high with 19 int's. The team has been trying to take some pressure off him for years and they're hoping an improved running game and defense will do it.

I agree with that. Unfortunately, it hasn't worked out yet. I'm hopeful this year is different.

 

[KJJ]

I agree with that. Unfortunately, it hasn't worked out yet. I'm hopeful this year is different.

It worked out pretty good in 09 when the Cowboys (Jerry) came up with the so called "Romo friendly" offense. It resulted in a career low 9 int's for Romo in a full season. The defense stepped up in Dec of that year posting back to back shutouts to end the regular season and Romo stepped up. It resulted in a division title and the Cowboys first playoff win in 13 years. Romo's TD to turnover ratio in his final 5 games of the regular season and in the Cowboys playoff win over Philly was 11-2. His TD to turnover ratio vs Minn in the Cowboys blowout loss was 0-3. Not putting all the blame on him for that loss but his 3 turnovers contributed.

 

[DanteEXT]

It worked out pretty good in 09 when the Cowboys (Jerry) came up with the so called "Romo friendly" offense. It resulted in a career low 9 int's for Romo in a full season. The defense stepped up in Dec of that year posting back to back shutouts to end the regular season and Romo stepped up. It resulted in a division title and the Cowboys first playoff win in 13 years. Romo's TD to turnover ratio in his final 5 games of the regular season and in the Cowboys playoff win over Philly was 11-2. His TD to turnover ratio vs Minn in the Cowboys blowout loss was 0-3. Not putting all the blame on him for that loss but his 3 turnovers contributed.

Defense played pretty well all season that year. 15.6 ppg that season (17.9 factoring out the 2 shutouts). Coincidentally, the only season the D surrendered under 20 PPG since Romo's been the starter. It's not surprising they finally broke that playoff win drought that season.

The Minnesota game (like the Philly '08 game) was a trainwreck from start to finish across the board. I prefer not to think about it.

 

[IrishAnto]

It worked out pretty good in 09 when the Cowboys (Jerry) came up with the so called "Romo friendly" offense. It resulted in a career low 9 int's for Romo in a full season. The defense stepped up in Dec of that year posting back to back shutouts to end the regular season and Romo stepped up. It resulted in a division title and the Cowboys first playoff win in 13 years. Romo's TD to turnover ratio in his final 5 games of the regular season and in the Cowboys playoff win over Philly was 11-2. His TD to turnover ratio vs Minn in the Cowboys blowout loss was 0-3. Not putting all the blame on him for that loss but his 3 turnovers contributed.

And Dallas’s OL inability to handle the Vikings DL contributed as did Dallas’s Defenses inability to generate any turnovers (a common theme over the last 7-8 years) contributed.

In short the TEAM as a whole contributed.

 

[KJJ]

And there hasn't been a great defense since 2000, so my point still stands.

You don't think offenses gearing more towards the pass and all the player safety rules that keep being added haven't contributed to that? What riddled the great 85 Bears defense full of holes was a great passing attack. Had the player safety rules been around back in 1985 the Bears defense would have been penalized every other play. That defense would have been rendered less effective under todays rules. Go back and look at some of the shots to the head and neck they made on QB's. No way do you get away with hits like that on QB's today.

You can't hit a QB high, low or a fraction too late or you'll get flagged. Mike Ditka would have had a coronary watching flags rain down on his defense all day. Buddy Ryan would have run out on the field and tried to punch out an official after watching play after play wiped out due to roughing the passer penalties. The passing attacks we see today and the rules that favor offenses have made it tough on defenses. Players are having to think rather than react or they face penalties, fines and suspensions.

 

[KJJ]

And Dallas’s OL inability to handle the Vikings DL contributed as did Dallas’s Defenses inability to generate any turnovers (a common theme over the last 7-8 years) contributed.

In short the TEAM as a whole contributed.

The entire team contributed to that loss but as in every game a lot of the focus is put on the play of the QB whether it's a good or bad performance. When you look at the stats and see 3 turnovers by the QB and a passer rating of 66.1 that puts a lot of the scrutiny on them. Those who go back to examine Romo's elimination game's don't re-watch the games all they look at are the turnovers and his passer ratings in each game and judge his performances entirely off that. They don't remember the poor OL play vs Minn and all the miss blocks. A lot of Cowboy FANS especially one in-particular puts a lot of weight on Romo's passer rating stats especially his career passer rating because it's the one stat that puts him amongst the top 5 all-time in that category.

But because they have such a Romo bias they place most is not all the blame on his supporting cast when he has a poor passer rating game. They attempt to pin everyone of his turnovers on other players. Romo's career and seasonal passer ratings are used in his defense by many FANS in their endless attempts to try and prove he's a better QB than Eli but those same FANS refuse to compare his passer rating games vs ELi in win or go home games.

 

[superpunk]

Wow still going over the weekend. Is the plan just to keep repeating the same nonsense over and over again until everyone gets worn out and you get the last word?

 

[KJJ]

Some here need to stop focusing on me and try staying on the topic.

http://i465.***BLOCKED***/albums/rr16/KJJ100/4440592-149137-bored-emoticon_zps6cb2dde1.jpg

 

[IrishAnto]

You don't think offenses gearing more towards the pass and all the player safety rules that keep being added haven't contributed to that? What riddled the great 85 Bears defense full of holes was a great passing attack. Had the player safety rules been around back in 1985 the Bears defense would have been penalized every other play. That defense would have been rendered less effective under todays rules. Go back and look at some of the shots to the head and neck they made on QB's. No way do you get away with hits like that on QB's today.

You can't hit a QB high, low or a fraction too late or you'll get flagged. Mike Ditka would have had a coronary watching flags rain down on his defense all day. Buddy Ryan would have run out on the field and tried to punch out an official after watching play after play wiped out due to roughing the passer penalties. The passing attacks we see today and the rules that favor offenses have made it tough on defenses. Players are having to think rather than react or they face penalties, fines and suspensions.

The point was whether a truly dominant defense like the 85 Bears or the 2000 Ravens could carry an average QB to a Super Bowl.

The rule changes and the Cap only make it harder to build such a defense and it’s unlikely you’ll see there like anytime soon if at all.

However if such a defense could be put on the filed then I’m sure an average QB could be the bus driver on a Super Bowl winning team.

 

[IrishAnto]

The entire team contributed to that loss but as in every game a lot of the focus is put on the play of the QB whether it's a good or bad performance. When you look at the stats and see 3 turnovers by the QB and a passer rating of 66.1 that puts a lot of the scrutiny on them. Those who go back to examine Romo's elimination game's don't re-watch the games all they look at are the turnovers and his passer ratings in each game and judge his performances entirely off that. They don't remember the poor OL play vs Minn and all the miss blocks. A lot of Cowboy FANS especially one in-particular puts a lot of weight on Romo's passer rating stats especially his career passer rating because it's the one stat that puts him amongst the top 5 all-time in that category.

But because they have such a Romo bias they place most is not all the blame on his supporting cast when he has a poor passer rating game. They attempt to pin everyone of his turnovers on other players. Romo's career and seasonal passer ratings are used in his defense by many FANS in their endless attempts to try and prove he's a better QB than Eli but those same FANS refuse to compare his passer rating games vs ELi in win or go home games.

Nobody is saying that most or all the blame can be placed on Romo’s supporting cast and that he’s not at fault.

They rightly point out that it’s a team game and that all the blame or glory can’t be placed on one player.

All facets of the team have to play at a certain level in order for the team to have success and that while superior QB play can indeed elevate a team’s performance, it by itself can’t get the job done.

 

[ufcrules1]

However if such a defense could be put on the filed then I’m sure an average QB could be the bus driver on a Super Bowl winning team.

I agree. If we had a team like the 2000 Ravens.. Tony could certainly drive the bus to a superbowl win. We wouldn't even have to worry about the epic meltdown interceptions from Tony in the "win or go home" games. The defense could make up for those.

 

[perrykemp]

I agree. If we had a team like the 2000 Ravens.. Tony could certainly drive the bus to a superbowl win. We wouldn't even have to worry about the epic meltdown interceptions from Tony in the "win or go home" games. The defense could make up for those.

Same could be said for hundreds and hundreds of QBs. That Raven's defense was the best in a generation and any number of middling QBs could have won a SB on that team.

 

[ufcrules1]

Same could be said for hundreds and hundreds of QBs. That Raven's defense was the best in a generation and any number of middling QBs could have won a SB on that team.

Yes, that would be correct too.

 

[NumOneQB]

7-9, Garrett is fired. Next year it will be all sunshine and puppy dogs and talks of playoffs again.

 

[KJJ]

The point was whether a truly dominant defense like the 85 Bears or the 2000 Ravens could carry an average QB to a Super Bowl.

The rule changes and the Cap only make it harder to build such a defense and it’s unlikely you’ll see there like anytime soon if at all.

However if such a defense could be put on the filed then I’m sure an average QB could be the bus driver on a Super Bowl winning team.

The rule changes have made it harder for defenses to defend the passing attacks we see today. When the Ravens won their championship in 2000 the NFL wasn't the passing league we see today and defenses weren't handicapped by all the player safety rules that have clearly benefitted offenses. Defenders are having to think too much today to avoid infractions and it's cut down on their reaction time. The 2000 Ravens went 12-4 losing 3 straight games due to their offense not being able to score. From week 7 to week 9 their offense didn't score a single TD and managed only 15 points. Only 3 QB's in 2000 passed for over 4000 yards compared to 11 QB's last season. With all the player safety rules in place and offenses geared toward the pass it's very unlikely we'll ever see a couple of defenses dominate like the 85 Bears and 2000 Ravens.

Miami and Dan Marino showed what a passing attack can do to even greatest defense and add in all the player safety rules especially the rules to protect the QB and none of those defenses would have been as effective. In todays game an average QB isn't going to lead a team to a championship because QB's have to produce today especially in playoff games. The 2011 49ers who had a terrific defense was the closest we've seen since the 2000 Ravens to reaching the SB with a bus driver at QB. Alex Smith who was a game manager was unable to produce in the NFC title game despite a great defensive performance by SF. Eli was sacked 6 times and hit double digit times but was still able to make plays while Smith wasn't which is why he's in KC now.

Since Brad Johnson won a SB in 2003 every QB who's won a SB since is building a HOF resume except for Joe Flacco who may end up building one if he can win another 2 SB's. The Steelers had the #1 defense last season and didn't even make the playoffs. The #2, #3 and #4 defenses were all knocked off in postseason. The NFL is an offensive league and some of the top defensive teams have missed the playoffs the last few years. Pittsburgh was the last team to win a SB that had a #1 ranked defense and that defense was riddled with holes by Kurt Warner in the SB. It took a last ditch drive by the Steelers to pull that game out. For defenses to have a chance today they have to force turnovers and take the ball out of the hands of all these playmaking QB's.

 

[IrishAnto]

The rule changes have made it harder for defenses to defend the passing attacks we see today. When the Ravens won their championship in 2000 the NFL wasn't the passing league we see today and defenses weren't handicapped by all the player safety rules that have clearly benefitted offenses. Defenders are having to think too much today to avoid infractions and it's cut down on their reaction time. The 2000 Ravens went 12-4 losing 3 straight games due to their offense not being able to score. From week 7 to week 9 their offense didn't score a single TD and managed only 15 points. Only 3 QB's in 2000 passed for over 4000 yards compared to 11 QB's last season. With all the player safety rules in place and offenses geared toward the pass it's very unlikely we'll ever see a couple of defenses dominate like the 85 Bears and 2000 Ravens.

Miami and Dan Marino showed what a passing attack can do to even greatest defense and add in all the player safety rules especially the rules to protect the QB and none of those defenses would have been as effective. In todays game an average QB isn't going to lead a team to a championship because QB's have to produce today especially in playoff games. The 2011 49ers who had a terrific defense was the closest we've seen since the 2000 Ravens to reaching the SB with a bus driver at QB. Alex Smith who was a game manager was unable to produce in the NFC title game despite a great defensive performance by SF. Eli was sacked 6 times and hit double digit times but was still able to make plays while Smith wasn't which is why he's in KC now.

Since Brad Johnson won a SB in 2003 every QB who's won a SB since is building a HOF resume except for Joe Flacco who may end up building one if he can win another 2 SB's. The Steelers had the #1 defense last season and didn't even make the playoffs. The #2, #3 and #4 defenses were all knocked off in postseason. The NFL is an offensive league and some of the top defensive teams have missed the playoffs the last few years. Pittsburgh was the last team to win a SB that had a #1 ranked defense and that defense was riddled with holes by Kurt Warner in the SB. It took a last ditch drive by the Steelers to pull that game out. For defenses to have a chance today they have to force turnovers and take the ball out of the hands of all these playmaking QB's.

2011 49ers defense nowhere near as dominant as the 2000 Ravens.



Keep trying.