World Cup

[Carson]

and there it is. Costa.

Feel like he’s scored more in two games than he did in his last season for my blues!!!!

 

[jterrell]

Once he gives the penalty he has no option but to send him off. It's not open to interpretation once he gives the handball it's a red card.
Not sure what handballs not being given has to do with this unless you're saying they were unlucky the ref didn't miss it?

that's not true at all.
it's a handball IF ruled intentional. that's a free-kick offense.
a red card if ALSO ruled it prevented a goal.

in this case it looked intentional and it certainly looked to save a goal. but both are judgment calls and you can split the difference.
i.e. rule a hand ball in the box but not that it saved a goal resulting in red.

i have seen similar handballs ruled merely spot fouls and the penalty kicks given a dozen times.

the ref was well within his rights but he did also judge it harshly as possible and did so 3 minutes into the match, basically ruining it.

again it is what it is. to the letter of the rule it is a red and he was judged fairly.
at the same time there are a dozen yellow cards per game not handed out and instead warnings administered.
this has been a very physical WC thus far and calling the toutnry's first red 3 mins in on this was a "harsh" call imho.

 

[jterrell]

Feel like he’s scored more in two games than he did in his last season for my blues!!!!

man... conte cost us diego, jose cost us lukaku.... sheesh man, what is with these coaches....
hoping sarri is not as egomaniacal but already know he is, lol.

 

[daschoo]

that's not true at all.
it's a handball IF ruled intentional. that's a free-kick offense.
a red card if ALSO ruled it prevented a goal.

in this case it looked intentional and it certainly looked to save a goal. but both are judgment calls and you can split the difference.
i.e. rule a hand ball in the box but not that it saved a goal resulting in red.

i have seen similar handballs ruled merely spot fouls and the penalty kicks given a dozen times.

the ref was well within his rights but he did also judge it harshly as possible and did so 3 minutes into the match, basically ruining it.

again it is what it is. to the letter of the rule it is a red and he was judged fairly.
at the same time there are a dozen yellow cards per game not handed out and instead warnings administered.
this has been a very physical WC thus far and calling the toutnry's first red 3 mins in on this was a "harsh" call imho.

Yeah it's a judgement call to the extent he has a choice if he doesn't think it's going in.
If that's your argument we'll just need to agree to disagree

 

[Flamma]

have no idea why iran is playing this way given they very likely don't advance with a tie.
you'd think they were up 2-0 now.
spain has 3 goals to it's credit and with a win over morocco move along easily. 1w 0l -2d and high goals scored.
iran would be 1-0-1 and playing portugal for a spot ... with only 1 goal scored.

They'd pretty much be playing to beat Portugal in the final match. Also keep in mind that if they tie Spain, that gives Spain 2 points and Iran 4. One more tie for Spain and Iran is in, win or lose against Portugal.

 

[Flamma]

I don't think Spain is going to score. There is no space and Iran fouls as soon as anyone breaks free. They are clearly playing for a 0-0 tie..........which is why I hate this round of the tourney. There should be be no reward for this kind of play.

It doesn't really bother me in the group stage. Teams are trying to accumulate points to advance. It aggravates me a little in the knockout stage because they are clearly playing for the shootout in order to win there.

Back in 1990 Italy, Argentina, Germany, and England were the final 4 I believe. Italy was the better team, Argentina won in penalty kicks. Then in the world cup finals they almost pulled it off against West Germany. They went into a complete shell.

 

[jterrell]

They'd pretty much be playing to beat Portugal in the final match. Also keep in mind that if they tie Spain, that gives Spain 2 points and Iran 4. One more tie for Spain and Iran is in, win or lose against Portugal.

Obviously Diego ended any drama but I was saying why would you play to tie knowing you are then facing Portugal and Spain faces an already ousted Morocco.
4 points wouldn't get you in. Both Spain and Portugal would have more goals scored so they'd have to beat Portugal or hope for miracle win by ousted Morocco.
Even a tie with Portugal would then not get them in unless it was really high scoring and Portugal beat Morocco by 1-0.
Strat wise it seemed very poor to me.
You get one shot every 4 years, go out and play your best game imho.

Doesn't matter now, Portugal and Spain were class of the group and will get through.

 

[jterrell]

It doesn't really bother me in the group stage. Teams are trying to accumulate points to advance. It aggravates me a little in the knockout stage because they are clearly playing for the shootout in order to win there.

Back in 1990 Italy, Argentina, Germany, and England were the final 4 I believe. Italy was the better team, Argentina won in penalty kicks. Then in the world cup finals they almost pulled it off against West Germany. They went into a complete shell.

aww the 3 point world cup... was in italy iirc. bored everyone to rules changes that made iwns worth 3 points.
i was in high school then and playing "soccer" for a youth club team santos (in dallas not actually in mexico).

 

[Flamma]

Obviously Diego ended any drama but I was saying why would you play to tie knowing you are then facing Portugal and Spain faces an already ousted Morocco.
4 points wouldn't get you in. Both Spain and Portugal would have more goals scored so they'd have to beat Portugal or hope for miracle win by ousted Morocco.
Even a tie with Portugal would then not get them in unless it was really high scoring and Portugal beat Morocco by 1-0.
Strat wise it seemed very poor to me.
You get one shot every 4 years, go out and play your best game imho.

Doesn't matter now, Portugal and Spain were class of the group and will get through.

They'd have to hope for a tie by ousted Morocco. Iran gets in with 4 points if Morocco ties Spain. Not completely impossible.

 

[joseephuss]

They'd have to hope for a tie by ousted Morocco. Iran gets in with 4 points if Morocco ties Spain. Not completely impossible.

How so? If Iran ties Portugal that would put Iran at 4 points and Portugal at 5 points. If Morocco ties Spain that would put Morocco at 1 point and Spain at 5 points.

Iran has to win to get in or they have to tie and hope Spain loses by at least 2 goals to overcome the goal differential lead Spain has currently.

 

[The Fonz]

Uruguay performance was not that impressive.

 

[Pessimist_cowboy]

They'd have to hope for a tie by ousted Morocco. Iran gets in with 4 points if Morocco ties Spain. Not completely impossible.

You’re mistaken my friend. Portugal and Spain would both have 5 points with ties. Iran would only have 4.

 

[Carson]

man... conte cost us diego, jose cost us lukaku.... sheesh man, what is with these coaches....
hoping sarri is not as egomaniacal but already know he is, lol.

Agreed! Don’t forget about Mourinho saying Kevin De Bruyne wasn’t good enough either!!

Hopefully we get some talent. Looks like Hazard will not return if we don’t get better!

 

[Flamma]

How so? If Iran ties Portugal that would put Iran at 4 points and Portugal at 5 points. If Morocco ties Spain that would put Morocco at 1 point and Spain at 5 points.

Iran has to win to get in or they have to tie and hope Spain loses by at least 2 goals to overcome the goal differential lead Spain has currently.

My previous conversation was as to why Iran was playing for a tie against Spain. Pretend Iran just tied Spain and read my post again.

 

[csirl]

They'd have to hope for a tie by ousted Morocco. Iran gets in with 4 points if Morocco ties Spain. Not completely impossible.

I agree. Teams often take a tactical view in the group stages. For weaker teams the tactic often used is to try not to be eliminated before the final group match. They will often play for a 0-0 tie in the first 2 matches. They then hope results go their way in the 3rd games. I think coaches have worked out the probabilities and concluded this. Strange things and strange results can happen in 3rd games e.g.

- teams not bothering because they've already qualified.
- teams looking at likely opponents in round 2.
- impact of nerves/pressure.

Also, coaches know what way the other games are going. Often things can crystalise mid match which can mean a team or teams taking the foot off the gas which benefits weaker teams seeking a win.

Someone mentioned Italia 90. In the group stages Egypt played 11 in the box almost on the goal line for the first 2 games - no interest in winning just hoping to be in the mix for the final game.

Same group - Ireland and Netherlands we're playing an exciting 3rd match. Then results crystalised elsewhere so both teams simply ran out the clock passing the ball around slowly as a tie was enough for both.

 

[Flamma]

I agree. Teams often take a tactical view in the group stages. For weaker teams the tactic often used is to try not to be eliminated before the final group match. They will often play for a 0-0 tie in the first 2 matches. They then hope results go their way in the 3rd games. I think coaches have worked out the probabilities and concluded this. Strange things and strange results can happen in 3rd games e.g.

- teams not bothering because they've already qualified.
- teams looking at likely opponents in round 2.
- impact of nerves/pressure.

Also, coaches know what way the other games are going. Often things can crystalise mid match which can mean a team or teams taking the foot off the gas which benefits weaker teams seeking a win.

Someone mentioned Italia 90. In the group stages Egypt played 11 in the box almost on the goal line for the first 2 games - no interest in winning just hoping to be in the mix for the final game.

Same group - Ireland and Netherlands we're playing an exciting 3rd match. Then results crystalised elsewhere so both teams simply ran out the clock passing the ball around slowly as a tie was enough for both.

Right. Which is why they play the 3rd match at the same time within the groups. But even still, sometimes games can have obvious endings by halftime. It would have suited Iran just fine to tie Spain. They have 4 points, Spain 2. That gives them two chances to advance. A win against Portugal or a tie in the Spain game.

BTW, that goal by Spain wasn't counted as an own goal? It looked like the Iranian player kicked it into the shin of his own player sending it into the net.

 

[9darter]

Obviously Diego ended any drama but I was saying why would you play to tie knowing you are then facing Portugal and Spain faces an already ousted Morocco.

Because a tie would have set them up to win the group beating Portugal in their final game. Not exactly advanced math.

 

[CATCH17]

man... conte cost us diego, jose cost us lukaku.... sheesh man, what is with these coaches....
hoping sarri is not as egomaniacal but already know he is, lol.

Oh there is nothing better then watching De Bruyne, Salah, and Lukaku play well as a Chelsea fan

 

[joseephuss]

Oh there is nothing better then watching De Bruyne, Salah, and Lukaku play well as a Chelsea fan

Lukaku only scored 16 times in the EPL last season and I believe only 1 of those was against a top 6 team. Over the last few seasons, he rarely scores against the top 6 teams in the EPL. He is good, but he isn't great.

 

[jterrell]

Agreed! Don’t forget about Mourinho saying Kevin De Bruyne wasn’t good enough either!!

Hopefully we get some talent. Looks like Hazard will not return if we don’t get better!

can you imagine de bruyne and hazard at wing with lukaku at the 9? lord....
4-3-3 with kante as the DM/heartbeat....
i'm gonna go cry now.