World War II and The Aftermath

[terra]

My wife and I visited Pearl Harbor three years ago. It is an amazing place. What surprised me was the amount of Japanese that were there. I almost felt like they wouldn't want to be associated with it, but they were there and they were respectful.

The Japanese are plain strange
They are very respectful at Pearl Harbor; I visited there on the 50th anniversary and the government sent a high ranking delegation in respect; as were all the Japanese tourists
YET that same Government has never admitted to many of the crimes Japan committed - to this day they downplay the Rape of Nanking; refuse to truly admit the atrocity of the Korean Comfort Women; and the official school textbooks gloss over Japan's overall responsibility for everything
They harp on the Atomic Bombs but refuse to admit they started it all

 

[CouchCoach]

We will never know the truth about what FDR knew and when he knew it but had that event not taken place, who knows how history looks today.

There is a HBO doc, “The Holocaust and the US”, that is the best view of the times and resistance FDR was facing and the unrelenting pressure he was under.

FDR called the attack on Pearl an act that will live in infamy forever but I look at that as the act that saved the free world.

The ***** had built the war machine with alarming speed and effectiveness. How much more time would it have taken them to reach invincible and Stalin reversed his position again with them? Then it would have been game over.

 

[terra]

We will never know the truth about what FDR knew and when he knew it but had that event not taken place, who knows how history looks today.

There is a HBO doc, “The Holocaust and the US”, that is the best view of the times and resistance FDR was facing and the unrelenting pressure he was under.

FDR called the attack on Pearl an act that will live in infamy forever but I look at that as the act that saved the free world.

The ***** had built the war machine with alarming speed and effectiveness. How much more time would it have taken them to reach invincible and Stalin reversed his position again with them? Then it would have been game over.

One reason no one in power really thought that Pearl Harbor would be attacked was how risky it was; the IJN destroyers had fuel barrels on their sterns instead of depth charges; they barely made it back. The IJN never figured out underway refueling like we had; and that was one of their major weaknesses. Also Pearl Harbor was thought to be very well defended; and remember at the time of that Attack the power of Carrier Strike Forces had not yet been truly proven. After all, Taranto was done to the Italians....

The more you look at Pearl Harbor, the more you shake your head at just how lucky the Japanese were and how fat dumb and happy we were.
Yammoto basically drew to an inside straight and pulled if off. Not his fault his idiot government screwed up in sending the warning in time.

 

[Creeper]

Japan made a huge miscalculation in deciding to attack the US. The plan was solid but their judgement was clouded by their perception of Americans, which was that we were close relatives of apes. Never underestimate your enemy.

In the meantime, the greatest generation was the generation of my parents who had to fight the war at home and abroad. My dad fought in Saipan and until he died he hated going to the beach because the sand reminded him of his days on that island. And like many women in America at the time, my mom joined the volunteer nurses to help here at home. Thanks to the people of that generation we have never had to endure what they did.

 

[Runwildboys]

One reason no one in power really thought that Pearl Harbor would be attacked was how risky it was; the IJN destroyers had fuel barrels on their sterns instead of depth charges; they barely made it back. The IJN never figured out underway refueling like we had; and that was one of their major weaknesses. Also Pearl Harbor was thought to be very well defended; and remember at the time of that Attack the power of Carrier Strike Forces had not yet been truly proven. After all, Taranto was done to the Italians....

The more you look at Pearl Harbor, the more you shake your head at just how lucky the Japanese were and how fat dumb and happy we were.
Yammoto basically drew to an inside straight and pulled if off. Not his fault his idiot government screwed up in sending the warning in time.

I imagine nobody ever expected them to plan on not flying back.

 

[Praxit]

We will never know the truth about what FDR knew and when he knew it but had that event not taken place, who knows how history looks today.

There is a HBO doc, “The Holocaust and the US”, that is the best view of the times and resistance FDR was facing and the unrelenting pressure he was under.

FDR called the attack on Pearl an act that will live in infamy forever but I look at that as the act that saved the free world.

The ***** had built the war machine with alarming speed and effectiveness. How much more time would it have taken them to reach invincible and Stalin reversed his position again with them? Then it would have been game over.

..interesting take, CC. Had Stalin reversed its position. It would have been a MORE bloody war, longer too. Gratefully, it turned out the way it did.

Good thing today, a big WAR wont last to long..lol..

 

[VaqueroTD]

 

[triplets_93]

World War II veteran, 102, revisits Pearl Harbor on anniversary of Japan's attack
Two women from the 'Rosie the Riveters' movement also traveled to Hawaii

https://www.foxnews.com/us/watch-wo...visits-pearl-harbor-anniversary-japans-attack

 

[terra]

..interesting take, CC. Had Stalin reversed its position. It would have been a MORE bloody war, longer too. Gratefully, it turned out the way it did.

Good thing today, a big WAR wont last to long..lol..

Nukes would have been used on Germany instead.
Japanese really had no choice; with the perverted Bushido Code ruling their culture. The fact that they started it all by attacking China; committing uncounted to this day atrocities; and expected no one to really care was the truly huge mistake. We had always been supportive of China and naturally we started putting sanctions on Japan. Who had virtually no natural resources and relied upon the US for a lot of it. So they had a choice; which to them was no choice at all: back down or start a war.

 

[terra]

World War II veteran, 102, revisits Pearl Harbor on anniversary of Japan's attack
Two women from the 'Rosie the Riveters' movement also traveled to Hawaii

https://www.foxnews.com/us/watch-wo...visits-pearl-harbor-anniversary-japans-attack

Rosie the Riveter is another facet of the war that has never gotten its due. You would have thought Hollywood would be all over that in this day and age but nada.

 

[terra]

Amazingly enough TORA TORA TORA was actually decently accurate as to how it all happened.

 

[terra]

One thing that also has not been given enough play is the code breakers; not so much what they were doing but as regards how what they did was used and not used.
Not telling the overseas commanders more (MacArthur, Kimmel and Short) was typical of the time; everyone was so paranoid about the Japanese finding out we had broken some of their important codes.
THAT mentality ended up costing us heavily; the higher ups FORGOT that if you do not use the information you have gotten that way WHAT IS THE POINT of getting it at all?

 

[Reverend Conehead]

Japan made a huge miscalculation in deciding to attack the US. The plan was solid but their judgement was clouded by their perception of Americans, which was that we were close relatives of apes. Never underestimate your enemy.

In the meantime, the greatest generation was the generation of my parents who had to fight the war at home and abroad. My dad fought in Saipan and until he died he hated going to the beach because the sand reminded him of his days on that island. And like many women in America at the time, my mom joined the volunteer nurses to help here at home. Thanks to the people of that generation we have never had to endure what they did.

Yeah, Japan knew about the widespread anti-war sentiment in the US, but they didn't realize just how quickly that would go out the window if America were attacked. Americans wanted to stay out of the war, and President Roosevelt knew he would lose the next election if he simply got us into the war. So you can see why the Japanese leadership thought Americans lacked the stomach for a fight. But, man, were they ever wrong. As soon as Japan attacked us, that anti-war feeling evaporated. Americans were furious and wanted to fight back and make them sorry they had ever touched us. And that's exactly what happened.

My dad was a kid at the time, but my uncle served in the war. He was an airplane mechanic in the Pacific.

 

[terra]

Yeah, Japan knew about the widespread anti-war sentiment in the US, but they didn't realize just how quickly that would go out the window if America were attacked. Americans wanted to stay out of the war, and President Roosevelt knew he would lose the next election if he simply got us into the war. So you can see why the Japanese leadership thought Americans lacked the stomach for a fight. But, man, were they ever wrong. As soon as Japan attacked us, that anti-war feeling evaporated. Americans were furious and wanted to fight back and make them sorry they had ever touched us. And that's exactly what happened.

My dad was a kid at the time, but my uncle served in the war. He was an airplane mechanic in the Pacific.

Its interesting how everyone thought we were weak. Japan, Germany, Soviet Union, even England.
Lots of stupid people running countries at that time.

The anti war sentiment was actually more nuanced than that: most people did not believe we should get involved in Europe; we had just done that 20 years earlier and it had accomplished nothing except make sure there would be another war. Which actually was a reasonable point of view if one left out Hitler.
Japan was another story; many did not take them seriously which was pretty dumb; but once again one must remember that most Americans were fairly ignorant of Asia compared to Europe.

 

[JohnnyTheFox]

Least to me, Japan was very stupid for starting a war anyway. A small island with limited resources, what did they think they were going to take over the whole world.

 

[Rockport]

The Japanese are plain strange
They are very respectful at Pearl Harbor; I visited there on the 50th anniversary and the government sent a high ranking delegation in respect; as were all the Japanese tourists
YET that same Government has never admitted to many of the crimes Japan committed - to this day they downplay the Rape of Nanking; refuse to truly admit the atrocity of the Korean Comfort Women; and the official school textbooks gloss over Japan's overall responsibility for everything
They harp on the Atomic Bombs but refuse to admit they started it all

They don’t harp about the atomic bombs. They are against nuclear weapons and for god reason. I’ve lived in Japan for several 6 years and visited Hiroshima many times. The Peace Memorial is a must see. A very humbling experience.

 

[Reverend Conehead]

Its interesting how everyone thought we were weak. Japan, Germany, Soviet Union, even England.
Lots of stupid people running countries at that time.

The anti war sentiment was actually more nuanced than that: most people did not believe we should get involved in Europe; we had just done that 20 years earlier and it had accomplished nothing except make sure there would be another war. Which actually was a reasonable point of view if one left out Hitler.
Japan was another story; many did not take them seriously which was pretty dumb; but once again one must remember that most Americans were fairly ignorant of Asia compared to Europe.

Yes, America rightfully felt that Great Britain had sucked us into World War I, then known as The Great War. Britain had flown the American flag without our permission on her ships in order to avoid German U-boats. When Germany figured out what they were doing, they then decided to fire on any ship, even ones flying the American flag. By doing that, Britain put American citizens traveling the high seas in danger, and brought us closer to war.

Then after that war, there was strong sentiment not to get dragged into another war, and one can certainly understand why. But Japan attacked us, and their ally, Hitler, foolishly declared war on the United States. If he hadn't, there was still some chance that America's involvement may have been against Japan only.

 

[terra]

They don’t harp about the atomic bombs. They are against nuclear weapons and for god reason. I’ve lived in Japan for several 6 years and visited Hiroshima many times. The Peace Memorial is a must see. A very humbling experience.

People see what they want to see. Clearly you do not want to see.
I am betting you never have looked at the official japanese government positions on those subjects.

 

[terra]

Yes, America rightfully felt that Great Britain had sucked us into World War I, then known as The Great War. Britain had flown the American flag without our permission on her ships in order to avoid German U-boats. When Germany figured out what they were doing, they then decided to fire on any ship, even ones flying the American flag. By doing that, Britain put American citizens traveling the high seas in danger, and brought us closer to war.

Then after that war, there was strong sentiment not to get dragged into another war, and one can certainly understand why. But Japan attacked us, and their ally, Hitler, foolishly declared war on the United States. If he hadn't, there was still some chance that America's involvement may have been against Japan only.

The British tried a lot of things to get us into WW1; the whole Zimmerman thing was exposed as a British plant after the war. And the media here was very much on Britain's side and ignored the other side (gee how things have NOT changed). Germany was in a fight for survival and the UBoats were one of the few weapons they had to fight the British blockade as their High Seas Fleet simply was not powerful enough to beat the Royal Navy.

 

[Rockport]

People see what they want to see. Clearly you do not want to see.
I am betting you never have looked at the official japanese government positions on those subjects.

Yeah well I lived there for 6 years and married a Japanese woman.