Would you consider this band "talented"?

[DoctorChicken]

Warning - this is a long, rambly post and I am slightly intoxicated.

#firstworldproblems I'm in an argument with someone from another forum about this right now.

I've always loved British alt-rock band Muse, and have long considered them my favorite band. Understandably in this forum's "song of the day" thread, I've posted quite a few Muse songs recently considering they've just released a new album.

Well a certain poster and I have been at war the past, say, 2 months off and on. He doesn't like Muse, in fact, no one there does, and I've come up with several reason why I like Muse. Frontman Matthew Bellamy has an absurd vocal range, is a good guitar player and a gifted piano player, Bassist Christopher Wolstenholme is one of the best bassists of the 21st century, and drummer Dominic Howard is... better than average. They write crazy songs and make nice lyrics, and I just think they're an interesting little band.

But this dude just isn't making sense. I used to like this guy, but one day he slammed Muse and I asked him why he said whatever he said and it's all gone downhill from there. I've posted links and whatnot and tried to explain why I like Muse, and he says they're "overdramatic" and they "suck". He got to the point where today he literally said the words "I don't think Muse is talented". I asked why, said they're a great live band and whatnot, and he said that "Didn't you hear me son? I.. DON'T...BELIEVE...MUSE..HAS...ANY...TALENT"

So I've been talking to this dude for like 2 hours now and he says Muse has no talent, and no video, article or source will change that. It's "his opinion".

Now, I fully understand opinion based things. There are people in this world (aka weirdos) who simply don't like Muse. So I'm asking you this - do you think this band is talented? Not whether you like them or not, but simply if they have even a shred of talent.

(apperently this doesn't take talent)

 

[JDSmith]

Never heard of them, listening to Futurism now... hated it.

Next up Hysteria... ouch.

The lead singer might have a great range, I'll take your word for it, but he sounds horrible IMO. I absolutely hate his singing. The rest of the band may or may not be talented, to me it doesn't really matter if the singer isn't good unless they are distinct and pleasing. So I could see how someone might say the band has no talent if they just listened to the two songs you played here. Not because the band doesn't have talent, but because if you are not someone who plays an instrument you might not recognize exactly how much talent goes into a performance. It's basically the dunning kruger effect, and I know because I'm guilty of it.

I have no idea at all how hard it is to play an instrument, or sing for that matter, so great playing/vocal gymnastics wouldn't wow me - I only respond to whether or not I like the way it sounds. It might be simple or complex, it might require minimal talent or godlike talent, and I wouldn't know the difference since I'm not musically inclined. So I can only judge something by how it sounds - pleasing or not.

In this case I hear a lot of sound, essentially a wall of noise, with some bad singing on top of it. So while it may require amazing levels of talent to produce that acoustic deluge, I wouldn't know. I do know that I don't like it at all.

Edit: My daughter, who is much more musical than I am, likes the band. I played the two songs for her and she likes the singer and said she's surprised that I don't like him.

 

[DoctorChicken]

Never heard of them, listening to Futurism now... hated it.

Next up Hysteria... ouch.

The lead singer might have a great range, I'll take your word for it, but he sounds horrible IMO. I absolutely hate his singing. The rest of the band may or may not be talented, to me it doesn't really matter if the singer isn't good unless they are distinct and pleasing. So I could see how someone might say the band has no talent if they just listened to the two songs you played here. Not because the band doesn't have talent, but because if you are not someone who plays an instrument you might not recognize exactly how much talent goes into a performance. It's basically the dunning kruger effect, and I know because I'm guilty of it.

I have no idea at all how hard it is to play an instrument, or sing for that matter, so great playing/vocal gymnastics wouldn't wow me - I only respond to whether or not I like the way it sounds. It might be simple or complex, it might require minimal talent or godlike talent, and I wouldn't know the difference since I'm not musically inclined. So I can only judge something by how it sounds - pleasing or not.

In this case I hear a lot of sound, essentially a wall of noise, with some bad singing on top of it. So while it may require amazing levels of talent to produce that acoustic deluge, I wouldn't know. I do know that I don't like it at all.

Edit: My daughter, who is much more musical than I am, likes the band. I played the two songs for her and she likes the singer and said she's surprised that I don't like him.

Yeah, a lot of people cannot stand his voice. He sings with 4 octaves, which is absolutely massive range, and has a super high falsetto.

But you said what I hoped people would say, that you don't like it. This dude is literally saying that this band has zero musical talent.

 

[JDSmith]

Yeah, a lot of people cannot stand his voice. He sings with 4 octaves, which is absolutely massive range, and has a super high falsetto.

But you said what I hoped people would say, that you don't like it. This dude is literally saying that this band has zero musical talent.

Essentially I'm not qualified to judge musical talent. Unless it's someone like Jason Becker on the guitar, I have a small part of my brain that assumes I could just make that kind of noise - which would make me think the people aren't talented. But then the rational part of my mind reminds me that I've never even held a guitar or bass or whatever the hell that guy is playing, and whatever he's doing is world's beyond what I could accomplish. Maybe the person you are arguing with doesn't have that rational part of his brain and simply assumes that if a sound is unpleasant to him it must not require talent to make it.

 

[Roadtrip635]

This guy is just pushing your buttons, they obviously have talent. I listened to those clips and they were alright, just not my taste, that's a matter of personal preferences, not of talent. That guy has made up his mind and you're not gonna change it, you might as well try to force a Philly fan to admit that the Cowboys are America's Team.

 

[DoctorChicken]

I'll throw in another video for sentimental value. This is the first concert I ever went to.

 

[JohnnyTheFox]

From what I heard I didn't hear anything that hasn't been done decades ago and 10x better.

 

[DoctorChicken]

From what I heard I didn't hear anything that hasn't been done decades ago and 10x better.

Fair enough, but are they talented?

 

[The Ominous]

Muse is awesome and might be the most popular live band at the moment. I don't like many of their songs but when they want to rock they are amazing.

 

[The Ominous]

Lol you guys are telling me this guy isn't a beast on guitar? Plus a master on piano AND can sing. Matthew Bellamy is one of the greatest musicians of all time.

 

[JohnnyTheFox]

Lol you guys are telling me this guy isn't a beast on guitar? Plus a master on piano AND can sing. Matthew Bellamy is one of the greatest musicians of all time.

Decent yes......
A beast? Not even close.
I watched every solo and could not find one thing that stood out and put him among the greats. It was basically some stock tapping, effects laden patterns{not that difficult sounding either}and as I said earlier stuff that has been done before by much better players.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Muse is awesome and might be the most popular live band at the moment.

That is hard for me to believe.

 

[JDSmith]

He sings with 4 octaves, which is absolutely massive range, and has a super high falsetto.

Are you sure that 4 octaves is an impressive range? If his range is 4 octaves I don't believe that's huge. My daughter sings and isn't renowned for her range and I asked her what her range was and she said it was likely 4 or so. I know that there are people out there with a reported 7 octave range.

Maybe you got the number wrong, but if it really is 4 that's fairly mundane for someone who's a professional. The one caveat is that my daughter sings classical and opera, so that's what I'm referencing, and it's possible that in pop music 4 is less ordinary.

 

[JDSmith]

That is hard for me to believe.

I think it's about the lights and stage production more than anything else. That, and ecstasy. Ecstasy probably helps.

 

[BoysFan4ever]

Aren't Rush or U2 considered the best live bands? Rush in particular..

I don't like Muse.

 

[YosemiteSam]

 

[YosemiteSam]

Aren't Rush or U2 considered the best live bands? Rush in particular..

I don't like Muse.

Rush just plain sucks.

 

[BoysFan4ever]

Rush just plain sucks.

I like Rush...some of their songs are way too long but they are great musicians.

 

[JDSmith]

he says they're "overdramatic" and they "suck". He got to the point where today he literally said the words "I don't think Muse is talented". I asked why, said they're a great live band and whatnot, and he said that "Didn't you hear me son? I.. DON'T...BELIEVE...MUSE..HAS...ANY...TALENT"

I think the problem starts when you combine drinking with arguing on the internet. I also think each of you is likely trying to top one another with hyperbole.

If the guy is such a phenomenal pianist you should post a better clip. As a person who doesn't play piano, the piece he played sounded like something I'd hear at a high school piano recital. It didn't jump out as something special.

The same with his guitar playing. It sounds good but fairly ordinary.

Amazing talent jumps out at you. Without having ever picked up a guitar, I can watch this and think,'I couldn't do that if I practiced a thousand years.'



The other day I was watching a woman sing and play the harp. I didn't like it at all, I hate her singing voice, but I could watch her play and sing and realize how ridiculously difficult it must be. Like singing while playing a guitar solo. So I could recognize her talent without liking her performance.

So to say these guys are such amazing talents you have to back it up with something truly special. Otherwise you are seriously overstating their ability, and the person with whom you are arguing will likely understate it with equal fervor.

I'd suggest you just stop trying to convince people of something that is purely subjective. You like Muse, but you'll never convince someone else that they have to like them as well.

 

[YosemiteSam]

I like Rush...some of their songs are way too long but they are great musicians.

Are you from the D/FW area? I grew up there and the radio station 97.1 KEGL The Eagle got on a kick where every 3rd song was Rush back in I believe the late 90s or early 2000s. Basically, they ruined Rush for me. I heard them so much that I grew so sick of hearing them and specifically Geddy Lee's voice. Now, I immediately change the station if I hear them come on. (I actually quit listening to the Eagle because of it which was the only real rock station in the area which really sucked)

It's basically like listening to Stairway to Heaven. I absolutely love Led Zeppelin, but if Stairway comes on. I change the station. The last time I listened to Stairway to Heaven all the way through is when Stevie Nicks performed it at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. The only difference is, it's every song with Rush. Not just one.