I honestly don't get the Zeke and Amari hate

[G2]

right same OL same carries

zeke 12-48 long 24

ollard 11-38 long 11

More burst =less yards, less YPC, and not having the longest run..

I like pollard solid backup and cage of pace back , hes no starter and zeks sufferings from bad team in a bad year..the fumbles were unacceptable but the decline is being far over blown..pollards not better and may never be..

I love Pollard as a change of pace guy. I think if we weren't down to our third set of tackles both would be better. Plus, Dalton isn't threatening a defense. Plus, Elliott has been playing injured.

 

[G2]

Pollard is what he is.......... a situational back. He's not bad in that roll. But the fact Elliott we are sitting here wondering why Elliott doesn't seem to be doing all that much better than Pollard is telling.

Well that's not accurate, "not much better" is your twist. And there are plenty of factors that are in play with the decline of our run game. As a whole. But some fans aren't interested in factors that have actually occured. They'd rather put their spin on it. I have no desire to go back and forth with you as you continue to refuse to see any other viewpoint. Have a good day.

 

[Sydla]

One because we don't accept your definition of why a player is being paid.. Unless your name is Jerry Jones you don't get to make that call. Second because those of us who understand how badly the deck has been stacked against Zeke the last two years get. Here is the list of problems he is having to overcome .

1) Subpar line play. I don't care what some statnerd site says, if you are watching these games and coming away thinking that our line is playing well then you need to adjust your TV set. Both backs have had at least 5 games of under 4 yards per carry.. One (our explosive back) has had 6 games of 3.5 yards per carry or less. Our line stinks. End of story.
2) The chumps at QB. Dalton has had a couple of decent game but overall with him or the other two stooges at QB defenses have not had to honor our passing attack at all. I have seen people repeatedly post that teams are not putting extra men in the box against us. They probably don't have to as badly as some of our linemen have been getting beat but some dude posted last week that Zeke only had 3 carries all game against an 8 man box.. That prompted me to go rewatch the game and count defenders in the box for myself. There were at least 8 in the box on no less than 9 of Zeke's 18 carries. I froze each carry at the snap and counted for myself. I honestly cannot figure out what game these "experts" were watching.
3) Kellen Moore.. we've talked about it most of the year.. His playcalling in the run game is atrocious. He has raised Zeke's carries out of shotgun from 12-15% most of his career to nearly 40% this year. Zeke aint no damn jitterbug scatback. He's a one cut downhill runner. Moore has essentially taken away his ability not only to have a better view of the line and the defense but he forces him to take the ball from a standing start. That is a colossal waste of 230 pounds worth of momentum and power.

And I have not even mentioned Covid, nagging injuries from the beating he is taking just to get 1-2 yards on many plays.. or the obvious fact that every DC he plays against spends 80 hours the week of the game figuring out how to stop him.

Pretty much everyone acknowledges that Zeke is having a down year. But some of us are willing to account for the circumstance under which he toils and cut the dude some slack. Now next year when everybody is back, with a somewhat normal offseason and training camp if he is still performing at this level.. It will be a very different conversation .. at least for me.

You don't accept it because it doesn't fit in your world view. What we pay Elliott is IMPORTANT to the overall team success/structure. You guys want to dismiss that reality because it is a major issue in the overall analysis of Elliott. Sure, if Elliott was making $500K this year, we'd likely be having a different conversation. But he's not. He needs to be better than he is. That's just reality. The fact that he needs a good OL, good QB play and a good OC is undermining your own point.

He was just a good RB last year too, he wasn't "elite". He wasn't a game breaker last year. He didn't look like the TB in 2016 that was a threat every time he touched the ball.

 

[kskboys]

right same OL same carries

zeke 12-48 long 24

ollard 11-38 long 11

More burst =less yards, less YPC, and not having the longest run..

I like pollard solid backup and cage of pace back , hes no starter and zeks sufferings from bad team in a bad year..the fumbles were unacceptable but the decline is being far over blown..pollards not better and may never be..

Good stuff.

What Zeke needs is to get in extremely good shape and stop the weird stuff and get back to being the grinder that he is. Basically, Zeke has a very good skillset, but not a dominant one. That's why when he's just slightly out of shape, he's just OK. His strength is his burst when he gets the ball, but the burst comes down a bit unless he's in tiptop shape.

 

[jjktkk]

Prove that Elliott and Cooper don't make a difference. It's such an idiotic statement. Whether you hate Zeke or Coop or you think you're the salary authority, doesn't make a single difference. Both clearly make a difference on the field. Maybe they don't meet some fan's expectations, but to suggest they don't is just wrong and lazy.

Idiotic and lazy huh? WTH are you talking about? I've believe I've watched every Cowboy's game this season and Zeke clearly isn't helping the team with his fumbling issues. Zeke is an elite rb, and is paid like an elite rb, but his horrible fumbling problems is obviously not matching his elite status He does get some reprieve because of the Cowboy's O-Line problems, but Zeke's horrible fumbling problem is no excuse. Good grief, Zeke leads all NFL RBs in fumbles so far this season. Elite RBs shouldn't have fumbling issues. Elliot was even benched in the Cardinals game for his fumbles. His replacement in that Cardinal's game, Tony Pollard, outplayed Zeke, and has all season, regardless of the Cowboy's O-Line woes. So, If you're not too lazy, maybe read these below links and educate yourself.

Ezekiel Elliott's fumbles make case Cowboys gave a big contract to the wrong star | Sporting News

Cowboys' Ezekiel Elliott: No one way to fix fumbling problems (nfl.com)

Elliott blames fumbles for Cowboys loss: ‘I need to figure ... (usatoday.com)

Jerry Jones: Ezekiel Elliott is our best football player - ProFootballTalk (nbcsports.com)

 

[G2]

Pollard is a fine #2 type RB, but a mediocre starter type. That's what you're trying to say, and it seems obvious to me.

Pollard was drafted as a reserve and for his unique skillset in returns. We've seen an improvement in his returns here and there. I like having both, they're different runners. But neither will look "good enough" until you improve the entire offensive system. A QB that keeps the defense honest and can beat you deep or with his legs, a stout offensive line that can effectively pass black and run block and a scheme that compliments the players accordingly. Our run game is beat up.

 

[kskboys]

You don't accept it because it doesn't fit in your world view. What we pay Elliott is IMPORTANT to the overall team success/structure. You guys want to dismiss that reality because it is a major issue in the overall analysis of Elliott. Sure, if Elliott was making $500K this year, we'd likely be having a different conversation. But he's not. He needs to be better than he is. That's just reality. The fact that he needs a good OL, good QB play and a good OC is undermining your own point.

He was just a good RB last year too, he wasn't "elite". He wasn't a game breaker last year. He didn't look like the TB in 2016 that was a threat every time he touched the ball.

I will never comprehend why fans don't get this. The agenda driven stuff about "You just don't want players to make money" is simply untrue. I seriously doubt whether any fan of the NFL cares about the personal part of any player's salary. It's only relevant as it pertains to the salary cap. And since overpaying players leads to early playoff exits and mediocrity, of course we're concerned about it.

 

[GMO415]

$90 million for a guy that does a FB dive on 3/4 runs? He's horrible.

 

[G2]

Idiotic and lazy huh? WTH are you talking about? I've believe I've watched every Cowboy's game this season and Zeke clearly isn't helping the team with his fumbling issues. Zeke is an elite rb, and is paid like an elite rb, but his horrible fumbling problems is obviously not matching his elite status He does get some reprieve because of the Cowboy's O-Line problems, but Zeke's horrible fumbling problem is no excuse. Good grief, Zeke leads all NFL RBs in fumbles so far this season. Elite RBs shouldn't have fumbling issues. Elliot was even benched in the Cardinals game for his fumbles. His replacement in that Cardinal's game, Tony Pollard, outplayed Zeke, and has all season, regardless of the Cowboy's O-Line woes. So, If you're not too lazy, maybe read these below links and educate yourself.

Ezekiel Elliott's fumbles make case Cowboys gave a big contract to the wrong star | Sporting News

Cowboys' Ezekiel Elliott: No one way to fix fumbling problems (nfl.com)

Elliott blames fumbles for Cowboys loss: ‘I need to figure ... (usatoday.com)

Jerry Jones: Ezekiel Elliott is our best football player - ProFootballTalk (nbcsports.com)

Pollard has outplayed Zeke?

lmao......Umm no. We're done. You win. Lol.

 

[Sydla]

I will never comprehend why fans don't get this. The agenda driven stuff about "You just don't want players to make money" is simply untrue. I seriously doubt whether any fan of the NFL cares about the personal part of any player's salary. It's only relevant as it pertains to the salary cap. And since overpaying players leads to early playoff exits and mediocrity, of course we're concerned about it.

Exactly. I don't care that guys get paid whatever they get paid. I do care about cap implications that arise because we pay for guys and don't get the requisite production we should from that investment.

Hence why I have issues with Elliott and us paying him what we did. He plays a position that is too reliant on other factors around him. I mean even his defenders are saying, "well he doesn't have a good OL, his QBs stink, the OC isn't using him right..........." They are simply making the case as to why investing a ton of money into Elliott is looking like a mistake. And this isn't even about Elliott, I would think this about any TB. I am just against investing that kind of money into a position that is heavily reliant on outside forces for him to be really effective.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

This is actually a perfect opportunity for the ignore feature. Many have with d-aria and there is likely no end to the insanity and hatred.

I already know @aria is a clown and feeds off attention. I'm giving him what he wants but soon its gonna come to an end and he only gonna have Ronnie to talk to.

 

[G2]

I will never comprehend why fans don't get this. The agenda driven stuff about "You just don't want players to make money" is simply untrue. I seriously doubt whether any fan of the NFL cares about the personal part of any player's salary. It's only relevant as it pertains to the salary cap. And since overpaying players leads to early playoff exits and mediocrity, of course we're concerned about it.

How much a player makes to a fan is conjecture. But to complain about what Elliott makes to the degree some do and never once bring up players like Jaylon Smith or Crawford is what I find odd with regard to salary vs. performance. Crawford has actually had games with ZERO statistics.

 

[Sydla]

Well that's not accurate, "not much better" is your twist. And there are plenty of factors that are in play with the decline of our run game. As a whole. But some fans aren't interested in factors that have actually occured. They'd rather put their spin on it. I have no desire to go back and forth with you as you continue to refuse to see any other viewpoint. Have a good day.

Even if one concedes Elliott is the better player (which he is, obviously) the Cowboys aren't getting the corresponding level of production from Elliott compared to Pollard when you factor in playing time, cap hit, etc.

That's the point. You guys simply just want to bury your heads in the sand here on Elliott thinking he's some elite, game changing back being let down by everyone around him.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

Exactly. I don't care that guys get paid whatever they get paid. I do care about cap implications that arise because we pay for guys and don't get the requisite production we should from that investment.

Hence why I have issues with Elliott and us paying him what we did. He plays a position that is too reliant on other factors around him. I mean even his defenders are saying, "well he doesn't have a good OL, his QBs stink, the OC isn't using him right..........." They are simply making the case as to why investing a ton of money into Elliott is looking like a mistake. And this isn't even about Elliott, I would think this about any TB. I am just against investing that kind of money into a position that is heavily reliant on outside forces for him to be really effective.

It just depends on what that running back means to your franchise. Zeke means a lot to this team whether we like it or not. That's what Jerry was bidding against. He wasn't just bidding on the player. Same thing with Dak. He's bidding on more than just a quarterback. Its why Byron isn't here and why Jaylon and Lawrence are.

 

[TheMarathonContinues]

How much a player makes to a fan is conjecture. But to complain about what Elliott makes to the degree some do and never once bring up players like Jaylon Smith or Crawford is what I find odd with regard to salary vs. performance. Crawford has actually had games with ZERO statistics.

Exactly.

 

[G2]

Even if one concedes Elliott is the better player (which he is, obviously) the Cowboys aren't getting the corresponding level of production from Elliott compared to Pollard when you factor in playing time, cap hit, etc.

That's the point. You guys simply just want to bury your heads in the sand here on Elliott thinking he's some elite, game changing back being let down by everyone around him.

If you don't honestly know the answer to this than it's really not worth trying to explain or discuss. I mean no disrespect, but I'm not trying to change your mind. Last time, have a good day.

 

[Sydla]

It just depends on what that running back means to your franchise. Zeke means a lot to this team whether we like it or not. That's what Jerry was bidding against. He wasn't just bidding on the player. Same thing with Dak. He's bidding on more than just a quarterback. Its why Byron isn't here and why Jaylon and Lawrence are.

That's a nebulous argument - what Elliott means to the franchise.

His value to the franchise at this point making that kind of money is to be a game changing TB. A guy who is a threat every time he puts the ball in his hands. Do you honestly believe he's that kind of guy?

 

[jjktkk]

Pollard has outplayed Zeke?

lmao......Umm no. We're done. You win. Lol.

Felt like a preseason game.

 

[Sydla]

How much a player makes to a fan is conjecture. But to complain about what Elliott makes to the degree some do and never once bring up players like Jaylon Smith or Crawford is what I find odd with regard to salary vs. performance. Crawford has actually had games with ZERO statistics.

This is not exactly accurate because there have been TONS of threads/discussions on Smith and Crawford about how they aren't performing to their contracts and what poor signings they were. I mean in the offseason, there were multiple threads about how they should just cut Crawford to us his cap space to sign someone like Clowney, etc. Smith? He might get ripped more than Elliott does and has been largely called a bust resigning by Jones.

 

[G2]

Felt like a preseason game.

I tend to play down to my competition.